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N.Y Times: Iraq Had WMD 'Stockpiles' in 2003

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posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 12:57 AM
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N.Y. Times: Iraq Had WMD 'Stockpiles' in 2003

Sunday, March 13, 2005 10:17 a.m. EST
NewsMax.com


In a stunning about-face, the New York Times reported Sunday that when the U.S. attacked Iraq in March 2003, Saddam Hussein possessed "stockpiles of monitored chemicals and materials," as well as sophisticated equipment to manufacture nuclear and biological weapons, which was removed to "a neighboring state" before the U.S. could secure the weapons sites.

The U.N.'s Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission [UNMOVIC] "has filed regular reports to the Security Council since last May," the paper said, "about the dismantlement of important weapons installations and the export of dangerous materials to foreign states."

"Officials of the commission and the [International] Atomic Energy Agency have repeatedly called on the Iraqi government to report on what it knows of the fate of the thousands of pieces of monitored equipment and stockpiles of monitored chemicals and materials."
Last fall, IAEA director Dr. Mohamed ElBaradei confirmed that "nuclear-related materials" had gone missing from monitored sites, calling on Iraqi officials to start the process of accounting for the missing stockpiles still ostensibly under the agency's supervision.

Quoting Sami al-Araji, Iraq's deputy minister of industry since the 1980s, the Times said:

"It appeared that a highly organized operation had pinpointed specific plants in search of valuable equipment, some of which could be used for both military and civilian applications, and carted the machinery away."

Calling the operation "sophisticated," Dr. Araji said the removal effort featured "cranes and the lorries, and they depleted the whole sites," adding, "They knew what they were doing."

The top Iraqi defense official said equipment capable of making parts for missiles as well as chemical, biological and nuclear arms was missing from 8 or 10 sites that were the heart of Iraq's WMD program.

Dr. Araji said that if the equipment had left the country, its most likely destination was a neighboring state.

The United Nations, worried that the nuclear material and equipment could be used in clandestine bomb production, has been hunting for it throughout the Middle East, largely unsuccessfully, the Times said.


Wow, looks like anti-war people everywhere just got slapped in the face.



cjf

posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 01:07 PM
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Added Source:

Seventeenth quarterly report on the activities of the United
Nations Monitoring, Verification and Inspection
Commission submitted in accordance with paragraph 12 of
Security Council resolution 1284 (1999)

*7. While sites in Iraq were being monitored for updates through satellite imagery, it was detected that some sites subject to monitoring by UNMOVIC had been cleaned up and equipment and material had been removed from the sites In other areas, whole buildings that had previously contained equipment and materials subject to monitoring had been completely dismantled. The work continues to cover all known sites in Iraq. (pg 17, United Nations S/2004/435)

*6. The Commission’s experts are conducting an investigation in parallel with the IAEA Iraq Nuclear Verification Office regarding the discovery of items from Iraq that are relevant to the mandates of UNMOVIC and IAEA at a scrapyard in the Netherlands. In particular, following a visit of IAEA to a scrapyard in Rotterdam to investigate increased radiation readings, it was discovered, through photographs taken at the time, that engines of SA-2 surface-to-air missiles were among the scrap (see figure below). They are the type of engines used in the Al Samoud 2 proscribed missile programme. In addition, a number of items and equipment that may also be relevant to the UNMOVIC mandate were seen among the scrap. The existence of missile engines originating in Iraq among scrap in Europe may affect the accounting of proscribed engines known to have been in Iraq’s possession in March 2003. Both IAEA and UNMOVIC have kept the Security Council informed of this matter." (pg 3, United Nations S/2004/435)

*United Nations S/2004/435
Security Council Distr.: General
28 May 2004

Full Report

The afore mentioned report contains much more information and confirms the dates prior to March 2003. Hussien was ridding himself of evidence through muliple means which included, among other possibilities...scrap dealers...



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 01:14 PM
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So, after all the declarations that there were no WMDs, the NYT is now declaring the Bush was an idiot for letting WMD/WMD materials get out of Baghdad under U.S. noses.

Which is it, Was Bush an idiot because there were no WMDs, or he was an idiot for letting them get away?

Were there WMDs is the real question.

If there were, the Iraq war may have been justified....



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 01:47 PM
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NY Times seems to have a bit of an identity conflict...



THE ISSUE OF WAR: INSPECTOR'S JUDGMENT; U.S. REPORT FINDS IRAQIS ELIMINATED ILLICIT ARMS IN 90's

By DOUGLAS JEHL (NYT) 1812 words
Late Edition - Final , Section A , Page 1 , Column 5

Correction Appended

ABSTRACT - Report by top American weapons inspector Charles A Duelfer says Iraq, under pressure from United Nations, 'essentially destroyed' its illicit weapons stockpiles months after Persian Gulf war in 1991, and its ability to produce such weapons had significantly eroded by time of American invasion in 2003; says its last secret factory, biological weapons plant, was eliminated in 1996; says Saddam Hussein had in effect sacrificed Iraq's illicit weapons in effort to win end to UN sanctions; says he used period between 1991 and 2003 to try to exploit avenues opened by sanctions, especially oil-for-food program, to lay groundwork for plan to resume weapons production if sanctions were lifted; finds no evidence that Iraq tried to restart those programs; findings uphold Iraq's prewar insistence that it did not possess chemical or biological weapons; they also show enormous distance between Bush administration's own prewar assertions, based on reports by American intelligence agencies, and what Duelfer's 15-month inquiry found since war; photos; excerpts from report (L)


Correction: October 8, 2004, Friday

A picture caption yesterday with an article about the report on Iraq's prewar weapons programs misidentified one of three Democratic senators conferring in the Armed Services Committee room. He was Jack Reed of Rhode Island, not Harry Reid of Nevada.

query.nytimes.com...


