Above the Law: The Data Are In on Police, Killing, and Race

a reply to: Xcalibur254

Yeah, but he is white. He wanted blacks to be killed by police because he is white, and if you are white, you are racist.
Obama is black... and he could have put a stop to it... and save his 'brothers'.
I saw the equipment being delivered to police departments around here in my area... It happened when Obama was in office for 8 years.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

At least get the right Bush - The modern program arose during the H. W. Bush administration, in Section 1208 of the National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Years 1990 and 1991.... And since when does a political party affliation determine anything about the GOOD or evil that is behind their intentions ?

Your effort to further divide down political lines is getting weaker all the time.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

I do wonder what might happen if we open up cops to being sued by random people. Will there still be lots of cops willing to do that job, or will most of them decide that assuming that much risk for such a meager pay check just isn't worth it.

But since the soup de jour today is defund them and remove them (what is really said and meant when you clear out the politics), perhaps a bit of no police is what's needed. let everyone see if we can police ourselves and keep from killing each other.

I have an idea how it will go, but it's not up to me, and nobody actually asked.

I think this paragraph sums it up,

'Police violence in America is extraordinary in its intensity. It is disproportionate to the actual threats facing police officers, and it has risen significantly in recent years without apparent justification.'

originally posted by: odzeandennz
a reply to: Boadicea

I wonder how other countries do their policing...

I'd like to think that we could look at other policing models and learn from their strengths and weaknesses, but I'm not sure our police are ready for that. I read once that US police went to England to see how they police without guns, and they were shocked at the situations British police handled without guns, that in the US the perp would have been shot in a heartbeat.

I wonder how much training is given to self-defense other than firearms.... just plain street fighting type training.

originally posted by: butcherguy
When the preppers talk about being armed, the lefties said, 'oh you can't fight the police and military... so you are a joke to even spout off about 2nd Amendment stuff.'

Status quo has always been the police or the military get to move 'in force' first.

You let the 'little' team I was with in the ME & NA get set up first and we can lock a city down for days. You'd practically need the USAF to shake us loose.

When you see that happen a couple of times ... when people are really getting shot dead ... like what happens 'over there' ... you'll see the lefty-social-experiment closed down ... and damned quick. All these minority issues will disappear like farts in the wind and the country will get right back to normal.

The merry-go-round of Womenz Rights, LGBTQ, BLM, Climate Change, ad naseum. Let a few of TPTB pushing that agenda ... to knock America to her knees ... have their lives and families shattered (instead of working for Burisma and raking in millions of your tax dollars) ... for the cause.

All of my buttons got pushed. Sorry for the Rant Reply.

originally posted by: smurfy
I think this paragraph sums it up,

'Police violence in America is extraordinary in its intensity. It is disproportionate to the actual threats facing police officers, and it has risen significantly in recent years without apparent justification.'

I don't think you've seen any of the protests for the last 4 weeks. The behavior of the protesters and the threats, violence, and killing of police is unprecedented.

originally posted by: Xcalibur254

Police killing is not the work of vigilant warriors defending society at great personal cost, and sometimes going too far. It is the day-in, day-out petty tyranny of a taxpayer-funded bureaucratic lobby group. The difference is that, unlike other public sector unions, police unions have military-grade equipment they can use to violently crush protests against their abuses, and they are legally immune from most consequences. They’re teachers’ unions, but with tanks and endless get-out-of-jail-free cards.

Source

Just came across this study done by Public Discourse (a conservative thinktank) and thought it was pretty interesting. It pretty much supports what a lot of the protesters are saying.

Over the past few decades police in this country have become more violent and it has nothing to do with an increase in violent crime. Furthermore, there does appear to be a racial bias in policing against black people.

The study concludes by stating that the only way to rein in police violence is to take away their safety net. Break up the police unions and get rid of things like qualified immunity. It also goes on to say that we need to stop giving police officers military ordinance. If we're going to equip these people le soldiers they're going to act like soldiers.

I know the data and conclusions of this study probably won't be popular on ATS but at least it comes from a source that might be more readily accepted and their methodology is laid out.

The dems are pro-union, or are they only pro-some unions?

I think qualified immunity should be out the window for LEOs if they are doing acts that are unconstitutional, but only if their actions are violating individual constitutionally protected rights.

originally posted by: EmmanuelGoldstein
a reply to: Xcalibur254

Exactly. The only way to teach a kid to do the right thing is to have real punishment with actual consequences.
Otherwise, how can you blame them for being bad?

