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Iraqi general killed by US at checkpoint.

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posted on Mar, 20 2005 @ 08:37 PM
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Originally posted by AceOfBase

It would only take once time and then I would demand that you stop occupying my country and hitting me in the face with your balls.

Heh...
That's just a little too much information there guys - LOL




posted on Mar, 20 2005 @ 08:43 PM
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So to answer your question,
What vested interest does al Qaeda have in murdering innocent civilians in Iraq?

Same interest as the US have.
Both sought to create a utopian world through world domination; both believe that the ends justify the means; both are convinced that "the people" must be frightened into embracing religion and nationalism for the greater good of morality and a stable state. Each needs the other in order to hold power.

Who is Right and who is Wrong here?

If you use the metric of intentionally murdering civilians, on a daily basis, the answer is obvious.

I think we've had this discussion before, as relates to the definition of a terrorist.

Which nationalism does al Qaeda embrace?



posted on Mar, 20 2005 @ 11:58 PM
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Very good point. Bombers' tactics tho' would vary depending on the target

With most VCP set ups you have a stopper, 2/3 guys as search team but most of your troops would be further back as a cut-off group / QRF to prevent any crash-throughs getting far. So with a VCP the suicide bomber's choice is approaching slowly to take out 3/4 guys or slow then quick to go for the main group. Properly set-up they present a poor target

With a perimeter / entrance check the 'main prize' for the suicide bomber will be well inside / behind the checkpoint so speed would be the bombers' tactic of choice.

As ever altering of routine / position makes the chance of a successful suicide bomber attack much less likely. Inherent laziness of troops makes altering routine unpopular and thus quality of NCO's / Junior Officers is very important in being effective / staying alive.



posted on Mar, 21 2005 @ 02:18 AM
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it is very possible that many of thes Iraqis don't know English and aren't understanding what these soldiers are shouting at them......I am sure that could be very frightening causing a lapse in judgement and common sense.....how much blame can you put on the soldiers as opposed to the Iraqi's.....the fact is you will never truly prove what any person's intent is unless you can read their mind....you don ot know if someone is thinking ''I want to protect myself'', or ''I want to kill someone''.....I would like to give the benefit of the doubt to the soldiers as well as the Iraqi people.....for whatever the reasons, most of these people are doing something they would not normally do in any other situation.....not everyone will always be right because that is impossible, but I say try hard to make your wrongs on the little things....the things that do not kill



posted on Mar, 21 2005 @ 02:40 AM
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Maybe the general thought that the curfew was for people of lesser rank



posted on Mar, 21 2005 @ 02:51 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky

So to answer your question,
What vested interest does al Qaeda have in murdering innocent civilians in Iraq?

Same interest as the US have.
Both sought to create a utopian world through world domination; both believe that the ends justify the means; both are convinced that "the people" must be frightened into embracing religion and nationalism for the greater good of morality and a stable state. Each needs the other in order to hold power.

Who is Right and who is Wrong here?

If you use the metric of intentionally murdering civilians, on a daily basis, the answer is obvious.


The Iraqi resistance doesn't consider those it kills to be civilians. It considers them terrorist sympathizers, for working with the American occupation. In their mind, killing innocents would be deplorable, but they see their countrymen betraying their nation, and to both prove a point and affect meaningful damage on the war machine being constructed internally, they target the sympathizers.

The sympathizers can't get any work except with the American occupation, so I feel for them, but they sold out their country's former goverment (which is still active; courts, police, executions, military, inteligence, the works).

Remember all those Iraqi policemen found shot in the back of the head lying out in the desert? They were tried, sentenced, and executed according to statutes against treason. They made their decision to side with the invaders, and they paid the ultimate price.

The Iraqi resistance may be wrong to us, and we may be wrong to them, but there is no absolute right in this scenario. It's ultimately a question of paradigm.



posted on Mar, 21 2005 @ 04:47 AM
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Originally posted by jsobecky
If you use the metric of intentionally murdering civilians, on a daily basis, the answer is obvious.

I think we've had this discussion before, as relates to the definition of a terrorist.

Which nationalism does al Qaeda embrace?

Murdering civilians on a dailly basis?
I did not know that you were SO worried about the lives of innocent civilians, that are killed on daily basis. That's because you are not. You are just using their misery and suffering for your own anti-terrorist agenda.

What about thousands of innocent civilans in DR Congo being killed on daily basisi? Or Rwanda? What about those people? Dont they deserve to be saved like the Iraqi people do?

See, your concern for the "innocent civilans" is very relative. You use them as a shield against terror and for your pro-american agenda. As I have told you before, tribal war in Middle East is very much still going on. Tribes and clerics have fought each other for a long long time before any of the White Men came here to divide and conquer.

But it is not that easy to solve this problem. This is not just a thing of the present, but a thing of the past. And you can not erase the past. Everybody knows what has happened and they all remember it very well! And still, even with everybody aware of the historical facts, history keeps repeating itself.

Do you know how many people came to Middle East to conquer?

Do you think they were treated as liberators or as conquerors?



posted on Mar, 21 2005 @ 05:00 AM
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Originally posted by DYepes

My cousin has only recently returned from 6 years in the Army. I have friends and co-workers who have done anywhere from 4-12 years in the armed forces and know a handful of veterans from the Vietnam war. And I am sorry to break it to you, none of them are career killers or condone murder in any way, shape, or form.


Sooo pray telll what did these people do in the army then?!?!?


Hand out seasonal greeting cards?!?!?



Get real man you get a backpack and a gun and are told to point it a cirtain way! Not much more than that!!!

Yes i know they also learn a trade... but thats so they dont COMPLETELY waste their time learning how to kill!



posted on Mar, 21 2005 @ 09:07 PM
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Originally posted by Silenus
Maybe the general thought that the curfew was for people of lesser rank


Granted, mistakes happen no-one's denying it - it's the number of mistakes and the lack of follow-up investigation / castigation that's concerning. It seems symptomatic of a unwritten policy to shoot the Iraqis into submission - I'm trying to be kind by suggesting it's just poor quality soldiering.



posted on Mar, 22 2005 @ 01:05 PM
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corinthas,
does it occur to you that there are ppl eho join the military and dont hold a combat or combat support mos? what about the admin specialists? guess they are just cold blooded killers who spend most of thier time filling papers waiting for the chance to gun some ppl down. Get real buddy, go out and get informed about a topic before you post about it. Honestly you are absolutely ridiculous in assuming and thinking that all members of the military are killers. Newsflash they arent.



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