Brexit: Trade talks with EU to resume later this week

Following the break down of Brexit negotiation last week Boris Johnson said there was no point continuing to talk unless the "EU was prepared to discuss the detailed legal text of a partnership" , in other words they're continuing to ponce around as if they're calling the shots believing we are not serious.

Johnson's decision to end the talks early seems to have focused EU minds on what is at stake for them because it's just been announced that talks will resume later this week following a phone call with EU negotiator Michel Barnier.

"They were also clear that the EU had to accept once again that it was dealing with an independent and sovereign country and that any agreement would need to be consistent with that status.

"We welcome the fact that Mr Barnier acknowledged both points this morning, and additionally that movement would be needed from both sides in the talks if agreement was to be reached.
"As he made clear, 'any future agreement will be made in respect of the decision-making autonomy of the European Union and with respect for British sovereignty'.
news.sky.com...

Now we appear to understand each other let the mutually beneficial trade talk begin.

Johnson may not be perfect but in this he has my and I think all Brexiteers backing.

a reply to: gortex

Wasn't there a deadline October 15th?

There'll be no deal, all they do now is trying to blame it on the other side.
If Boris would be a man of his word, deadline would have been the 15th, but since that'd have meant he's responsible we'll be playing who gets to be the last one "holding the stick" until the last day...

a reply to: Peeple

Wasn't there a deadline October 15th?

The only meaningful deadline is December 31st 2020.

There'll be no deal, all they do now is trying to blame it on the other side.
If Boris would be a man of his word, deadline would have been the 15th, but since that'd have meant he's responsible we'll be playing who gets to be the last one "holding the stick" until the last day...

I think there will be a deal because both sides need a deal , the EU do more trade with us than we do with them so they stand to lose the most if there isn't a deal , Boris Johnson has played this staring contest well.

a reply to: gortex

You know that's logically impossible, right?

the EU do more trade with us than we do with them

How would that work?

a reply to: Peeple

The UK had an overall trade deficit of -£72 billion with the EU in 2019. A surplus of £23 billion on trade in services was outweighed by a deficit of -£95 billion on trade in goods. The UK had a trade surplus of £46 billion with non-EU countries.
[url]https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cbp-7851/#:~:text=The%20UK%20had%20an%20overall,billion%20with%20non%2DEU%20countries.[/u rl]

a reply to: gortex

Trade deficit: A trade deficit occurs when a country's imports exceed its exports during a given time period.

Buying things is still "doing trade", just fyi.

a reply to: Peeple

That's why the EU is more hurt because in turn, we export more to UK than we import from them.

Export = getting cash from the other side.

a reply to: ThatDamnDuckAgain

That depends on how you want to look at it, after Brexit you'll still want tomatoes and stuff, sure you can buy that somewhere else but it won't be the same quality and still get more expensive, because of the tariffs you'll have to pay (dealing with all countries with which you have no trade agreement) and transport and such.
Which means prices go up either way and people buy less which is bad for the national economy already struggling with the corona.

While everywhere in Europe prices will go down because of a goods surplus, which couldn't come at a more convenient time.

I mean you're not buying those things now because you want to do the EU a favour, but because you need them. Historically empty shelves and high prices have often lead to the public getting pretty upset.
Too many goods for too low prices just means you need to find a new buyer or start making a new product.

a reply to: gortex

I don't think you fully realise what you are claiming here. These numbers concern 1 country vs. an entire continent of some 30-ish countries.
GB is jeopardizing its trade with 30 countries while the EU is only loosing trade with one country.
You want our stuff and we need your services almost 4 to 1

And please check out these 2 gems on the same list :

Services accounted for 43% of the UK’s exports to the EU in 2019. Financial services and other business services (a category which includes legal, accounting, advertising, research and development, architectural, engineering and other professional and technical services) are important categories of services exports to the EU.

There are currently no tariffs on goods traded between the UK and EU – the UK is scheduled to continue to use the EU’s Common External Tariff until 31 December 2020, when it will be replaced by the UK Global Tariff.

Please, you guys are in no position to bargain
I'll say it again, you guys had it pretty good. Isolated from the mainland but still in the trade union.
Thats a bad miss!

Im sorry, its not aimed at you gortex, I'm just talking to the proverbial british bloke

a reply to: Jubei42

Please, you guys are in no position to bargain.

Sadly that's been Michel Barnier's attitude throughout the negotiations.

I'll say it again, you guys had it pretty good.

That's part of the problem , we and the others have it pretty good while Germany and France have it really good because EU rules are tailored to them , there is disquiet within the union I believe we will not be the last to leave.

Interesting how Merkel ally Ursula von der Leyen became President of the European Commission dontcha think.

a reply to: gortex

Okay, you do the drama and I'll stick to the numbers.
You know if you guys really feel some countries are being favoured within the union, that's fine. I don't think its really true but that doesnt matter.

