Invitation to a Vivid Discussion

Can you watch the video?

That. Can we please talk about that?

Plus the lie that "everybody benefits from capitalism".

But globalism doesn't work doesn't mean that it's not a problem only one nation has, the people are just people.
If I say capitalism sucks, it doesn't imply I'm communist.
I'm all for "whatever works" but there have to be "guaranteed safety nets" for the people.
Guaranteed "absence of war"
Guaranteed survival, shelter, food and water
Guaranteed health care
Guaranteed education
Guaranteed dignity

Because # is going to get ugly, if we don't start reminding the state it exists to protect and serve.

The only thing guaranteed in life is death.

a reply to: TKDRL

That's #ed up.
You know it's not a given, but a choice?
That's your choice?

a reply to: Peeple

...or if you prefer, let's talk about this

I’d prefer to have the Vivid Discussion you’re inviting us to engage in, I just don’t wanna watch anything to have to give my opinion on....

I'm glad that you added "Guaranteed Dignity."

Dignity is perhaps the least recognized human necessity that is missing from contemporary society. Lack of dignity is highly debilitating to both individuals and societies, but few recognize the terrible way it has slowly been drained from us.

a reply to: Peeple

What if it’s impossible to guarantee those things.

At what cost are you willing to take to get those guarantees.

People pay money to a labor union to guarantee them a job till they die.

What will guarantee productivity of workers for the employer.

What will guarantee that all these guarantees will satisfy you.

You will want more, and it will cost more.

If you give a socialist a cookie, she’s going to need milk.....

a reply to: slatesteam

Those topics I want to discuss. I'm not even sure what my opinions on them are, but they seem worthy to pay some attention to.

I 'm not trying to "give an opinion" I'm trying to find one

Classical capitalism doesn't really exist anymore.

Neither does classical socialism.

Both are obsolete. As several posters here have shrewdly noted, both are children of the industrial revolution.

We are leaving that era behind. Just as feudalism was replaced by leftism/rightism, the latter two are going to have to be replaced by a new "-ism" or several. It will happen later this century after a period of confusion and (likely) strife.

The new ideologies will be built on new technology like AI and 3D printing, just like liberalism and conservatism are the children of the cotten mill and the steam engine.

a reply to: Observationalist

There shouldn't be a deal or a price attached.
They have to be given.

a reply to: Peeple

Something comes to mind about economic systems as well as social structures, "Not everybody will benefit from them."

This is the important thing to remember when it comes to capitalism, Not everyone will benefit from it, but anyone can benefit from it. This isn't true in a utopian system where all people are forced into being equal with one another. During the Middle Ages, guilds were used to regulate not only how much and what kind of goods you can offer, but also regulated the exactness of each item you made. You weren't allowed to make something better or different than your competitors. The newly created Merchant class forced these restriction on to people. The end result was a kind of Trotskyist system where you we either a member of the elite, or you did exactly what the elites told you to do. Oddly the Aristocracy kind of put a leash on the Merchant Class back then.

The issue of Globalism isn't anything but a way to discount the community question by using larger numbers to overwhelm the viewer. The community question is, how does a local community keep it's uniqueness while still wanting to conform to the larger community of a town?

A group of people from southern Africa vs a group of people from Northeast Asia are not different than comparing the social groups from New York City and Bend Oregon. We are only told that since it's a different country that it's too different to make any head way in diplomacy, but in reality understanding one another isn't that hard.


Note: I didn't watch the videos so if I'm way off topic let me know. My little Amiga will die if I try and watch a video on it.

a reply to: Guyfriday

OMG it's been a while since I met an Amiga!?
That's pretty great.

As I see it some much more radical thinking is required, daring to think something new.

a reply to: Peeple

They have to be given.

"Something given has no value." Rasczak in 'Starship Troopers'

Capitalism is the freedom to achieve nearly anything through hard work. No one has ever set out to learn an applicable skill and not been able to with dedication to learning it. Those at the bottom unable to gain anything are resting comfortably on the trampoline instead of jumping back up there.

Granted some have made some terrible choices and some have been oppressed by their socialistic communities where politicians stand atop their heads to make sure they cannot jump into progress.

Their are laws that prevent discrimination of the disabled, ethnicity, sexual preference, gender among other things. Tech schools are virtually free via pale grants for any person that wants to begin bettering themselves.

Their are also programs that offer ISA's that assist students in training and placement as well.

You can lead a horse to water, but you cant force it to drink.

Damn if I knew we were gonna have a discussion after watching some videos, I was hoping they were Vivid

originally posted by: Peeple
Can you watch the video?

That. Can we please talk about that?

Plus the lie that "everybody benefits from capitalism".

But globalism doesn't work doesn't mean that it's not a problem only one nation has, the people are just people.
If I say capitalism sucks, it doesn't imply I'm communist.
I'm all for "whatever works" but there have to be "guaranteed safety nets" for the people.
Guaranteed "absence of war"
Guaranteed survival, shelter, food and water
Guaranteed health care
Guaranteed education
Guaranteed dignity

Because # is going to get ugly, if we don't start reminding the state it exists to protect and serve.

