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A chance for the left to lead

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posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 02:22 PM
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originally posted by: Gnawledge
a reply to: TheRedneck

Yeah the initial response was insane. But it's a new virus. No one knows what to do. We know masks help and social distancing helps.



you said that. I have to think you believe and understand that. Yet, rather than fully grasp that, and know that Trump or any other world leader who had to lead during this, knew the same amount of nothing when this all started. So bashing his decisions is easy, but understanding why he made them, isn't part of your vocabulary. Again, he didn't go lone wolf on this and forge his own way, he had several well known people who claimed to be experts there to help him along. And largely his decisions were theirs. And wait for it, they were praised for their good job and he was chastised for it. (and again, it's both the same things)

So forgive me when I see the rhetoric and I just ignore it completely.

Intellectual honesty. It's a thing, I swear.




posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 02:43 PM
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originally posted by: network dude
With regard to the Corona Virus, we have heard all about the failures of the current administration. So in light of that, I'd like to hear how we move forward. What steps need to take place. Do we open schools, do we open work back up? Do we change how we currently operate? (if we don't, then it's super hard to discern what the current admin did wrong)

I ask all this, as it's always easy to Monday morning quarterback a situation, but very difficult to get it right, when you know nothing of past experience, never having been in this situation. But as it seems, when there is plenty of criticism, there MUST be plenty of answers.

There are plenty of "Orange Man Bad" threads out there, and I get that if you don't like Trump, you hate Trump, so we can leave all that out of this, and just focus on what you would do going forward to do a better job, and get the nation through this crisis.

So here is your chance. The smart ones. Please, lay out the path going forward. lead by example, and show us the way.


With regards to Coronavirus, here's what you DON'T DO:

DON'T

Yank the entire carpet out from the middle class living room. In the middle of a pandemic, while people are mandated to stay at home, end additional benefits that are keeping the economy afloat.

No, you can't work. No, we won't compensate you.

That sums up the beginning and end of what's wrong with the Republican Party today, and why they have to go.. Immediately.

If there ever was a suspicion that this party was not in Congress to serve but to jerk off each other and their rich friends, this is absolute confirmation.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 02:45 PM
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a reply to: TheRedneck

Well said. Where are you located? If it's close enough I might run over and buy you an adult beverage of your choice.

You left one thing out though. Through out this whole mess there's been a bunch of b*llsh*t studies done. The results and information has been slanted to promote the Liberal hype about the virus. Other legitimate studies with results that go against the Liberal view have been removed from websites or have been discredited by people who don't have the qualifications to discredit them'

I've posted here and in other places that I believe that masks are doing more harm than good. I get the "you want to kill me or Grandma crowd" or "where did you get your degree in virology ?" crowd.

Let me explain one simple thing. Once the virus leaves an infected host it's spread or travel isn't a medical problem anymore. It is a Physics problem. That's my field. I have a Bachelors Degree in Mechanical Engineering. I have a side business doing 3D Heat and Flow Modeling. Most of those jobs are for cooling electronic devices efficiently.
If you cough or sneeze and you aim it away from people the majority of your expectorant is in the form of heavy drops that fall out of the air quickly, with a little remaining in the air as a mist. When you cough or sneeze through a mask, the mesh in the mask's material acts like a diffuser, breaking up those heavy drops into a mist, that most of goes straight up into the air right past your eyes.

Many people say "you are wearing a mask to protect others". BS. If they understood the science they would freak. So now I have sneezed, I'm wearing a mask, so instead of the heavy drops falling to the ground, I've made a nice mist cloud. You come into the area and the mist gets on you, some of it on your mask. Your skin oils help to contain or kill bacteria and viruses, so the ones that land on your skin are dealt with. In the mean time the ones that land on your mask are in a nice warm moist area and have no threat against them. So through out the day, you are accumulating the virus on your freaking mask.

Anybody get any specifics on the material to use to make a mask? I have a box of the N95's that has a warning label on the side saying "Not for protection from Coronavirus". How do you clean a mask? How do you properly dispose of a used disposable mask? I have seen cloth masks in stores with a label saying "Wash cold, Line Dry". Think that through.


edit on 21-8-2020 by JIMC5499 because: typo



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 03:37 PM
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a reply to: Ththema

I have to ask, who told you this was the case?



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 03:40 PM
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a reply to: JIMC5499

most of the masks I see are made of tshirt material. So way better then N95. But as long as you have one of them on, Karen won't say a word.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:19 PM
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a reply to: network dude

Ok.

Trump or any other world leader would have f'ed it up equally. Because it's new and no one know a proper respose.

I Tust Doctors more than politicians though. Not all...but, Fauci and Birx know more than Trump. That's one of my criticiisms.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:22 PM
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a reply to: Gnawledge

But Trump took his lead from those two. THEY TOLD HIM WHAT TO DO!!

