Remember the Sabbath, and keep it Holy - possible hidden meaning

a reply to: ThreeDeuce

Nobody said anything about using that to determine a family line.

You wrote this:

I do not think that a Cohen needed to be born on the Sabbath to be called a Shebbatthai. It seems this is just a term for the Cohen.

Do you lie intentionally, or just lack reading comprehension?

I don't usually go around lying intentionally. Sometimes I am wrong about something. It's not like I enjoy being wrong. It just happens.

a reply to: ThreeDeuce

You have a Lutheran background. Rather than chastise readers simply direct them to The Threefold Use of the Law, as referred to in the Formula of Concord.

The Formula of Concord distinguished three uses, or purposes, in the Law in Article VI. It states: "[T]he Law was given to men for three reasons ..."

1 that "thereby outward discipline might be maintained against wild, disobedient men [and that wild and intractable men might be restrained, as though by certain bars]"
2 that "men thereby may be led to the knowledge of their sins"
3 that "after they are regenerate ... they might ... have a fixed rule according to which they are to regulate and direct their whole life"

The primary concern was to maintain that the Law should continue to be used by Christians after they had been regenerated by the Holy Spirit through the Gospel to counter the doctrine of Johannes Agricola, who taught that the Law was no longer needed by regenerate Christians."[7][8] Confessional Lutheranism teaches that the Law cannot be used to deny the Gospel, neither can the Gospel be used to deny God's Law.[9]

The three uses of the Law are:

Curb - Through fear of punishment, the Law keeps the sinful nature of both Christians and non-Christians under check. This does not stop sin, since the sin is already committed when the heart desires to do what is wrong, yet it does stop the open outbreak of sin that will do even further damage.

Mirror - The Law serves as a perfect reflection of what God created the human heart and life to be. It shows anyone who compares his/her life to God's requirement for perfection that he/she is sinful.

Guide - This use of the law that applies only to Christians. The law becomes the believer's helper. Empowered by the gospel truth of forgiveness and righteousness in Christ, the believer's new self eagerly desires to live to please the Triune God.
Law_and_Gospel

Saturday was the Sabbath and Sunday was a Christian holiday. What is wrong with keeping those days as Holidays, it used to be that most people had weekends off and there was a lot of social events on those two days. Now, a lot of people do not get the weekend off, I think that sucks, even in Covid times

originally posted by: rickymouse
Saturday was the Sabbath and Sunday was a Christian holiday. What is wrong with keeping those days as Holidays, it used to be that most people had weekends off and there was a lot of social events on those two days. Now, a lot of people do not get the weekend off, I think that sucks, even in Covid times

Nothing is wrong in my opinion, someone that wants to keep both days Holy. I am sure that my God YHVH would appreciate it if I were to keep all days Holy. This would mean that I were walking in the footsteps of Yeshua, and that I would we wise to expect the same Fulfillment that Jesus received. Fully filled with the Power of God. That is where my interpretation of that Jesus did not come to abolish the Law, but to fulfill it, differs from many others.

I also agree that I do not need to follow the Law for Salvation. I am saved through my faith in Jesus Christ, being the Son of My God who was given to die for the forgiveness of my sins. The Law is how I have been asked to show my God that I have heard, and can listen to him. This is the same call asking us to try to live without sin.

If you were to sin, then you do not lose your Salvation. I feel that this is the same analogy which applies to the Law. To me, I feel that the same applies to foods. We are asked to eat clean as a show of faith to my God. Of course, if I were to eat outside of the Law, it would surely not defile me completely. This is similar to how sin would not stop my Salvation. I do not read those scriptures as saying that we should forsake or abolish the Law as it was written. We are told to forsake the Laws of the Sin offerings and sacrifices directly, because they are not needed due the sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

This is just my humble attempt at trying to interpret the Law, through the layers of babel and misinterpretation that I have had my entire life. When you ask if it's a big deal if someone follows both, of course not. What I think is a danger, are the people who have only ever kept Sunday Holy, and not the Sabbath. It is a new thing for myself, and even what to do on Shabbat is difficult. I also do not agree with getting around the Law of what to do on Shabbat by hiring someone to do the work for you. You're basically paying someone to break the Law, when one of the rules of Shabbat is to not conduct business. Perhaps no money exchanged hands on that time, but you employed someone during this time of Rest. These are things that I am looking at.

Heck, even the verse on head coverings 1 Cor 11 is confusing, as it seems to suggest that someone should only pray when their head is uncovered. Well, is that applying literally to us, or just figuratively since it discusses Jesus as the head of the Church. My thought is that the literal interpretation of never praying with a head covering then would be odd, as people would find them at times when they shouldn't pray. My inclination is that we should be open to pray at all times. With the prevalence of head coverings outdoors, this would be odd suggesting that one could never pray with a covered head.