Starred and Flagged, we had all better find common ground together, whatever the future brings we are better off if we find the things that froup us together instead of what drives us apart.

Great video pretty much agree with a lot of it.

But as for your guarantees, much like our 2 party political system that forces people to prioritize and compromise it's difficult to guarantee all 5 though it should be what we strive for.

Absolutely no reason 2,3 and 4 can't be done, that is basically just money, and governmental wherewithal to make it happen.

The war is based on other countries as much as our country.

Dignity is a tough one because that comes from within and from without or outside situations. Hard to guarantee but certainly again can be strived for.

a reply to: Peeple

We are born into this world with nothing but a soul and that same soul is the only thing we will take from this mortal world. A soul that is filled with experience and learning.
The time we spend on this earth depends on how hard and how much effort we want to put into this life. Not one capable person on this earth is owed anything from those that do make the effort of providing for their necessities in life.
You want a guarantee? Get a job and earn some money. Then Go buy insurance.

The poor will always be with us.

God will reward his children for their suffering here on earth.

a reply to: tinktinktink
Capitalism as you describe it no longer exists. Hard work is not sufficient to guarantee a "good life." The playing field is a lot more crowded and a lot less level than it was in the 1960s.

Actually what we have is a kind of socialism for big business, and law of the jungle for anyone middle-class or below. The biggest firm's get endless stock purchases from banks that get endless FED fire-hose money and their performance is not rewarded or punished by the stock market as it was 40 or 50 years ago. Instead all the big dogs keep "failing up." The fundamentals no longer matter in the market: it is just a gusher of free money for the elite class.

Meanwhile the middle class sees their old jobs outsourced, automated, offshored, and just plain eliminated, to be replaced by temp work with no benefits. Hard work for the blue collar man is just a ticket to lower back pain and opioid addiction, without decent healthcare. The white collar office worker is not physically busting his hump, but he is sinking in debt in a job with little chance for promotion.

Not everyone can be Mark Zuckerberg...you need a broad and stable middle class and it's been eroded for 40 years or more.

a reply to: CharlesT

Ok, I'll bite. But only because this is relevant to the OP with regards to dignity.

IF we are all children of god, poor people are are your brothers and sisters. However some siblings are born into better circumstances. Zero dignity if you can sit in church and worship while your brethren are starving. How can you thank your god for how he has blessed you in this life while your spiritual siblings are being murdered in some parts of the world? That implies he intervened in your situation but he ignores the plight of others.

Dignity is not dedicating your life to hedging your spiritual odds in order to profit from it in the next life.

Having said all that, I am still able to recognize why people believe in their chosen god and for some it helps them to lead a better, more caring and fulfilling life.


THEN having the philosophical outlook that somehow they, your poor brothers and sisters in Christ, much just hold out until they die, THEN it will get better for them. Zero dignity. Imagine one of your siblings drowning before your eyes and wishing them well on their journey to a better place and a big reward.


I am not bashing your belief for the sake of my non-belief, I have deep respect for believers who attempt to better themselves and those around them through their actions that come from a spiritual place within themselves, in your case the Holy Spirit.

For me the "I love you but if you don't worship me I'll send you to hell to burn forever" part of the package is a deal breaker when it comes to dignity in what people call a "relationship".

I am not attacking your belief above, I am merely outlining why I find such a disconnect in spiritual matters.

Peace.

a reply to: Peeple

Can you watch the video?

That. Can we please talk about that?

Plus the lie that "everybody benefits from capitalism".

But globalism doesn't work doesn't mean that it's not a problem only one nation has, the people are just people.
If I say capitalism sucks, it doesn't imply I'm communist.
I'm all for "whatever works" but there have to be "guaranteed safety nets" for the people.
Guaranteed "absence of war"
Guaranteed survival, shelter, food and water
Guaranteed health care
Guaranteed education
Guaranteed dignity

The problem with trying to engage in a meaningful discussion regarding a topic like this. It cannot be compartmentalised to the point that you or anyone can dictate the whole meaning of it and plan without anything but books worth of writing to begin with.

This touches on topics that involve every single facet of life, be it lowest class or highest class with/and everthing in between including every corporation, government agency, government itself, other external agencies and much more.

This "system" cannot be stopped, bargained with, understood entirely, or anything in between and it will stop at nothing until it achieves it's goal and everyone is a part of it no matter how big or small all slaves to it...



Agree or disagree if you want, grumble to someone, type on the internet or whatever. But you or I mean nothing in the scheme of things as an individual.
Choose what to believe, live and experience what you want as best you can. Then die!

It is totally up-to you and anyone what the meaning is behind it.
To me, it is more clear than ever, something is not quite right.

No one person can stop anything taking place and one of the biggest red flags was and has become the internet, it is being used against everyone, everywhere from all walks of life. More that is typed, more is gathered and used to profile.

Don't play the game as much as possible, walk away and enjoy the short time you have with family, friends and connections as much as possible is all you can do. If that seems so drastic, this was how most people lived not so long ago.



Live your life as you choose without hurting others as much as possible. Then get hurt and die. If we could all just see that we are all going to die and not fear it... this whole charade would not be taking place