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Pakistan International Airlines passenger plane crashes in Karachi

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posted on Jun, 4 2020 @ 04:53 PM
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a reply to: Blackfinger

I wouldn't be surprised.




posted on Jun, 11 2020 @ 03:49 PM
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There was an article a while back during the initial 737 MAX coverage talking about the training differences between countries like the US and the mid-east and the "academy" mentality there. It is all rote memorization and checklists.

I have a quick questoin as I don't know the Airbus that well, but will it disallow the gear to come down if the airspeed is above Vle or Vlo? As automated as they are I can see that as a feature to prevent damage. If so, I can see they put the gear handle down and continued the descent as though it would come down when commanded.



posted on Jun, 11 2020 @ 03:51 PM
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NM, read the article. Will not come down above 260kts.



posted on Jun, 24 2020 @ 07:09 AM
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As suspected, the landing gear was not deployed. The crew didn't observe callouts or CRM procedures during most of the flight.



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Aeronews Global

Industry
PK8303 crash – the preliminary investigation report has been published
By Teodor Stefan 24-06-2020

Today, June 24th, Pakistan’s Aircraft Accident Investigation Board (AAIB) has published the preliminary investigation report related to the May 22nd crash of Pakistan International Airlines’ Airbus A320 (AP-BLD), flight PK8303 with 8 crew members (1 Captain, 1 First Officer, 6 flight attendants) and 91 passengers on-board.

Preliminary findings. The full report is available here. Follow us also on Facebook, Twitter and LinkedIn.

The investigation so far into the available evidences, ie FDR / CVR readouts (preliminary assessment), footages from CCTV / Security Cameras at JIAP, and “Karachi Approach” radar data etc, following has been revealed and validated as the preliminary findings:

(a) The reported weather at origin, en-route and at destination airfields was fit to undertake the flight.

(b) On 22 May 2020 PIA flight PK8303 took off from AIIAP Lahore at 13:05 hrs (as per the Lahore ATC recording / transcript). Departure from Lahore and cruising flight were uneventful. The crew did not follow standard callouts and did not observe CRM aspects during most parts of flight.

(c) “Area Control Karachi East” cleared PK8303 for “Nawabshah 2A” arrival procedure (STAR – Standard Terminal Arrival Route as published in AIP and JEPPESEN), and advised to expect ILS approach for runway 25L. The flight was later cleared at pilot’s discretion to report direct MAKLI (a waypoint 15 nautical miles at a radial of 075 from Karachi VOR) and descend to FL100, and later re-cleared for FL50. The aircraft changed over to “Karachi Approach” and was cleared to descend down further to 3000 ft, by the time it reaches MAKLI.


(d) The aircraft ended up higher than the required descend profile. At MAKLI the aircraft was at 9780 ft and at about 245 knots IAS. In order to manage the descent and lose the additional height, “OPEN DES” mode was selected via the FCU, both autopilots were disengaged and speed brakes were extended.

(e) “Karachi Approach” inquired “confirm track mile comfortable for descend” and later advised to take an orbit, so that the aircraft can be adjusted on the required descend profile. No orbit was executed and the effort to intercept the glide slope and localizer (of ILS) was continued. The FDR indicated action of lowering of the landing gears at 7221 ft at around 10.5 Nautical Miles from Runway 25L.

(f) “Karachi Approach” advised repeatedly (twice to discontinue the approach and once cautioned) about excessive height. Landing approach was not discontinued. However, FDR shows action of raising of the landing gears at 1740 ft followed by retraction of the speed brakes (at a distance slightly less than 05 nautical miles from the runway 25L). At this time, the aircraft had intercepted the localizer as well as the glide slope. Flaps 1 were selected at 243 knots IAS, the landing gears and speed brakes were retracted. Over-speed and EGPWS warnings were then triggered.

(g) Figure hereunder depicts a few parameters of FDR data and the first approach profile of the aircraft in comparison with the required approach profile. Note: For the descent path, the altitude has been shifted to start from 84 ft in order to match the altitude of the runway at ground impact.

(h) Since the approach to land was continued, “Karachi Approach” instead of changing over the aircraft to “Aerodrome Control”, sought telephonic landing clearance from the “Aerodrome Control”. The “Aerodrome Control” conveyed a landing clearance of the aircraft (without observing the abnormality that the landing gears were not extended) to “Karachi Approach”. Subsequently “Karachi Approach” cleared the aircraft to land.

(i) At 500 ft, the FDR indicates: landing gear retracted, slat/flap configuration 3, airspeed 220 knots IAS, descent rate 2000 ft/min. According to the FDR and CVR recordings several warnings and alerts such as over-speed, landing gear not down and ground proximity alerts were disregarded. The landing was undertaken with landing gears retracted. The aircraft touched the runway surface on its engines. Flight crew applied reverse engine power and initiated a braking action. Both engines scrubbed the runway at various locations causing damage to both of them. Figures hereunder show selected screenshots of security / CCTV cameras footages of the aircraft engines touching the runway and showing sparks due to scrubbing, along with marks on the runway.

aeronewsglobal.com...



posted on Jun, 24 2020 @ 07:27 AM
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a reply to: Zaphod58
We got an answer pretty quick on that one. Thanks for the update. Pretty much what we all assumed



posted on Jun, 24 2020 @ 09:52 AM
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a reply to: 772STi

We're a long way from the final report. This is just preliminary, based on the data so far. It's not likely anything major will change between now and the final though.



posted on Jun, 24 2020 @ 01:31 PM
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According to the Aviation Minister, 40% of pilots flying in Pakistan have fake or invalid licenses.

gulfnews.com...



posted on Jun, 24 2020 @ 04:55 PM
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So the sales of Microsofts XFlight simulators in Pakistan have been high because? "sacrasm alert"



posted on Jun, 25 2020 @ 07:15 AM
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More on that story here.