So the danger to me comes from someone who doesn't keep Shabbat at all, because they have been simply taught that Sunday is the Holy Day. Keeping both would be a great way to show reverence. Keeping neither Holy seems to go against the Law, but there are those who argue that we are not even under the Law. This is one area that I contend against every time, as Jesus had not come to abolish the Law.

There will always be interpretations to the Bible, however I do not like when clergy interpret a veiled Verse, and use it to counteract a Verse which is obvious and clear. How the term "fulfillment" of the Law is used to negate being said that it's not to abolish the Law. No matter what you want to think Fulfillment means, the Bible says that it does not mean abolish. Any Church teaching the abolishing of the Law seems to be taking great liberties with the Word.

a reply to: pthena
it's not chastising you to say that you are being deceitful. You suggesting that I used the term Shebbatthai was a complete fabrication of your own accord. Rather than apologizing for your creativity, you accuse me of chastising you? Pretty creative there buddy. That is really passive aggressive.

If you promote how bizarre it is that I suggest something that I never say at all, then you are creating lies. If you are not one to take responsibility for that, then that is between you and God.

You are dealing with me disrespectfully, and taking zero accountability for your own actions... and you want to quote the Formula of Concord to me? Hilarious response to being shown that you have lied. The forked tongue with you speak is absolutely visible.

What a great pertinent thread...

Heres the skinny

in Heaven and after the Armageddon time.....

we will be keeping the Sabbath.....coz it is not jewish....it was instituted before there were jews

it was given to be for eternity.....

i have a cough....talk among yourselves....till

Umm.. ya.. I think it is just telling us to remember the sabbath, keep it holy. The 7th day is ordained as a special day by our creator to be a day of rest, early in the genesis story. It is then included in the ten commandments in exodus. Then in Exodus 31, it says that keeping the sabbath is a sign between the creator and the children of isreal throughout the generations. A sign for who to take note of? The creator? I doubt it, I imagine he would know who his chosen people were. The children of isreal? Again I think that is rather doubtful. It set them apart from most, if not all the other groups in the area who were worshipping a sun god... on sundays. It marked them as worshippers of the creator, not the creation.
It set them apart.
It seems to be a simple message, remember the sabbath, keep it holy, it is a gift given to you by your creator himself. And, since it was proclaimed as such long before abraham came into being, I dont believe it was ever intended for just the children of isreal but for all of us.

a reply to: ThreeDeuce

The Sabbath is on Saturday. Where did the church get the authority to change it to sunday..

a reply to: purplemer
That is what happens when one guy (in this case a pope) is chosen by men to be the spokesperson for god.
If he gets in ear infection and gods voice becomes too muffled, he screws the message up.

Actually, if I am remembering right. The Pope changed the sabbath to show he had the authority. Or something like that.

a reply to: ThreeDeuce

You suggesting that I used the term Shebbatthai was a complete fabrication of your own accord.

You could have just spelled it Shabbatay or Shabbetai like normal. What's with the e instead of the a?

Rather than apologizing for your creativity, you accuse me of chastising you?

Not at all. The post of yours that I was responding to was not addressed to anyone. You wrote:

You who speaks against the literal Words of Jesus are walking a very thin rope.

That clearly wasn't addressed to me because I never made any reference to the literal Words of Jesus. There's no reason for me to assume that you were chastising me. I only wrote about references to Ezra, Nehemiah, Strong's Concordance, and the Talmud.

You are dealing with me disrespectfully, and taking zero accountability for your own actions...

With all due respect, why did you use the spelling with an e instead of a?

and you want to quote the Formula of Concord to me?

I quoted Wikipedia. If the wikipedia quotes Formula of Concord...
Okay, I see it now: Guilty as Charged. There were quotes from the Formula of Concord.

The forked tongue with you speak is absolutely visible.

I will insert a which between with and you, "with which you speak".
Visible to whom? I can't see my tongue. In the mirror it doesn't look forked. Does my mirror lie?

originally posted by: rickymouse
Saturday was the Sabbath and Sunday was a Christian holiday. What is wrong with keeping those days as Holidays, it used to be that most people had weekends off and there was a lot of social events on those two days. Now, a lot of people do not get the weekend off, I think that sucks, even in Covid times

The problem was twofold, if you were Jewish or in some modern Jewish sects today, if you don’t keep the law you are condemning yourself and stopping the Messiah returning by breaking the law. Other Jews looked down and condemned lawbreakers.

As for non Jews and Christians, the law is not made for us, it was given to Moses for the Jews though it will be used to judge people on judgement day.
Christians won’t be judged because we are in Jesus

originally posted by: GBP/JPY
What a great pertinent thread...