This is the crux, the big picture, the whole enchilada. He did was he was told to do. And you praise them, and hate him. And you can't see how that might be wrong!!!!!!!!!!????????????



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:22 PM
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a reply to: network dude

Oh yeah, I don't blame Trump entirely for the failed Covid response.

It's new. I blame him for lack of leadership.

He could have failed with good effort. But he just did nothing and passed the buck.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:33 PM
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a reply to: Gnawledge

just admit it. He can't do anything to appear good in your eyes. It's OK. You aren't alone.

But he will be here to rebuild this economy. And we really need that right now. It will help everyone, even you. So curse him while you are at the bank depositing your paycheck. He will get by.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:38 PM
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a reply to: network dude

Ok. i admit it. He can't. Hasn't. Hasn't change my life one bit other than he is loud.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:42 PM
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a reply to: JIMC5499


Well said. Where are you located? If it's close enough I might run over and buy you an adult beverage of your choice.

Well, your mini profile show Pittsburg, so it would be a little more than a short hop for you. But hey, if you're ever going to be around NE Alabama, give me a shout. I keep the fridge stocked with PBR and there's no one to bitch about noise and crap out here.

Hell, I might rustle up some voo-doo... it's strictly for medicinal purposes, you understand...


Once the virus leaves an infected host it's spread or travel isn't a medical problem anymore. It is a Physics problem. That's my field. I have a Bachelors Degree in Mechanical Engineering. I have a side business doing 3D Heat and Flow Modeling. Most of those jobs are for cooling electronic devices efficiently.

3D heat flow?


My degrees are in Electronic Engineering. I have delved into that mass of confusion you refer to a time or two working out heat flow for heavy-duty equipment. You, sir, just impressed the crap outta me. I have one project, a high-current high-voltage (< 20A, < 50V) power supply for some magnetic test equipment I have on hold... the needed heat transfer is so high that I am loathe to try and assemble it. One minor mistake could turn that thing into a decent sized firepit... and that is using hybrid design to minimize heat loss!

And yes, it's all physics. It's physics even before the sneeze or cough happens, but we don't understand the physics inside the body as well as we do the physics outside the body.

The information on the mask usage is quite interesting. Also interesting is the fact that this virus is cumulative in its infectiousness. Wearing a mask for a long period, consistently breathing in virus particles trapped from the air would indeed be quite the easy way to increase severity of infections. It could easily turn out that wearing a mask is the single easiest method to assure a serious infection.

The surgical-style masks are intended to be worn in medical situations where diseases such as staph are a known transmission risk and patients may be in compromised conditions (like me with my heart being used to practice knitting technique). The risk of infecting an are inside the body which is not normally infectable due to physical barriers is quite serious, so medical personnel use a variety of PPE of which the face mask is one item. Under more normal conditions, the PPE is protecting areas which are already protected by natural immunity and are not as susceptible to most infections.

The cloth masks? I used to wear a bandana when dealing with some particularly noxious chemicals. The amount of filtration is minimal; I could still smell most of them, but the bandana did make it a little easier to take. I cannot believe they do much of anything to stop viral spread, but accumulating the virus over time? That is easy to believe!

I am starting to wonder if this mask mandate crap is not partly responsible for the increased number of cases. I still believe a large part of it is due to increased testing, but that does not preclude other causes from having significant contribution.

TheRedneck



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 04:54 PM
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originally posted by: Gnawledge
a reply to: network dude

Ok. i admit it. He can't. Hasn't. Hasn't change my life one bit other than he is loud.



I hope you have ear plugs. I doubt he's going to change much at his age. Just relish in the fact that he is very good at being loud, the best. He knows more about it than anyone.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 05:02 PM
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originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Gnawledge
a reply to: network dude

Ok. i admit it. He can't. Hasn't. Hasn't change my life one bit other than he is loud.



I hope you have ear plugs. I doubt he's going to change much at his age. Just relish in the fact that he is very good at being loud, the best. He knows more about it than anyone.


I like loud music. Not Loud presidents. And very good at being loud? FFS. if that is your standard....



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 05:47 PM
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originally posted by: Gnawledge

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Gnawledge
a reply to: network dude

Ok. i admit it. He can't. Hasn't. Hasn't change my life one bit other than he is loud.



I hope you have ear plugs. I doubt he's going to change much at his age. Just relish in the fact that he is very good at being loud, the best. He knows more about it than anyone.


I like loud music. Not Loud presidents. And very good at being loud? FFS. if that is your standard....


You need to get a beer or something. Your ability to sense humor is weak to non existent.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 05:49 PM
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a reply to: Gnawledge

I wouldn't call it a "standard," but consider this: Jimmy Carter is one of the most respectable men to have ever held the office of President. He is about a half-notch shy of sainthood IMO, if for nothing else then for Habitat for Humanity. Wonderful human being.

