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Student Loan Cancellation is really UBI for parts of the population

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posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 11:28 AM
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I've said it before.
Actual Tuition is not that much.
The average community college tuition in the US is a little over 3 grand a year.
That's 12K for four years. The average median price of a new car in the US is 36K.

Don't get me wrong, higher learning needs to be reformed.
I don't think we do that by giving a "gift" to certain people and not others.

If you think about it, tuition is such a small portion of this debt. A large portion of the debt is
housing, food, and supplies. Those are all things people need, not just college students.
Those are things that many people have gone into debt for. By cancelling student debt you are basically
paying for living expenses on top of tuition for all those people...

I'm also not adverse to helping people. Young people shouldn't start out with crushing debt.
Maybe we should be more like parts of Europe, College is cheap but getting in is a lot more difficult..



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 11:39 AM
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a reply to: JAGStorm
When I get my fully paid loans back with interest, I guess we can talk



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 11:40 AM
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If there is student loan reimbursement, I'd like the 70k I paid back please. Heck I'll take it as a tax credit.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 11:41 AM
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Maybe stop shipping off all the jobs overseas still?



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 11:45 AM
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originally posted by: JAGStorm
I've said it before.
Actual Tuition is not that much.
The average community college tuition in the US is a little over 3 grand a year.
That's 12K for four years. The average median price of a new car in the US is 36K.

Don't get me wrong, higher learning needs to be reformed.
I don't think we do that by giving a "gift" to certain people and not others.

If you think about it, tuition is such a small portion of this debt. A large portion of the debt is
housing, food, and supplies. Those are all things people need, not just college students.
Those are things that many people have gone into debt for. By cancelling student debt you are basically
paying for living expenses on top of tuition for all those people...

I'm also not adverse to helping people. Young people shouldn't start out with crushing debt.
Maybe we should be more like parts of Europe, College is cheap but getting in is a lot more difficult..













The problem is the people who went to a $50,000 a year liberal arts college and are now working at Starbucks. I have no issue with partial forgiveness of student loans if it's for a marketable degree. I also support a tax credit for people who may have paid their off in the past say 6 to 8 years or so.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 11:49 AM
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originally posted by: Hypntick
If there is student loan reimbursement, I'd like the 70k I paid back please. Heck I'll take it as a tax credit.


Sorry if you wanted a refund you should of went with Gender Studies.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 12:07 PM
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a reply to: JAGStorm

Not only is it UBI but it's disproportionate UBI.

Only 1/3 of the US workforce have a 4 year+ degree and considering having a degree usually means higher wages and promotions this means the poorer working class is paying the bulk of the UBI for their boss's excess spending and debt.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 12:23 PM
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originally posted by: Hypntick
If there is student loan reimbursement, I'd like the 70k I paid back please. Heck I'll take it as a tax credit.


For reform there has to be a line drawn in the sand somewhere. I think a lot of people have issues with that.
That is going to mean some people that have already paid, (me included) are going to have to eat that and accept it.

I personally would be for an all paid higher education for people that qualify. Maybe we could even start out with
paid tuition for studies that are in dire need. Let's say we have a huge shortage of food scientists, those studies would covered. (similar to the K-12)



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 12:39 PM
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originally posted by: Hypntick
If there is student loan reimbursement, I'd like the 70k I paid back please. Heck I'll take it as a tax credit.


Exactly.

I've paid off about $80k in student loans. In fact, literally just zero'd out all my student loan debt this month making last payment. My wife had near $100k that she paid off.

I'd like to be reimbursed. I'd also like compensation for making life decisions based on personal responsibility instead of what made me feel good. I'd probably be in a different career or made other life choices if I knew my student loans weren't my responsibility.

The student loan problem isn't hard to fix. Government needs to get out of making student loans. With a true private market for student loans, every kid wouldn't be able to mortgage their future and schools would be forced to reduce tuition to more manageable amounts if they expect students to pay for it.

Lastly, they can pass a law that requires schools to hold like 10% of a student's debt so if the student defaults, the school is on the hook for it much like how banks are on the hook for defaulted mortgages



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 12:43 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated




I'd probably be in a different career or made other life choices if I knew my student loans weren't my responsibility.


That's the flip side. If they wipe out the debt, how will that affect the next generation of college students.
Some things require a little skin in the game. If you know there is no risk what is going to happen.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 12:45 PM
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I put my body on the line for mine.

Do I get my joint health back?



