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Canada lets Muslim off on a "real" hate crime

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posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 06:29 AM
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Thank you DrHoracid. Scalping was done as an insult, since Natives held their hair as being very sacred.
In the trading posts across the west, jars sat on the counter that were for the settlers to drop Native scalps into. Then they got a credit to buy supplies. Such an ingenious and efficient mechanism to promote genocide, too bad it is so vile.




posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 07:08 AM
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concentration camp?are you trying to imply that we were systimaticaly trying to kill off those of japanese decent? if so this is news to me. dacow and ashwitz were concentration camps.( please excuse my poor spelling)

as for the aligation of trying to make the theft from the interned japanese legitimat. if you actualy read what i said was that it should not have been done. that was opertunisim plain and simple. there was and is no excuse for it.

as to why germans were not interned:
you would have to ask those who were in power at the time. the only thing i can think of is that they were not tied to their old country by a religion that claimed thier sovern was infact a deity. that is the best guess i can make as to why they were so frightened of them as to inter them.

the turning back of the ship full of jewish refugees was as i have stated a case of illegal immigration. we still turn away the bulk of people who try to come to canada in that manor, unless they can prove real harm of returning to thier homeland. there is a propper procedure to follow when wanting to immigrate that should be followed, ecept in the most dire of circumstances. unfortunately no one is infalible. sure there were those who were opposed to jews there unfortunately be those who are raceist everywhere. includeing those who love to scream discrimination whenever things don't go their way. you also must bear in mind that the nazi party was extreemly good at controlling news that got out of germany. add to that nazi sympisizers that would have been here and it realy clouds up things. as well we have to remember that the alies when liberateing the concentration cams were shocked, at what they found. you would not be shocked if you found what you expected to find. even thoes jews who did not leave germany had no idea how bad it would get. at that time period "second class" citisens was a perfectly normal thing. and no i am not condoneing that either. therefore there did not seem to be any urgency so why not follow propper procedures to emmigrate? in other words there was no sign of emmiment danger to them.

you also state "that they all hated jews". there is no evidence to support that. indeed if that was the case why would the people have:
a) liberated them at all instead of leaveing them to rot and continueing to destroy them?
b) felt so guilty at not realizeing what was going on that they stole isrial as a perminant homeland for them? therby causeing the problems we are faceing today.

yes we all know of the evil reidential schools. how can we possibly forget when it is shoved down our throtes at every turn? are they still in operation? no they are not. it is actualya shame that the perpitraters of this crime are dead otherwise they could be prosicuted. incidently even "the normal" schools were filled with brutality altho not as severe. you will understand this is why corpral punishment is not alowed in schools anymore. the abuse of it was widespread. they are even now finaly able to prosicute the cathlic priests that have been involved in sex crimes in schools. before they were just hidden and moved around by the catholic church leaders.

the fact that west coast comunitys were so severly depleated of their men due to the war is unfortunate. we should be gratefull that so many were willing to lay down lives in the cause of freedom.the fact about not being able to enter bars is all a part of the ignorant thinking of the time. as such it has been corrected or am i wrong? segrigation was something that a large majoraty of "minoritys" had to face again this was not right but it has been done away with hasn't it?

it is unfortunate that the laws were not compleately changed untill 1960. but they HAVE been changed. as for the fact of being raped and ignoerd at work that is also something that has been fixed fixed so well that it now only tends to take a statement from 1 person on sexual harrasment to ruin someone's life forever. just to prove this point a female at my workplace ruined 2 people's lives just because they made her look bad. when it came to light that she was the one guilty of sexual harrasment she could not be touched. the company on the other hand was MORE than willing to get rid of those that she had told sexual lies to and were just repeating the rumers she had started.

you are right unspeakable things were done but how can you hold those not responsible for these crimes? that is why there is a court systom. i understand that in times past it treated a lot of minoritys as second class citizens but again that has been fixed has it not?as for the death of the sibbling from my understanding tb was not something easly cured at the time. i don't know if we even have a reliable cure now, we do have ways to to try to prevent it. also bear in mind that untill we got decent health care things like inoculations would only have been available to those who could afford it.