I'm actually suprised that this is getting much more attention.



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 02:13 PM
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Originally posted by NWguy83
N.Y. Times: Iraq Had WMD 'Stockpiles' in 2003

Sunday, March 13, 2005 10:17 a.m. EST
NewsMax.com


Wow, looks like anti-war people everywhere just got slapped in the face.


It looks Newsmax put their spin on the story to make it fit their agenda.

The UN had already tagged and monitored that dual-use equipment before the war and this is not the first time it was brought up.


NY Times
The kinds of machinery at the various sites included equipment that could be used to make missile parts, chemical weapons or centrifuges essential for enriching uranium for atom bombs. All of that "dual use" equipment also has peaceful applications - for example, a tool to make parts for a nuclear implosion device or for a powerful commercial jet turbine.

Mr. Hussein's rise to power in Iraq culminated in his military building not only deadly missiles but many unconventional arms. After the 1991 gulf war, international inspectors found that Baghdad was close to making an atom bomb and had succeeded in producing thousands of biological and chemical warheads.

Starting in 1991, the United Nations began destroying Iraq's unconventional arms and setting up a vast effort to monitor the country's industrial infrastructure to make sure that Baghdad lived up to its disarmament promises. The International Atomic Energy Agency, based in Vienna, was put in charge of nuclear sites, and Unmovic, based in New York, was given responsibility for chemical and biological plants as well as factories that made rockets and missiles.


It's a big difference between dual-use components that could potentially be used to make banned weapons and actually finding banned weapons that had not already been destroyed years ago. It is a problem to let it get looted since the war was so heavily sold to the public on the assumption of banned weapons.



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by cjf
Full Report

The afore mentioned report contains much more information and confirms the dates prior to March 2003. Hussien was ridding himself of evidence through muliple means which included, among other possibilities...scrap dealers...


You need to read the report again.
It says the weapons were in Iraq in March 2003 (before the war) and ended up in scrap yards after the war.



Representatives of the scrapyard company indicated that a number of similar engines (5 to 12) had been seen in the scrapyard in January and February of this year. More engines could have been processed and passed through the yard unnoticed. Company staff confirmed that other items made of stainless steel and other corrosion-resistant metal alloys bearing the inscription “Iraq” or “Baghdad” had been observed in shipments delivered from the Middle East since November 2003.



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 02:21 PM
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Isn't 'newsmax' the same people that reported that scott ritter said he knew there was a plan to invade iran in june? And then it was revelaed that what really happened was that he heard about sanctions being set in june? IOW, isn't this an irresponsible site with no journalistic integrity?

Where is the NYT article that says iraq had wmd in the war period?



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 07:26 PM
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NewsMax is a hardcore rightwing site like World Net Daily.
I'd take anything they say with several grains of salt.

Again, if Iraq had WMD, where are they?
Conveniently relocated to the next country we want to invade?

Face it, there were no WMD stockpiles, not since 1991.
He played games with the inspectors, not to hide WMD's from the US, but to hide the fact that he didn't have them from the Iranians.

It was a bluff on Saddam's part, one that backfired spectacularly.



posted on Mar, 15 2005 @ 07:32 PM
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Originally posted by xmotex
NewsMax is a hardcore rightwing site like World Net Daily.

Man, thats harsh. WorlNutDaily is pretty, well, nutty.


It was a bluff on Saddam's part, one that backfired spectacularly.

I question if it backfired. Some have said that hussein couldn't reveal that he didn't have wmd, because it'd be a sign of weakness and this would invite revolt and outside attack, but I don't buy that, because, well, his actions lead to revolt and outside attack. Also, notice, in that line of reasoning, its implicit that everyone knew (incorrectly) that Iraq had WMD, and hussein could say he destroyed it, and even give tables worth of documents to support it, and everyone would still think 'nah, he still has it'.

So what was the plan? don't give in, let the army get wiped out by the americans when they do invade, go into hiding after orgnanizing a resitstance, maybe coordinate it depending on how things go, and wait it out. Soon enough the americans will get sick of fighting a guerilla army and leave, ala vietnam. Then, resurface, triumphant, be swept back into power at the head of your armies, rebuild the wmds, grow the army, and then cause some real problems.

its his only logical choice, short of full cooperation, which in itself might work out, but isn't an avenue that allows one to become aggrandized. This way, he's bigger in the arab world than osama, which apparently is what he wanted, and this way his sons can take over a real empire.



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