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If we have to cancel Columbus........

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posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 04:58 AM
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Columbus lived in a different era and it is wrong to judge people by todays standards. Who knows in 500+ years people may well be looking back at the end of the 20th and beginning of the 21st century and thinking about those savages who made people work for them for so little financial reward, how barbaric was that.




posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 05:50 AM
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a reply to: network dude

The people in the US are from those countries you dumb dumb. Shared ancestry.



posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 07:16 AM
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originally posted by: ziplock9000
a reply to: network dude

The people in the US are from those countries you dumb dumb. Shared ancestry.


Wow, I had no idea. I'm not sure how to process this new information.

I can' thank you enough for bringing this to my attention. I have went through my whole life and never quite knew what was missing, and now I do. This explains that big statue the French sent us. Again, super post and thanks again for sharing that bit of amazing news.



posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 07:50 AM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis




There don't need to be any for you to understand what I'm asking

Are the statues more important than the crimes they're honoring?


Actually, there does need to be a statue if you want me to comment on it's legitimacy. I don't like the picture if Adolph in your living room, or is there not one there?

But I will pass on something you likely missed along the way.
When I arrived at Pope AFB, my first duty station in the AF, I was shown the town of Fayetteville. On thing that stood out is the market house. it's in a roudabout in the center of town. I'm not sure of the exact history of it, but I was told they sold things there, among them, slaves. So every time I drove by it that though was in my mind. This was back in the early 90's, and to this day, when I drive by it, I think about slavery and people being sold as objects or animals.

I don't know if that's a good thing or not, but I can assure you, once it's removed, I will no longer worry about such things when I pass that spot, as the reminder will have vanished.

So in my tiny mind, I see these visual reminders as ways to remember things, think about things, and bring about conversations that otherwise would not have happened.

But as I said, as long as it's done correctly, and not in the middle of the night without permission, I cannot argue with the process being followed. I would bet the African American community would be angry if secret mobs of racists took down all the MLK statues in the dark of night. One day, someone may do something that bothers you, and only then will you start to understand your feelz aren't the only feelz out there.


And time will tell how the "defund the police" movement will work out, so far, NYC said it's going "smashingly". But what are a few lives when "the movement" is so much more important.



posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 08:37 AM
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a reply to: network dude



Actually, there does need to be a statue if you want me to comment on it's legitimacy. I don't like the picture if Adolph in your living room, or is there not one there?

No, there really doesn't. I know you understand what I'm asking. Adolph? You really can't help yourself - can you?


don't know if that's a good thing or not, but I can assure you, once it's removed, I will no longer worry about such things when I pass that spot, as the reminder will have vanished.

I don't believe that's true Network. You will always remember it - as you obviously remembered it to me just now


But as I said, as long as it's done correctly, and not in the middle of the night without permission, I cannot argue with the process being followed. I would bet the African American community would be angry if secret mobs of racists took down all the MLK statues in the dark of night.

I agree - mostly. I've already said as much. There's a huge difference in the kinds of feelings between various groups here that I think you're missing. Is it on purpose or can you really not understand that racists taking down statues of MLK is not the same thing as taking down monuments that honor racists. They are symbols of that oppression

This is what strikes me most about this kind of conversation. Even when we agree that there are better ways of handling this, you can't seem to understand why it happened the way it did

When someone who is not white sees that spot you described, they might not appreciate the reminder the same way you do. I can only speak for myself here - but the spot you described is a historic site. The statues are about influence, money, ego and power tripping - not history

Then again, some other people agree with you (and with me. Not that you would ever acknowledge that):
Descendant of Indian chief killed in Sand Creek Massacre wanted Denver's Civil War statue to stay


One day, someone may do something that bothers you, and only then will you start to understand your feelz aren't the only feelz out there.

This isn't about my feelings Network. It's about yours. This is what got me into this thread:


it does make me wonder, if we can all realize how horrible it was to blame the Japanese Americans just after Pearl harbor, when we put them into camps, why is it not OK to realize that blaming today's white population for the slavery of 4 to 5 generations ago is along the same lines?

Or is that not a valid comparison?

It wasn't cancel culture that got my attention - it was this. Your sense of victimhood. There's too much to discuss here, especially since you don't seem to want a real discussion. I'll just say, part of the reason this country has such a hard time moving forward on all this is because for many it's to difficult to accept that racism still exists. You aren't a racist Network, but your feelings tell you that you are being accused of this - and it makes you so angry that you feel victimized

This is the only difference between you and the SJWs you despise. They understand that racism still exists and they don't take it personally



posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 08:52 AM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis




No, there really doesn't. I know you understand what I'm asking. Adolph? You really can't help yourself - can you?


that bone, it just won't go away, will it.
Just as I would not like a picture of Adolph, I would not vote for a statue commemorating how wonderful an idea it was to put Japanese Americans in a camp. But if others wanted it, and they voted for it, I really wouldn't have a say in it, would I.
When you were asked to vote on the civil war Statues, how did you vote? And please don't ignore the question.




This isn't about my feelings Network. It's about yours. This is what got me into this thread:


it does make me wonder, if we can all realize how horrible it was to blame the Japanese Americans just after Pearl harbor, when we put them into camps, why is it not OK to realize that blaming today's white population for the slavery of 4 to 5 generations ago is along the same lines?

Or is that not a valid comparison?


And yet, you haven't discussed this aspect of it yet.

Note the part at the end, it was put there to offer alternative views.
It's my position that segregating us by race is bad. do you A. agree, or B. disagree?
It's my position that blaming today's generation for atrocities committed by people who died many years ago isn't fair. do you A, agree, or B. disagree?

This was the crux of my discussion. If you could simply answer the two question with A. or B., that would be super.