And until Obama, the worst President of my life. It was Carter who put Saddam Hussein in power; it was Carter who hid the Shah of Iran and caused the Iranian Hostage Crisis. It was Carter who allowed gasoline to spike up from a few cents a gallon to nearly a dollar (yes, it was that cheap) and had miles-long lines across the country waiting for their gas ration. It was Carter who couldn't manage to get our people out for well over a year.

Great man; terrible President.

Now Trump... yeah, he''s loud, he's boisterous, he's even irritating at times. He uses a lot of hyperbole. He takes great pleasure in tormenting his political enemies. He can spin the media around his little finger and make them concentrate on any story he wishes. He tweets too much. He's a New York real estate tycoon. Yeah, I agree with all that, and chances are I wouldn't enjoy talking to him.

And he is the first President in my lifetime who has kept most of his promises. He is building a southern border wall which we were promised under Reagan. He has stimulated the economy more and faster than anyone I have seen. He removed the useless, job-killing regulatory red tape that had everything bogged down. He actually protects the 2nd Amendment. He implemented criminal justice reform after the last what? 4? 5? Presidents talked about it. He made some temporary progress negotiating with North Korea, more than any President since the war started, and got the remains of our soldiers returned. He just signed an EO guaranteeing insurers must accept pre-existing conditions. He pretty much eliminated terrorism in the US... I haven't heard about anyone blowing something up while screaming "Allah Akbar" lately, anyway. When Congress refused to help the workers who were out of work due to government mandates, Trump did what he could by EO.

Probably a lousy human being; great President.

I have never voted for a President based on liking them personally (well, not since Carter) or wanting them to hold my moral compass or anything like that. I vote based on what they will do. A politician can talk for two days straight and never say a damn thing; that's just what they do. Trump says what he needs to say in 10 seconds and then has to fill the time afterward. I don't want someone to talk to me; I want someone to do the damn job. Talking without doing is useless.

Even if I were leaning away from voting for Trump over the virus, Biden stated openly he would not have banned air travel from China. That air travel ban, according to Dr. Anthony Fauci, saved many, many American lives. So Biden would have certainly done a much worse job than Trump from the very start; he would have refused to listen to Dr. Fauci by his own admission.

If someone wants to call that "cultish," well, it's not but they can call it that all they want I guess. There's no law against being wrong.

TheRedneck



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 06:00 PM
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a reply to: network dude

YOU'LL HEAR FROM THE POLITICIANS SORRY WE CAN'T DO THAT SORRY WE CAN'T DO THAT SORRY WE CAN'T DO THAT. Sorry but we're just going to have to get used to it.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 06:35 PM
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originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Gnawledge

I wouldn't call it a "standard," but consider this: Jimmy Carter is one of the most respectable men to have ever held the office of President. He is about a half-notch shy of sainthood IMO, if for nothing else then for Habitat for Humanity. Wonderful human being.

And until Obama, the worst President of my life. It was Carter who put Saddam Hussein in power; it was Carter who hid the Shah of Iran and caused the Iranian Hostage Crisis. It was Carter who allowed gasoline to spike up from a few cents a gallon to nearly a dollar (yes, it was that cheap) and had miles-long lines across the country waiting for their gas ration. It was Carter who couldn't manage to get our people out for well over a year.

Great man; terrible President.

Now Trump... yeah, he''s loud, he's boisterous, he's even irritating at times. He uses a lot of hyperbole. He takes great pleasure in tormenting his political enemies. He can spin the media around his little finger and make them concentrate on any story he wishes. He tweets too much. He's a New York real estate tycoon. Yeah, I agree with all that, and chances are I wouldn't enjoy talking to him.

And he is the first President in my lifetime who has kept most of his promises. He is building a southern border wall which we were promised under Reagan. He has stimulated the economy more and faster than anyone I have seen. He removed the useless, job-killing regulatory red tape that had everything bogged down. He actually protects the 2nd Amendment. He implemented criminal justice reform after the last what? 4? 5? Presidents talked about it. He made some temporary progress negotiating with North Korea, more than any President since the war started, and got the remains of our soldiers returned. He just signed an EO guaranteeing insurers must accept pre-existing conditions. He pretty much eliminated terrorism in the US... I haven't heard about anyone blowing something up while screaming "Allah Akbar" lately, anyway. When Congress refused to help the workers who were out of work due to government mandates, Trump did what he could by EO.

Probably a lousy human being; great President.

I have never voted for a President based on liking them personally (well, not since Carter) or wanting them to hold my moral compass or anything like that. I vote based on what they will do. A politician can talk for two days straight and never say a damn thing; that's just what they do. Trump says what he needs to say in 10 seconds and then has to fill the time afterward. I don't want someone to talk to me; I want someone to do the damn job. Talking without doing is useless.