the fact that vancover's east side has a majority of native prostituts is indeed unfortunate. i understand how hard it is to convince them to leave that nasty proffesion we have a prostitution problem here as well and i have spoken with a few of them they all have differant reasons, but one comment i have heard from them a lot is the fact that it is easy money why give it up for a poor paying job. low paying jobs are something i know all about. i find it hard to argue with them on that point.i am all to familiar with the fact of job equality myself. i am sick and tired of hearing that they can not hire me as they need more minoritys so they will not be in trubble for unfair hireing practices.

one thing i don't understand however.how is keeping your hatred alive helping to solve things that are already fixed or being fixed? with as much sympaty i have for the people that have been displaced wrongfuly throughout history what are we suppost to do? we have already seen what the good intentions have caused in isrial. as bad as the native populatin has been treated in the past there is nothing stopping them from moveing and/or trying to improve themselves thst everyone else doesn't have to deal with as well



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 07:49 AM
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Originally posted by drogo
concentration camp?are you trying to imply that we were systimaticaly trying to kill off those of japanese decent? if so this is news to me. dacow and ashwitz were concentration camps.( please excuse my poor spelling)

as for the aligation of trying to make the theft from the interned japanese legitimat. if you actualy read what i said was that it should not have been done. that was opertunisim plain and simple. there was and is no excuse for it.

as to why germans were not interned:
you would have to ask those who were in power at the time. the only thing i can think of is that they were not tied to their old country by a religion that claimed thier sovern was infact a deity. that is the best guess i can make as to why they were so frightened of them as to inter them.

the turning back of the ship full of jewish refugees was as i have stated a case of illegal immigration. we still turn away the bulk of people who try to come to canada in that manor, unless they can prove real harm of returning to thier homeland. there is a propper procedure to follow when wanting to immigrate that should be followed, ecept in the most dire of circumstances. unfortunately no one is infalible. sure there were those who were opposed to jews there unfortunately be those who are raceist everywhere. includeing those who love to scream discrimination whenever things don't go their way. you also must bear in mind that the nazi party was extreemly good at controlling news that got out of germany. add to that nazi sympisizers that would have been here and it realy clouds up things. as well we have to remember that the alies when liberateing the concentration cams were shocked, at what they found. you would not be shocked if you found what you expected to find. even thoes jews who did not leave germany had no idea how bad it would get. at that time period "second class" citisens was a perfectly normal thing. and no i am not condoneing that either. therefore there did not seem to be any urgency so why not follow propper procedures to emmigrate? in other words there was no sign of emmiment danger to them.

you also state "that they all hated jews". there is no evidence to support that. indeed if that was the case why would the people have:
a) liberated them at all instead of leaveing them to rot and continueing to destroy them?
b) felt so guilty at not realizeing what was going on that they stole isrial as a perminant homeland for them? therby causeing the problems we are faceing today.

yes we all know of the evil reidential schools. how can we possibly forget when it is shoved down our throtes at every turn? are they still in operation? no they are not. it is actualya shame that the perpitraters of this crime are dead otherwise they could be prosicuted. incidently even "the normal" schools were filled with brutality altho not as severe. you will understand this is why corpral punishment is not alowed in schools anymore. the abuse of it was widespread. they are even now finaly able to prosicute the cathlic priests that have been involved in sex crimes in schools. before they were just hidden and moved around by the catholic church leaders.

the fact that west coast comunitys were so severly depleated of their men due to the war is unfortunate. we should be gratefull that so many were willing to lay down lives in the cause of freedom.the fact about not being able to enter bars is all a part of the ignorant thinking of the time. as such it has been corrected or am i wrong? segrigation was something that a large majoraty of "minoritys" had to face again this was not right but it has been done away with hasn't it?