And it's about everyone's feelings, not just mine, not just yours, and not just the 12 assholes who took down a statue. Do you A. understand that, or B. need more clarification?



posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 09:08 AM
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a reply to: network dude




When you were asked to vote on the civil war Statues, how did you vote? And please don't ignore the question.

I've already given you my opinion on this - several times. You aren't interested in my answer


This was the crux of my discussion. If you could simply answer the two question with A. or B., that would be super.

I disagree. It is not a valid comparison. You were not put into a camp against your will while being completely innocent of any crime. You are not a victim of anything but having people hurt your feelings



And it's about everyone's feelings, not just mine, not just yours, and not just the 12 assholes who took down a statue. Do you A. understand that, or B. need more clarification?


Nope - still so much about your feelings and needs

I tried. I was hoping you would read some of the things I said and give me a real reply

Someday, when you feel OK about it - maybe we can have a real discussion. When you're not feeling so defensive

Cheers Dude



posted on Jul, 21 2020 @ 09:10 AM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis

sorry, I didn't mean to get over your head, I'll leave it alone.



posted on Jul, 22 2020 @ 12:34 AM
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originally posted by: rickymouse
History is there to show us how we messed up. I know, the victors write history, but sometimes history is recorded and passed on by those who lost too.


And most people aren’t capable of seeing a perspective beyond their own.

They also can’t believe that what they’ve been told their whole life might not actually be “the truth” and reality is far, far more different or twisted than the history books suggest.

What happens when you find out your hero isn’t such a great human, ya know?

I found peace by understanding that “it is what it is” is accurate when you just look at things objectively - stop worrying about being the arbiter of right and wrong, stop considering things through the lens is winning or losing - etc.

When you do that, you’ll see reality - objectively. Bias and emotion are the enemies of wisdom - and ironically at minimum bias gets worse with age right as you’re getting older and theoretically “wiser”.

Kind of explains why people get more set in their ways or ideals as they get older, no?

When you see the real story, you’ll approach yourself and all things objectively and you’ll run circles around the overwhelming majority of humans in most ways...



posted on Jul, 22 2020 @ 11:26 AM
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originally posted by: EnigmaChaser

originally posted by: rickymouse
History is there to show us how we messed up. I know, the victors write history, but sometimes history is recorded and passed on by those who lost too.


And most people aren’t capable of seeing a perspective beyond their own.

They also can’t believe that what they’ve been told their whole life might not actually be “the truth” and reality is far, far more different or twisted than the history books suggest.

What happens when you find out your hero isn’t such a great human, ya know?

I found peace by understanding that “it is what it is” is accurate when you just look at things objectively - stop worrying about being the arbiter of right and wrong, stop considering things through the lens is winning or losing - etc.

When you do that, you’ll see reality - objectively. Bias and emotion are the enemies of wisdom - and ironically at minimum bias gets worse with age right as you’re getting older and theoretically “wiser”.

Kind of explains why people get more set in their ways or ideals as they get older, no?

When you see the real story, you’ll approach yourself and all things objectively and you’ll run circles around the overwhelming majority of humans in most ways...


The movie rolls I actually equate to are ones like Bones on the show Bones and Spock on Star Treck. I get excited by science, but real science, not the crap we are fed by those who want prestige. There is no way in hell that I believe in the big bang theory, mostly because there is no way in hell we could figure it out from this point in space...but it does not stop them from trying to shove that guess down our throats...because we would have to spend billions to prove them wrong since so many people accept their false conclusions.



posted on Jul, 25 2020 @ 01:14 AM
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a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Should the Roman Colosseum be torn down? They used to feed Christians to Lions there.

Should the 'Great' Egyptian Pyramids be torn down? I mean, I heard them Pharaoh types used slaves to build those?

Maybe we need to go and completely wipe Germany and it's people from the map. After all we all know what that place did almost 80 years ago.....

Let's go pull down all the Catholic churches while we're at it, because you know, some catholic priests have been pedophiles throughout history.

If we removed everything that had connections to some human that did #ty things in the past, well I can tell you now, we wouldn't have much left of our 'civilized' world.

Where does one draw the line on which bad parts of history are acceptable or not? Who makes that choice?

I was beaten almost daily during my school life for various stupid reasons. Can I go burn down every school because they remind me of the injustices and abuse I suffered as a child every time I drive past one?

I've been sexually harassed and abused by quite a few female co-workers in the past. Can I go shut down every business that employs females as a result or do I have to just suck it up because I appear to be a Caucasian male despite being mixed genetics?

See where I am going here?

Maybe we need some laws, like a statute of limitations of how long people have before they must just get over sh*t..... Like seriously, we have people still crying about sh*t that happened hundreds of years ago that had ZERO direct impact on them.

Colombus had less to do with peoples current sh*tty lives than their own parents did. But of course you cannot point that out to those people. It's 'victim blaming' or some other imaginary nonsense buzzword.

Why must I get over the actual things I have directly endured, but someone else can raise an army and commit crimes for something that never affected them? Just because I was born the wrong way and no other reason?

Double standards and hypocrisy every where, and nearly every damn human is guilty of it. End of the day it's all about "ME ME ME" and NOT about advancing the entire community. Any one who says otherwise is deluding themselves.

Now excuse me, I am going to stop taking my medicine because I heard the company that makes it used to be affiliated with the Nazi party during the 40's and well I shouldn't be taking meds they make today, I should be plotting to eradicate them obviously.....
edit on 25-7-2020 by AtomicKangaroo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2020 @ 03:41 AM
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a reply to: AtomicKangaroo

Mesoamerican civilizations were literally swimming in the blood of human scarifices, perhaps they should tear down all associated structures such as The Great Pyramid of Tenochtitlan etc.



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