The whole idea of the union is that we are stronger together, now how far you want to take that is a fair discussion. One thing is for sure though, economically speaking it works really well.
But if you start to undermine the union with this kind of sentiment you'd be better of leaving alright.

a reply to: Jubei42

Please, you guys are in no position to bargain

Really ?

The U.K. ended the trade discussions last week. Since then The E.U. has been knocking on our door asking us to return to the discussions. So who need who more ?

The EU need us more than we need them. London finace houses fuel EU borrowing, The trade surplus between us is £81 billion in The EU's favour.

Just think of all those German French and Italian cars sitting at the ports with " No entry to The UK " unless huge tarriffs are applied.

If you think we need The EU more then you are delusional.

a reply to: alldaylong

This is basic economics here.
The price of trade is going up across the board.
You will have to pay more for the same, almost 4 to 1 compared to how much more the EU has to pay more for the same.

We all lose, except you pay quadruble

originally posted by: Jubei42
a reply to: alldaylong

This is basic economics here.
The price of trade is going up across the board.
You will have to pay more for the same, almost 4 to 1 compared to how much more the EU has to pay more for the same.

We all lose, except you pay quadruble

The UK is preparing to go WTO.

So please tell me why The EU is acting like a stalker and keeps pestering The UK to return to the trade negotiations ? Michel Barnier has benn calling London everyday since we pulled out the talks. Now he is saying The EU are prepared to treat The UK as a Sovereign Nation.

That is simple common sense that The EU needs us more than we need them.

originally posted by: alldaylong


So please tell me why The EU is acting like a stalker and keeps pestering The UK to return to the trade negotiations ? Michel Barnier has benn calling London everyday since we pulled out the talks. Now he is saying The EU are prepared to treat The UK as a Sovereign Nation.

That is simple common sense that The EU needs us more than we need them.

Because we have a strong position at the table and yours is weak. That why you are running away and we want you to come back.
Like Peeple said, you don't buy from us to do us favour.
We lost a small partner in the market, you lost a big one.

a reply to: Jubei42

French, Dutch, Danish, Belgium, Spanish fishing fleets decimated when they have no access to UK Waters.

Yes of course we need you more than you need us. LOL

originally posted by: Jubei42
This is basic economics here. ... We all lose, except you pay quadruble

Not really correct, even using basic economics.

Take cars. If the EU refuse a basic trade deal (Canada plus) which they originally proposed, but now don't like, then the "no deal" WTO option is a more manageable choice for the UK.

If there are WTO terms, then BMWs will be more expensive in the UK because the German's will have to pay a tariff which gets passed on to the UK customer. Over time the more expensive BMWs will lose ground to other comparable foreign brands of lower price sourced from countries the UK will form trade agreements with. BMW and Germany lose, but UK consumer remains satisfied in the end.

Of course, the reverse is true, but cars in the UK which lose market share in the EU will in time find new markets. The UK car makers know this, which is why they are no longer being doom mongers.

Take Dutch onions, or Spanish tomatoes. Without protectionist EU barriers these items may be sourced from other countries. The rebalancing will not necessarily result in lower quality but is likely to result in lower costs. Oh, I know the protectionist EU will slap on punitive tariffs against sheep imports from the UK which will damage UK agriculture until new markets are resolved, but then people in the EU will be deprived of decent food. The EU can eat all the noses they are cutting off in spite of their bloated faces.

Perversely, if the UK got a trade deal with the US then expect BMWs from the US as they may be cheaper than cars made in Germany!

That's simple economics. Both the EU and the UK lose, but the UK will be in a better position to adapt.

originally posted by: paraphi

If there are WTO terms, then BMWs will be more expensive in the UK because the German's will have to pay a tariff which gets passed on to the UK customer.

Really?

a reply to: paraphi

If there are WTO terms, then BMWs will be more expensive in the UK because the German's will have to pay a tariff which gets passed on to the UK customer

Are those the same BMW cars along with other German cars that they lied about The Emissions they produced?

And got fined Billions of Dollars in The US for doing so?

Typical EU shady practice.

a reply to: alldaylong

What fish is caught in UK waters?
In the UK, we export most of the seafood we catch in our waters. This is because foreign seafood markets greatly value UK species, such as langoustine, crab and mackerel, while domestic consumers focus their purchases on a smaller range of species, such as cod, salmon and haddock.

How much is the EU fishing industry worth?
In terms of output, the EU's aquaculture sector was the eighth largest worldwide, with a 1.6 % share of the volume of global output in 2016. The value of the EU's aquaculture production was an estimated EUR 5.1 billion in 2017, about two fifths of the total value of the EU's total production of fishery products

How much is the GB fishing industry worth?
The UK's fishing and fish processing industries employ 24,000 people and contribute 1.4 billion pounds (€1.6 billion, $1.8 billion) to the UK economy, according to a House of Commons research library briefing. That is a mere 0.12% of GDP involving under 0.1% of the UK's 33-million national workforce.

Peanuts, comming out of GBs pocket