Even if I were leaning away from voting for Trump over the virus, Biden stated openly he would not have banned air travel from China. That air travel ban, according to Dr. Anthony Fauci, saved many, many American lives. So Biden would have certainly done a much worse job than Trump from the very start; he would have refused to listen to Dr. Fauci by his own admission.

If someone wants to call that "cultish," well, it's not but they can call it that all they want I guess. There's no law against being wrong.

TheRedneck


I'm sorry I cam't speak to Carter really, I'm 42. But Trump has benefited you?

He's done nothing for me. I'd rather have a do nothing president than him. I'm just sick of his reality show b.s. He has done nothing but divide and go for ratings.



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 08:08 PM
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a reply to: Gnawledge


I'm sorry I cam't speak to Carter really, I'm 42. But Trump has benefited you?

Yes. And just as important, he has benefited those around me, my friends and family.

Personally... Trump (or at least someone that answers his mail) benefited me directly. After my heart surgery when the fatigue became too much for me to work (I literally cannot walk more than a 100 feet or so at a time without resting an hour), my wife wrote to him with my dilemma. I told her not to; in my experience no politician ever answers letters with anything more than a request for funds. Well, this time I was wrong... she got back a personalized letter explaining that while the White House couldn't help me, they were forwarding my info on to someone who could. OK, at least they didn't ask me for money, right? A week or so later Social Security called me! The agent went over my situation, then took my application for disability on the phone, then told me to expect a turndown at first but to hire a lawyer and appeal. I did. 18 months later, a month away from absolute indigence, I had my hearing and was approved. Two weeks after that I had my first check in hand. I have been told that to get disability that fast is unheard of... usually it takes 2 to 3 years and then a few months to get the money.

For those around me... when Trump took office, there were no jobs. Most stores were empty with "For Lease" signs in the window. The only job someone could get was a part-time grunt job at minimum wage with no benefits. Within six months of his election, I started seeing help wanted signs popping up everywhere. These were full time jobs with benefits. Wages started rising; now you have to hunt for a minimum wage job, because everything pays more. Most stores are open again. My son has gone back to college and switched careers so he is making about 50% more. My daughter is going back to school and just started a more lucrative career. The only people I knew of that were still unemployed were junkies and goof-offs... and some of them had jobs!

The local area started thriving... people could afford more. Houses started being built again. It was literally like the area had come back from the dead. Of course, the virus put a hiatus on all that, but I figure if he did it once, he can do it again.


I'm just sick of his reality show b.s. He has done nothing but divide and go for ratings.

I look past the BS. I look at what actual difference he has made, and it is day and night. If he can help people make a decent living, he can sing "Mammy" from the rooftop naked for all I care.

As for division... that was already there before Trump even started his campaign. It started before Reagan. The division is each party wanting to have all the power. The only way to remove the division is for both parties to be in total power at the same time; anything else is worked up into divisive politics.

I would like for the country to be united again as well. The last time it was, was right after 911. But united does not mean anyone is forced to give up everything... that isn't uniting; that is surrender. It's not just Trump that is dividing the country; it's the other side just as much. No matter which one wins, the division will continue.

Compromise is the soul of unification... the entire country was founded on compromise. But compromise means both sides give up something and get something. It seems politicians today consider "compromise" to be them getting everything they want without giving anything up. As long as that attitude prevails, the nation will be divided. Trump or no Trump, won't matter.

According to the anti-Trump crowd, we could unite only if everyone gave up their guns, gave up all their income for taxes, and virtue signaled about whatever cause they were told to virtue signal about. Nothing else will suffice, and I am not going to do that. That is tyranny.

TheRedneck



posted on Aug, 21 2020 @ 10:22 PM
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originally posted by: TheRedneck
a reply to: Gnawledge


I'm sorry I cam't speak to Carter really, I'm 42. But Trump has benefited you?

Yes. And just as important, he has benefited those around me, my friends and family.



That's just downright dishonest. All aspects of American life are currently worse than they were right years ago, by every discernable statistic and countable number. And there's no argument.

GDP is down. Spending is down. Employment is down. The economy is teetering on the brink.

Trump slashed social security and disability benefits in January of this year.

That's great that you think that your letter to the white house fast tracked you ahead of everyone else with a disability claim, but your checks were slashed by Trump.



posted on Aug, 22 2020 @ 12:52 AM
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a reply to: Ththema


Trump slashed social security and disability benefits in January of this year.

That is an absolute lie. My checks have not dropped any. As a matter of fact, I received a COLA increase this past January.

Go peddle those lies to someone who might believe it.

TheRedneck




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