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Seattle Police union leader sounds the alarm - They are coming through the door

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posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 05:24 PM
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originally posted by: RickyD
a reply to: Boadicea

I am not familiar with the situation of the police in Minneapolis. I am familiar with the idea that you don't hire a doctor then tell them how to save lives. You hire the doctor because he knows how and generally those he serves don't.


But we also acknowledge medical malpractice and -- at least in theory -- expect authorities to hold them accountable when they practice bad medicine. If you go in with a sprained ankle, you don't expect the doctor to cut it off at the knee, right?


I do think that communities should have the right and ability to have over sight to make it more difficult for officers breaking the law to get away with their crimes...be it planting evidence, turning a blind eye to the cartels, or unjustly using deadly force. I think that is fair to give the people.


That is more than fair. That is the people's absolute right! It should already be and not even be a question.


Also don't think it would be a bad idea to have police chiefs be elected officals just as Sheriffs are. That introduces more accountability not less...they also would have to take the oath supporting our constitution...which they could be held accountable for breaking.


I'm pretty sure they already do. Someone might know better than me though... Shamrock? Excalibur?


The only people who seem to be ok with defunding police departments are those who can buy or will be provided with security anyway...or the criminals who stand to get away with more crimes.


Well... okay... but I'm pretty sure that's too big a generalization for too many people with too many different ideas of what "defund" the police mean. And it also seems to me that plenty of people are assuming that "defund" only means "no law enforcement whatsoever."

It's just not that simple.




posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 05:30 PM
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a reply to: Boadicea

So should congress/legislators be held accountable for writing bad laws? If not, why should police be held accountable for enforcing them?

Its a double edged sword



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 05:56 PM
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originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Boadicea

You rattle off 3 or 4 names but ignore . This is why that argument falls flat on its face.


I also provided a which lists many more. Do you need me to separately list each death? How many would you like? How many does it take before it matters?

What am I supposed to say about "the hundreds killed in major cities over the last week" in an OP about police and people protesting and rioting about police killings? Am I supposed to be sooooooooooooo afraid of my fellow man killing me that I welcome the chance for a bad cop to kill me instead?


Far fewer people are killed by LEOs than by other private citizens, most of which are gang bangers and crims


Yup. In fact, many -- if not most -- of the victims are also gang bangers and criminals.

However, that fewer people are killed by LEOs than by civilians doesn't mean much. Most murders are committed by someone you know, and for women, it's most likely her boyfriend/husband. However, I've seen numbers crunched that say the odds of being killed by a cop are higher than being killed by a complete stranger.

None of which excuses bad cops doing bad things.


On the rare occassion a police officer screws up and does so maliciously, fine throw the book at them as has been happening


Of course. We can do much more to make sure the bad ones are brought to justice.


But you don't get to create a culture of fear and outright hostility toward LE and then complain when incidences of accidental shootings and overreaction start happening.


Back up. I'm not disagreeing that this has happened and is happening, but the LE aren't completely innocent, and too many -- not all, too many -- have given good reason for people to fear and be outright hostile toward LE. There's plenty of blame to go around for why the people don't trust police.


How about prosecuting those agitating and instigating that puts these officers in fear 24/7/365.


There's plenty of blame to go around.


You don't want police officers coming up to your window when you're passed out in the street? STOP ELECTING MORONS WHO PASS LAWS CRIMINALIZING THIS THEN!

The point is that socialism is always working to remove the impediments to its tyrannical rule over America:

1) Police
2) Armed citizens
3) Shared history/values
4) Objectivity and reason over knee jerk emotionally driven reactions


Of course. The price of freedom is eternal vigilance. If not the socialists, then it's someone else.

And all the more reasons to demand strict accountability and responsibility for all of the above. The socialists (nor Antifa nor BLM nor anyone) could not stoke any flames if the fire wasn't already smoldering.


I'll tell you one thing though they continue kicking the hornet's nest they aren't going to like the results

LEAVE OUR POLICE ALONE!


So more blood in the streets... May Heaven help us all (although I'm pretty sure we don't deserve it).



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 05:57 PM
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originally posted by: a325nt
I'm not a socialist, I just can't recall a single police interaction in thirty years that worked out for me.
Every single time, it's me getting punished for doing something not that unreasonable, but against the law in their eyes.
Every. Single. Time.


Lol like what?



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 06:03 PM
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a reply to: a325nt


Well , that is Because the Police have been Conditioned by Public Crimes to look upon Anyone they encounter during a Call or Investigation as in Police Lingo , a ' Scunbag " . In Most Cases People who commit Crimes ARE SCUMBAGS so can you Blame them then ? If you Obey Our Laws and somehow the Police Treat you Unfairly , then that is what Defense Attorney's are for . Law Enforcement is getting a Bad Rap these Days , but they are the ONLY ONES who are Keeping the Public SAFE from Each other . Love them or Hate Them , they are Necessary .