it is unfortunate that the laws were not compleately changed untill 1960. but they HAVE been changed. as for the fact of being raped and ignoerd at work that is also something that has been fixed fixed so well that it now only tends to take a statement from 1 person on sexual harrasment to ruin someone's life forever. just to prove this point a female at my workplace ruined 2 people's lives just because they made her look bad. when it came to light that she was the one guilty of sexual harrasment she could not be touched. the company on the other hand was MORE than willing to get rid of those that she had told sexual lies to and were just repeating the rumers she had started.

you are right unspeakable things were done but how can you hold those not responsible for these crimes? that is why there is a court systom. i understand that in times past it treated a lot of minoritys as second class citizens but again that has been fixed has it not?as for the death of the sibbling from my understanding tb was not something easly cured at the time. i don't know if we even have a reliable cure now, we do have ways to to try to prevent it. also bear in mind that untill we got decent health care things like inoculations would only have been available to those who could afford it.

the fact that vancover's east side has a majority of native prostituts is indeed unfortunate. i understand how hard it is to convince them to leave that nasty proffesion we have a prostitution problem here as well and i have spoken with a few of them they all have differant reasons, but one comment i have heard from them a lot is the fact that it is easy money why give it up for a poor paying job. low paying jobs are something i know all about. i find it hard to argue with them on that point.i am all to familiar with the fact of job equality myself. i am sick and tired of hearing that they can not hire me as they need more minoritys so they will not be in trubble for unfair hireing practices.

one thing i don't understand however.how is keeping your hatred alive helping to solve things that are already fixed or being fixed? with as much sympaty i have for the people that have been displaced wrongfuly throughout history what are we suppost to do? we have already seen what the good intentions have caused in isrial. as bad as the native populatin has been treated in the past there is nothing stopping them from moveing and/or trying to improve themselves thst everyone else doesn't have to deal with as well


How is the view on your cruise? I feel you are on a long cruise on 'denial'. Just what I see as the most plausible explanation for such rationalizations.
All I meant re: The Canadian Concentration Camps, is after the war, the word concentration was expunged, and replaced with internment. This is rewriting history. I will use the name they chose and used while it was done, not the euphemism they later replaced it with to make us sound nicer.
The posit you offer re: the Germans being excepted at the same time. You propose that the fear based on the sacred manifest destiny concept they had regarding their Emperor. And you prefer that, which ignores the whole Nazi 'master race' belief, which is just as scary imho, to this: they were white. They looked like us, and the 'Japs' didn't. I see racism, pure and simple, as the only reasonable answer.
I strongly disagree with your views on hiring minorities. How else do you equalize the wicked imbalance that has favored you and I for generations?
How?
Laws did nothing, they were in force 30 yrs. ago, and nothing changed.
Like I say above, we are asked to return 5% and cry reverse racism.....lol.
I have stats on the farcical and baseless emotional whining that is done regarding letting loose our grip on all the marbles. Come on, please let my friends have one. Just one, and if you could.....offer it with a smile. Happily, modestly, with respect. Not begrudgingly, tossed to them in disgust, like the character Cartmann on SouthPark, who hates to share. Its nice to share.
Regarding your defense of the tuberculosis murders of little Native boys and girls. Murders. They forced children who had tb to share beds with those that did not! That is murder. I despair sometimes while I explain to defenders of the genocide, why their position is bull#, that is sorely lacking in actual research, yet willingly offered as legitimate reasons for the crimes against humanity......

And regarding your hopeful proposal that 'it has been fixed, has it not?'
NOt a damn chance. The little childrens graves are still being sought out by the sisters and brothers who somehow didn't catch TB despite sleeping next to a sibling that did. And they are getting no help from the institutions that funded the program supposedly set up to 'civilize' these children.
I feel they were the civil ones, we are the barbarians, the best killers of all time, we can #kick like no other warriors. Our pointed sticks kick ass.
the barbarians won, and wrote the record of their passage, ever so slightly editting it.
And everyone is happy to swallow it whole.
.....good luck people, see you on the other side.



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 12:33 PM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid
Here is pretty good proof that canada is no longer a "friend" to the US or Israel. Time to build a wall....................