Getting rid of the union safety net and the cronyism and showing them the same jail cell as anyone else would find, would be a good start.

I agree, by the same token I would like to see criminals doing real time for crimes.

a reply to: MetalThunder

I was responding thi the person trying to pin this on Obama. A little tit for tat.

And how did I have the wrong Bush? I think if I'm referring to Bush and 1990 everyone knows what Bush I'm talking about.

a reply to: Xcalibur254

The 1033 program was Enacted in 1997 - No Bush was President - So what are you exactly saying ? lol
WEAK SAUCE

Whoopsie Daisy - Duplicate

Lowered recruitment standards is one big reason for excesses by police. Since our endless wars in the Middle East police have recruited from ex-military heavily, the issues here being obvious. I don't find their evidence of racial bias particularly compelling for a multitude of reasons. Given events of the last several years I think most cops are more reluctant than ever to engage with minority suspects for fear of being accused of bias. So they go after young pot heads instead.

a reply to: highvein

I actually agree that the police policies need to be reformed.

That's great. Now all we need to do is get the GOP to agree and we would all be in agreement.

Peace, Love and Joy to the world.

a reply to: Boadicea

And that is not an accident. These records are not kept in order to avoid incriminating the guilty and informing the public of what our police are really doing. And in the process, every police officer becomes suspect. So, in effect, good police are also tarred with the same broad brush as the bad police.

This right here

Now if we peons down here can figure this out, what the hell is going on at the TOP? You know, where they make policy? Where is the LEADERSHIP?

a reply to: Snarl

All of my buttons got pushed. Sorry for the Rant Reply.

Yeeah. Can't wait to see your sunshine and unicorn farts posts if Biden gets elected. But please, do us ALL a favor and carry out your plebeian fantasy.

Preferably before election day.

When you see that happen a couple of times ... when people are really getting shot dead ... like what happens 'over there' ... you'll see the lefty-social-experiment closed down ... and damned quick

Have you even been to Chicago? I grew up there. What happens 'over there' has been happening 'over here' for a long time brother.

P.S. Lefties have served SOF also sir. And they have the 2nd Amendment also.

a reply to: jjkenobi

I don't think you've seen any of the protests for the last 4 weeks. The behavior of the protesters and the threats, violence, and killing of police is unprecedented.

The behavior of the police is unprecedented.

And it has been going on for DECADES.

originally posted by: Snarl

originally posted by: butcherguy
When the preppers talk about being armed, the lefties said, 'oh you can't fight the police and military... so you are a joke to even spout off about 2nd Amendment stuff.'

Status quo has always been the police or the military get to move 'in force' first.

You let the 'little' team I was with in the ME & NA get set up first and we can lock a city down for days. You'd practically need the USAF to shake us loose.

When you see that happen a couple of times ... when people are really getting shot dead ... like what happens 'over there' ... you'll see the lefty-social-experiment closed down ... and damned quick. All these minority issues will disappear like farts in the wind and the country will get right back to normal.

The merry-go-round of Womenz Rights, LGBTQ, BLM, Climate Change, ad naseum. Let a few of TPTB pushing that agenda ... to knock America to her knees ... have their lives and families shattered (instead of working for Burisma and raking in millions of your tax dollars) ... for the cause.

All of my buttons got pushed. Sorry for the Rant Reply.

Hahaha. If the military does that then America is dead.

One of 2 things will happen if your militarized wet dream comes true:

You crack down on the lefties in that fascist, I mean fashion, then the government/military will get used to crossing that line until everyone gets cracked down on. America will become like Nazi Germany and freedom will be essentially dead.

Or this, you crackdown on people and they don't give up. Shooting down civilians in the streets, fires and destruction of infrastructure. The military roll out to enforce the law and once they're spread out killing their fellow Americans that's when we get attacked by an enemy.

We can't give someone power over the people. We need to police ourselves. It won't be perfect but a return to wild west days of bounties, locally elected sheriffs and street posses to fight gangs may be better than this.

a reply to: Boadicea

Of course, we would need British-style lack of general firearms availability too.

Britain is aided in that by being an island and they can better control their borders.

We have this thing called the "Southern Border" which is really more like a Southern Suggestion where firearms are trafficked freely along with every other manner of illegal substance ... oh and people, let's not forget them. Even if we generally controlled firearms availability like the British go, our police would have a difficult time policing like the British do.