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 06:07 PM
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originally posted by: JBurns
a reply to: Boadicea

So should congress/legislators be held accountable for writing bad laws?


Well, that should be happening at the ballot box, but I certainly agree that we have far too many ridiculous laws. I would actually like to see some kind of people's referendum process, whereby the people could rescind laws passed by Congress that the people do not approve. Both new and old legislation. We have the technology to give the people much more direct say in the business of running our country.

I think we could also greatly benefit from a nationwide ballot proposition process as well, much like many states have. It would go far to allow new and practical and effective solutions to our sorry old problems. No more crap sandwiches -- the left's crap on one slice of bread, the right's crap on the other slice of bread, and then slapped together and slammed down our throats.

We have a nation full of great minds and thinkers. We can do much better.


If not, why should police be held accountable for enforcing them?

Its a double edged sword


Sheriff Joe used to make that point quite a bit -- "Do you want me to enforce the laws equally? Or do you want me to enforce just the laws I want to enforce?"

But we're not really talking about just "enforcing" laws, are we? We're talking about the unjustified use of excessive force, often lethal force, where it is not reasonable, proportional, justifiable.

We are citizens with rights. Not subservient subjects.



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 06:45 PM
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Be honest and ask yourself why you stop at an intersection without ANY opposing traffic?

Then ask yourself why you're being indirectly taxed for victimless crimes, you know....the big "What If" law library that extorts your hard earned money, is that reaffirming your police loyalty?? (ticketing people is harassment, sorry that's my opinion.)

Cops need to ONLY respond to felony crimes. Get rid of infractions and misdemeanors (which only serve to entrap an individual in the system) and allow folks to PROTECT THEMSELVES.

Why do we put our LIVES in the very hands of the officers who aren't required by law to protect us?!!

There needs to be REFORMATION and AUDITS, not DEFUNDING and ABOLISHMENT.

Stop f#king with the people, and they'll magically stop f#king with the police.

Personally, I've been sick of cops and the law enforcement "agenda" for decades now.

We NEED change, but not the kind of change that sociopaths create or think of.



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 06:55 PM
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a reply to: Boadicea

I don't disagree that bad actors including police officers should be prosecuted. But villifying, demonizing and attacking the entire profession is a losing battle I can guarantee it

Its no different than those who claim to want to save lives by banning an obscure class of firearms while ignoring the multitude of deaths from auto accidents, obesity, smoking & drinking and a host of other much-more-likely-to-kill-you events

No one is giving bad apples a free pass, I haven't see anybody doing it. But the left is putting police in a position where doing their job still results in being demonized and in many cases prosecuted

Look at that criminal Rayshard Brooks, who took an officers taser and attempted to incapacitate him (to take his firearm? beat him to death? escape? what?) or the recent OIS in detroit where the crim actually shot twice at an officer's face, was put down & took the room temp challenge and you STILL had morons like BLM calling for the arrest of that officer

If I have to pick a lesser evil, It won't be the thug gang bangers and criminals ruining our communities and attacking police officers AND private citizens



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:05 PM
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a reply to: EternalShadow




" Cops need to ONLY respond to felony crimes. Get rid of infractions and misdemeanors (which only serve to entrap an individual in the system) and allow folks to PROTECT THEMSELVES. "


Really > ? So , according to your Illogic , a Person would then be Entitled to Blow some guys Head Off With a Firearm because someone Looked at him the " Wrong Way " ? GTFOOH Man , that is just Plain Stupid . Law Enforcement is Trained to Handle Situations like this , the PUBLIC is Not . Misdemeanors are also Crimes , and Law Enforcement is Trained to Handle them too Unlike the Public at large .
edit on 11-7-2020 by Zanti Misfit because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:20 PM
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a reply to: Zanti Misfit

How do you get that though? Most infractions and misdemeanors are indeed victimless crimes designed to extort money or ensnare people in our justice system. Ask why 99% of cases *NEED* to be resolved via plea bargains instead of the true system of justice our founders established for us?

I tend to largely agree, with very few exceptions, that felonious crimes against people and private property are what matter. Not the 1000 page law book our corrupt legislators spew out



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:35 PM
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We all have the responsibility to police our own communities. It doesn't matter what country you are from. The police should be called in when the situation is going no where, or when the situation escalates to the point where harm is either being done or will be done before the situation is resolved. The other reason the police should be called in is when public safety is prevented by individuals infringing on the safety of the public.