Dark Days. (The black band on ATS)



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 12:37 PM
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Originally posted by AceOfBase

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Here is pretty good proof that canada is no longer a "friend" to the US or Israel. Time to build a wall....................


Dark Days. (The black band on ATS)


Are you going to do this on every post there ACE. This thread is 4 pages long. Is it your intent to drive all opposing views off "your" ATS?

Add something or GO AWAY.



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid
Are you going to do this on every post there ACE. This thread is 4 pages long. Is it your intent to drive all opposing views off "your" ATS?

Add something or GO AWAY.


Only on threads in which you deliberately post inflammatory comments to elicit a response.



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 12:48 PM
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Originally posted by AceOfBase

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Are you going to do this on every post there ACE. This thread is 4 pages long. Is it your intent to drive all opposing views off "your" ATS?

Add something or GO AWAY.


Only on threads in which you deliberately post inflammatory comments to elicit a response.


So now its about "harrassment" of opposing views and opinions. Is your "view" the only one that counts? Are only "passive" posts OK with you?

I will not enter into this BS with you.

This is an obvious attempt to get this thread closed becuase you don't like the subject.



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 12:57 PM
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Drogo and Blackguard,

You both make very valid points. As a Canadian, I can honestly say that I don't think we should ever excuse or forget the horrors we have done to others, it becomes too easy to do them again when there is no point of reference.

But we also did make some mistakes as well in accepting boatloads of displaced and illegal immigrants.

[edit on 3/17/05 by SomewhereinBetween]



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 01:01 PM
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DrHoracid,

You're obviously stiring the pot for your own purposes, nary have I come across a rational argument from you. You are either very ignorant, or pulling peoples legs on this site to see what sort of reaction you will get.

Canada, if anything, is years ahead of the American style democracy in certain regards.

You should read the link yourself before making haste with ignorant remarks.




Investigators with Halton Region police said that while the comments by Dr. Mohamed Elmasry "were described by many as [a] hate crime," they did not meet the legal definitio





"The comments were made during a free-flowing discussion between subject-matter experts who were encouraged to express their opinions openly on a topic of significant public interest."


Deep



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 01:09 PM
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Originally posted by ZeroDeep
DrHoracid,

You're obviously stiring the pot for your own purposes, nary have I come across a rational argument from you. You are either very ignorant, or pulling peoples legs on this site to see what sort of reaction you will get.

Canada, if anything, is years ahead of the American style democracy in certain regards.

You should read the link yourself before making haste with ignorant remarks.




Investigators with Halton Region police said that while the comments by Dr. Mohamed Elmasry "were described by many as [a] hate crime," they did not meet the legal definitio





"The comments were made during a free-flowing discussion between subject-matter experts who were encouraged to express their opinions openly on a topic of significant public interest."


Deep


Sometimes the "pot" needs more fire to bring it to a boil and cook the contents. PC laws against "hate" speech are being selectively enforced.

I suspect since this "GUY" is muslim he is getting a pass. The law is quite specific................



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 01:19 PM
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Specific enough for the law to waver his remarks. Read a bit more carefully. The police force did not determine it as a hate crime.

Deep



posted on Mar, 17 2005 @ 01:28 PM
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Originally posted by ZeroDeep
Specific enough for the law to waver his remarks. Read a bit more carefully. The police force did not determine it as a hate crime.

Deep


That is the whole point, the law requires "subjective" opinion to enforce. Its not like robery, or murder. The whole idea of "hate" speech is silly. It requires "thought" police to determine the "facts" not actual "evidence' of a crime.



posted on Mar, 24 2005 @ 05:03 PM
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Dr. Sometimes these people remind me of the black knight in that scene from Monty Python's Holy Grail movie. You know the one where King Arthur confronts the black knight and proceeds to cut off his arms and legs , one by one. At the end, the stump of a black knight is left still "standing" and screaming at Arthur to come back and fight like a man.