Heres the skinny

in Heaven and after the Armageddon time.....

we will be keeping the Sabbath.....coz it is not jewish....it was instituted before there were jews

it was given to be for eternity.....

i have a cough....talk among yourselves....till

You have a cough? Seemingly

Heaven is promised to be a place of rest and is timeless and we are with God and you are saying
Heaven has seven days, we have to work for our salvation in heaven and one day only will be a day of rest in heaven
Why are you a Christian?

I don’t think you have a clue what salvation and grace are or have any idea what heaven is

a reply to: dawnstar

Don't keep the Sabbath
Romans 14:5, "One man regards one day above another, another regards every day alike. Let each man be fully convinced in his own mind."
Colossians 2:16, "Therefore let no one act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day."

“But with Jesus’ atonement, and justification is by faith (Rom. 5:1), we no longer are required to keep the Law and hence the Sabbath which was only a shadow of things to come (Col. 2:16-17). We are not under Law but grace (Rom. 6:14-15). The Sabbath is fulfilled in Jesus because in Him we have rest (Matt. 11:28). We are not under obligation to keep the Law, and this goes for the Sabbath as well.”carm.org...

Keep the Sabbath if you want but, you don’t need to, we don’t need the Judaic law, we have the Holy Spirit and grace.
If you fail, if you sin, Jesus loves you, as long as you try

We learn from the law, we are not subject to the law, Christians are subject to love

a reply to: Raggedyman

If I am reading your post right... the command to honor the sabbath was made to just the children of abraham.
But, obedience to this command will be part of the decision come judgement day. But Christians wont be judged because they are under christ's umbrella of forgiveness. Therefore, Christian's are exempt from the requirement of honoring the sabbath.

Well.. can I then also say that the command not to murder was given only to the children of abraham? That it also will play a part in the final judgement. But, Christian's are exempt from this law because they are under that umbrella? Or should we really try to avoid murdering our neighbors?

a reply to: ThreeDeuce





" remembering the Sabbath=born's duties "

An Archaic Belief of When Men Directly Served their God(s) . Does that have Any Validity Today > ? Hmm.......

a reply to: Zanti Misfit
My faith tells me that there are still men who serve God, YHVH.

Are the books of Moses inspiration?

Was Moses inspired by God in detailing
the events of the Exodus or did Moses
simply write what he and others experienced?

Now read 2 Tim 3:16. If "all" scripture is given by
inspiration, then Moses and many other writers
record of past historical events is not scripture.

See the dilemma?

Again; If I tell you what happened to me in my
past. Is that inspiration? Of course not. And yet,
those who try to understand the scriptures from
a literalist perspective will explain the books
of Moses as inspiration, while in the same
perspective stating he wrote his past events.

The fact that past history is not inspiration
might help to unravel your delimma.

Again; you need to understand that a man
writing what he has experienced is not
inspiration. Inspiration is something not
yet known, and is direct knowledge
and understanding given from within.

Moses writing of the Exodus is his
writing of what..he..experienced.
Absolutely no inspiration in writing
his past history..IF you accept the
literal point of view.

It can only be understood as inspiration,
if the books of Moses are allegorical in
nature.

I am not proposing the scriptures
are not inspired. But only that
the majority who seek understanding
via literal interpretation will never
understand the truth.

The very term inspiration implies,
it takes inspiration to understand
what has been inspired.

The inspired writers have shown us
exactly how to understand. But very few
will accept what they read due to
prior theological conditioning.

Job 32:8

You don't acquire understanding of
anything inspired from priest, pastors
and clergy because they've been taught
regurgitated theology from Bible Colleges.

There is only one way toward understanding.
Job 32:8

As long as men continue following the teachings
of men, instead of following the true teacher within,
they'll continue waiting another thousand years
for a savior to come through the clouds.

The theologians will read Galations 4:24 a thousand
times and rarely see what's plainly in front of them.

a reply to: ThreeDeuce

Thanks for the explanation.

The hand gesture is really interesting. Star Trek basically ripped it and even gave it a similar meaning, peace be with you or however it specifically goes.

My sister's DNA test said we're 3% Middle Eastern Jew or something like that. My Mother's maiden name is Stein which can be Ashkenazi and she looked the part. The Swedish part from my Father's side was a family named Bengssten which translates son of Benjamin and I'm left handed. I'm sure you know about the Benjaminites having lefties and archers.

If I am part, guess what? It means absolutely nothing.

a reply to: quix0tic

Slingers, not archers.
Sling at a hair without missing.

Go 700!

That scared me. Was the 700 Club named for the 700 slingers?
No.
It was named for 700 donors who pledged money in 1963.