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: JAGStorm

I had to pay mine off.
Why should I pay for someone else?



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:01 PM
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originally posted by: ketsuko
I put my body on the line for mine.

Do I get my joint health back?


Exactly. A lot of us made sacrifices and decisions based on what we could afford and knowing that we were responsible for the debt incurred.

If anything, govt should make principal payments on student loan deductible, not interest to encourage people to payoff the loans sooner than later. Colleges need to be held responsible for their price inflation. Any students loans forgiven should be deducted directly from any federal aide a college / unviersity receives.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:11 PM
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a reply to: JAGStorm

I think that's what a lot of folks with "useless" degrees are counting on. They want to be subsidized in some fashion by the government. That's why the cry is so loud right now, because they're realizing that their chosen field of study actually doesn't pay the bills. That came with telling every child since I was a kid (about 40 years) that they could do or be whatever they wanted, which in reality you can do that, unfortunately it doesn't always put food on the table.

Now subsidizing industry education for those sectors that face a shortage, for an example check here may be desirable. Of course a lot of the jobs that do face shortages are either not glamorous, or are perceived as difficult. To that I say you can either go with something that's needed and understand not everyone is going to love their job, or fork out the cash up front for your pet degree and be made fully aware up front that even if you love the work, it may not be able to support you.

Edit: I work in the field that I linked to, and I do in fact love my job, so it makes it that much easier to succeed at it.
edit on 12/9/20 by Hypntick because: Additional info



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:29 PM
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a reply to: Edumakated


I've paid off about $80k in student loans. In fact, literally just zero'd out all my student loan debt this month making last payment. My wife had near $100k that she paid off.


Congratulations Ed. I don't know why but that makes me happy this morning.


With a true private market for student loans, every kid wouldn't be able to mortgage their future and schools would be forced to reduce tuition to more manageable amounts if they expect students to pay for it.


I agree here. In a way, many of these young people were''suckered'' into college because they thought they could find better paying jobs with the education provided. When I say ''suckered'' I base that on the adverts that fill the airways that promise bright futures if you attend our university. I found that


The schools with the highest amount of student loan debt are University of Phoenix, Walden University, Nova Southeastern University, Capella University, and Strayer University.[8] Except for Nova Southeastern, they are all proprietary (profit-making) universities.

en.wikipedia.org...

This is big industry. For profit corporations charging for tuition and helping arrange loans to pay for it in conjunction with banking corporations swing a 'one two punch'' to people trying to gain a better life.

I see it much like indentured servitude, that practice of finding poor people and promising them transportation, food and lodging for a certain period of time to be paid off in labor for the extent of the contract. For those who then signed onto these contracts this seemed the only way out of the drab existences of poverty that was their future otherwise.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:39 PM
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a reply to: TerryMcGuire

I blame the parents.
My daughter is 18 and I've been very vocal about what college is and what it costs.

One of her friends is going for a social work degree. Not good imo.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:42 PM
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To make this fair deal equal for all of us who paid off our student loans, and on time, I’d like to have our mortgages paid off. Shoot what am I talking about...have our car payments paid off too!



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:45 PM
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a reply to: 38181

I'd do the mortgage thing. Then we'd sell this money pit.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:51 PM
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Maybe a better idea would be to wipe out the accrued interest rather than the loan amount. That would be for the students who have loans held by the federal government. Not sure about private loans.



posted on Dec, 9 2020 @ 01:52 PM
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a reply to: TerryMcGuire

When I say private market for loans what I mean is that private lenders would be far more discerning about how much they'd lend and to whom which would force schools to lower prices.

The problem with student loans is that there is no underwriting of the debt. As long as you can breathe and verify attending any school, you can get a loan that amounts to a mortgage regardless of your ability to pay it back in the future.

Private lenders would NEVER make these loans. Only government would engage in such madness.

A private lender would want to know the student's grades, the school attending, major, and job prospects. What would happen is that schools would then lower their tuition to reflect the availability of financing. For example, a computer engineer may be able to borrower $100k to attend MIT because of the reputation of school and job prospects. On the other hand, a criminal justice degree from University of Phoenix might only get a student $5k to attend thus University of Phoenix would need to lower tuition or go out of business.

The reason tuition is inflated is because schools know that students can and will borrow money to attend so there is no incentive for the schools to contain costs. Most of the tuition inflation is related to stuff like diversity administrators and country club amenities instead of actual classroom instruction.



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