If people took more responsibility for their own actions, and reached out to others in their communities that are disrupting the well being of the community, then maybe the police wouldn't have to be involved in as many potential incidents. Another thing that would help stem these ill wills towards the police, is if people stop vilifying every police officer they see, then the police won't have to feel threatened every time they go to a call.

Some of the posters here really need to go to the police near them and see about participating in a ride along (provided they have those programs in their locations). This allows for them to see first hand the issues that the police deal with on a day to day basis, as well as provide a little bit of over sight as to how their community deals with and sees the police.



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:44 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

let the mob come to my house, i will go down fighting.

these people who are causing this mess will run like cockroaches when bullets start flying and the few people playing badass walking around with a gun will get a real nasty surprise when they come up against one or more people who know how to effectively use said weapons



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:47 PM
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a reply to: JBurns


The Extermination of FREE SPEECH in America Circa 2020 is going to be a Complete Failure . WE THE PEOPLE Will Not Allow it !




www.youtube.com...



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:55 PM
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a reply to: JBurns




" How do you get that though? Most infractions and misdemeanors are indeed victimless crimes designed to extort money or ensnare people in our justice system. Ask why 99% of cases *NEED* to be resolved via plea bargains instead of the true system of justice our founders established for us? "


Sorry , I Disagree . Misdemeanors often Effect the Lives of Others besides those who commit them . It's the LAW you Maybe have a Problem with > Then Change them .



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 07:58 PM
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Unions, for better or worse, don't often take kindly to threats to their existence.



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 08:02 PM
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Funny how time changes a person. I was eating lunch with my wife this morning, and a pair of local officers were at the table next to ours. I bought their meal anonymously.

Only a half decade ago, I was a very vocal member of cop-block.org. couldn't stand officers and truly believed they were all bad.

It just isn't true tho. The last three years have given me a new view of the officers.



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 08:09 PM
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a reply to: JBurns

I agree with you far more than I disagree... and I think the good LEOs massively outnumber the bad LEOs.

But I also understand why so many people don't think so, which is because where the cops are dirty, the rot starts at the top, bad cops keep getting away with more and more bad behavior, and for the people living in those jurisdictions, they just don't see the good cops. Minneapolis PD was one of those rotten departments that folks had been trying to clean up for a long time.

Unfortunately, it's very easy for BLM and the other rabble rousers to play off Minneapolis as the norm. It's very easy to play off black victims as the only victims and therefore all police are just racist pigs and police are thee problem -- not policing.

Maybe you remember back when Clinton was elected, and the military they used to hate they suddenly loved, because it was their military now. I see BLM totally playing up the racism, rather than bad policing, because if they get their way, their "policing" will be even worse.

We have to make the appropriate distinctions where and when needed. If a common sense middle ground isn't established -- i.e., keeping good cops, and keep bad cops accountable -- the we get the two extremes, and right now people are more inclined to believe the "all cops are racist pigs" side.



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 08:20 PM
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a reply to: JBurns


Look at that criminal Rayshard Brooks, who took an officers taser and attempted to incapacitate him (to take his firearm? beat him to death? escape? what?)


I meant to say before but forgot...

This situation just makes me sick. As I understand it, there is no doubt that Brooks took an officer's weapon and then tried to use that weapon against the officer. No doubt.

The week before, an officer was charged with discharging a lethal weapon against civilians -- the same lethal weapon that Brooks tried to fire at the officer.

ETA: This is an unacceptable double standard. The police are damned if they do and damned if they don't. If it's a lethal weapon for charging an officer, then it's a lethal weapon to defend against as well!

Do I think the officers should have been able to just sent him home in a taxi? Or driven him home themselves? Sure I do! I think that should have been an option for the officers. But I don't think it was. They did their job. And I hate that they were even put in that situation where what could have been a non-event became an arrestable offense.

Police should be reserved for the heavy lifting. That might be a situation where police could be allowed to defer to addiction or mental health professionals, rather than a broken law that needs to be enforced.
edit on 11-7-2020 by Boadicea because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 09:02 PM
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originally posted by: Bobaganoosh
Funny how time changes a person. I was eating lunch with my wife this morning, and a pair of local officers were at the table next to ours. I bought their meal anonymously.

Only a half decade ago, I was a very vocal member of cop-block.org. couldn't stand officers and truly believed they were all bad.

It just isn't true tho. The last three years have given me a new view of the officers.



To Protect and to Serve , that was the Intent when Law Enforcement was First Established in this Country . Nothing has Changed that Except the People who Exist Today with a Selfish Stupidity of History , and the Concept of Law and Order.........








edit on 11-7-2020 by Zanti Misfit because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 11 2020 @ 09:17 PM
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a reply to: Zanti Misfit

just the facts ma'am







 
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