I think that this scene is a good metaphor for what you have done to these people in this thread (and many others). In other words, even though their arguments are logically dead, they still keep trying to fight back. Time to let them 'die' in peace on this one.

One for all and all for one!



posted on Mar, 24 2005 @ 05:09 PM
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Im really getting tired of hearing you bash every country that does not want to love america. Technically it was not a hate crime, thats no diffrent than saying american soldiers can shoot at adult male iraqis who dont halt at borders. He is stating a fact, and probably saying that adults are targets and children should not be. He made absolutly no threat what so ever, and he did not start something that would result in more isreals getting killed (their war has been going on for a while.)

You know what DR maybe our way fo thinking in the great north is not as bad as you think, maybe europes is not that bad either, becouse from what i can remeber your country has more murders, rapes, hate related crime, pregudice against african americans than any other European country.

And if i remeber correctly with the way canada and europe run can be all that bad cause you where the guys who got their heads kicked in 4 years ago.



posted on Mar, 24 2005 @ 08:46 PM
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Nurse Horacid seems to think trolling is justified and permitted under the guise of "opinion". He also asks that people add something or go away, yet I don't see how his comments add anything to his own discussion but points to his membership by infuriating others into responding.

For the sake of conversation, America is never going to build a wall between it and Canada. America is never going to invade Canada. Canada will always do as it does regardless of what you think about it, Nurse Horacid, because you are a nobody like everyone else.

Get yourself into congress and then your boohoo posts might take on some relevance.



posted on Mar, 25 2005 @ 09:14 PM
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Originally posted by centurion1211
Dr. Sometimes these people remind me of the black knight in that scene from Monty Python's Holy Grail movie. You know the one where King Arthur confronts the black knight and proceeds to cut off his arms and legs , one by one. At the end, the stump of a black knight is left still "standing" and screaming at Arthur to come back and fight like a man.

I think that this scene is a good metaphor for what you have done to these people in this thread (and many others). In other words, even though their arguments are logically dead, they still keep trying to fight back. Time to let them 'die' in peace on this one.

One for all and all for one!


And you get to keep the loot. That is a good deal for the pillagers, but not so good for the pillagees. I guess the people who our government victimized and abused, as well as their parents who were robbed of their homes by invading hordes of colonialist thieves, all just have to accept it. If they dare demand recompense, the imperialist oppressors cry foul, and see nothing wrong with their own land grab.

"Bring out your dead."
"Here you go." 'But I'm not dead yet....'
"Sorry, I can't take him, rules you know."
"Aw, c'mon, do me a favour ($ is exchanged). He won't last the week."
"Oh, allright, bring him around the back here." Thwack!
The old man's now dead body is heaped onto the cart.....
"Bring out your dead."



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 09:27 PM
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Originally posted by cargo
Get yourself into congress and then your boohoo posts might take on some relevance.



Hmmm. Any way we could get you and zi2525 to stand right next to ZeroDeep when he lets that arrow go? Just kidding, of course.


Seriously, if Canada continues its open door policy to terrorists, you might well be surprised - and wrong.

And to zi2525, I doubt anyone was able to comprehend the meaning of your last post - except that you are anti-U.S. You want to try again to make some kind of logical point?


[edit on 3/26/2005 by centurion1211]



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 09:51 PM
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Originally posted by centurion1211
Seriously, if Canada continues its open door policy to terrorists, you might well be surprised - and wrong.


You know it would never happen. America invade Canada? That's hilarious. For the sake of hypotheticals, you also realise that if it ever did happen you would have young fighting aged commonwealth men beating down the recruitment centre doors for a pair of boots and a rifle. Ready to defend our cousin.

How would you feel about attacking your British, Scottish, Australian, New Zealand etc. allies? Is that how you feel about everything we have done for you over the last 50 years?

[edit on 26-3-2005 by cargo]



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 10:38 PM
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*SNIP*

[edit on 3/11/2005 by Mirthful Me]



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 10:39 PM
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Isn't every crime a hate crime? You don't do bad things to people that you love.



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