Pakistan’s state-run airline announced Thursday it would ground 150 pilots on charges they obtained their pilot licenses by having others take exams for them.


apnews.com...



posted on Jun, 25 2020 @ 11:39 PM
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Wow. So Pakistan's aviation minister admits that 40% of the countries commercial pilots have serious anomalies regarding their licences and training. There is admitted widespread corruption and political entitlement seeing people who shouldn't be flying getting the job while more competent individuals are looked over. And it would appear that local training and the academies running it are teaching people to just pass exams by remembering checklists instead of competent basic airman ship and CRM practices. If its this bad with pilots, it really worries me how bad their engineering skills and MRO's are. And remember, these are the kinds of "cheap" labor that more reputable airlines and first world countries would secretly love to hire to save costs, because at the end of the day despite all the safety rhetoric most of the bean counters only care about the dollar cost and not the human one. You know, that red coloured number 5 box on a risk matrix chart? We have been warned..



posted on Jun, 26 2020 @ 03:14 AM
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originally posted by: thebozeian
Wow. So Pakistan's aviation minister admits that 40% of the countries commercial pilots have serious anomalies regarding their licences and training.


If you think that's bad, wait until they start to investigate the Doctors/Surgeons they are churning out...



posted on Jun, 26 2020 @ 04:44 AM
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originally posted by: thebozeian
Wow. So Pakistan's aviation minister admits that 40% of the countries commercial pilots have serious anomalies regarding their licences and training. There is admitted widespread corruption and political entitlement seeing people who shouldn't be flying getting the job while more competent individuals are looked over. And it would appear that local training and the academies running it are teaching people to just pass exams by remembering checklists instead of competent basic airman ship and CRM practices. If its this bad with pilots, it really worries me how bad their engineering skills and MRO's are. And remember, these are the kinds of "cheap" labor that more reputable airlines and first world countries would secretly love to hire to save costs, because at the end of the day despite all the safety rhetoric most of the bean counters only care about the dollar cost and not the human one. You know, that red coloured number 5 box on a risk matrix chart? We have been warned..

Back in 1978 (?) I was flying a Lear and a King Aire in and out of the kingdom of Saudi Arabia. Saudia actually had a good accident record and training department as many of the pilots were Expats. However a Saudi L-1011 had some idiot light a stove in the back which started a fire while the aircraft was landing. They found something like 20 bodies in the cockpit who had been trying to avoid the fire. The crew had killed the electric so the automatic doors would not open. The cockpit has two ropes you can go out the side sliding windows but the crew were to stupid to use them; all Saudi crew members.

The training department for every/any Airline should have detected the idiots with the fake licenses at PIA. In the states a written test with 80% passing grade or you do over, fail again you are fired. Flight Checks maybe one do over but if you fail you are fired if you can not preform. We fired a Naval trained carrier pilot because he could not land a MD-80 unless it was a controlled crash... That was really a weird deal but I think the guy was mental. Either way no room for a pilot who can not fly and land the darn plane.

At least that is the way it used to be done.... Maybe now they just give participation ribbons to anyone who shows up ??



posted on Jun, 27 2020 @ 06:51 AM
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a reply to: solidshot
We already know about that down here Solid. Google Dr Death or Dr Patel in Australia and then realize he wasn't the only incompetent one they had in that town alone.



posted on Jun, 27 2020 @ 07:01 AM
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a reply to: 727Sky
Yeah Saudi Arabia has some very "interesting" stories to tell. I heard about that L1011 story and its one of many. I used to work with a guy who worked as an expat over there 20 years ago and he had some very bizarre tales. Best one was the time he was in a van driving down a perimeter road and an aircraft pushback tug drove past and something wasn't quite right. They slammed on the brakes and looked back to confirm they hadn't just hallucinated. Yep sure enough there really was a 747 wing gear assembly lying on top all bent and twisted. Turned out some nutcase Iran Air pilot had been pushed back and as they disconnected he slammed the throttles forward and released brakes. The pushback engineer dropped the headset and ran for his life. The tug floored it but couldn't get out of the way quick enough and collided with the wing gear. Stupid pilot tried to push on until told by ATC to stop, power down and look what just happened.



posted on Jun, 30 2020 @ 10:16 AM
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a reply to: solidshot

It appears that this might be more complicated than just "pilots have fake licenses". One pilot spoke out anonymously, and said that his name got put on the list because he flew a flight the same day he took one of 8 tests for his ATP rating. According to him, many of the pilots on the list were added because they flew the same day they tested.



posted on Jun, 30 2020 @ 11:10 AM
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Looks like they will be banned from flying around the EU for some time as well now?


The European Union’s aviation safety agency said Tuesday that Pakistan’s national airline will not be allowed to fly into Europe for at least six months after the country’s aviation minister revealed that nearly a third of Pakistani pilots had cheated on their pilot’s exams.

Pakistan International Airlines spokesman Abdullah Hafeez said PIA has not been flying to Europe because of the pandemic. But the airline had hoped to resume its flights to Oslo, Copenhagen, Paris, Barcelona and Milan within the next two months.

“It is hurting us really bad,” he said of the pilots scandal.


apnews.com...



posted on Jun, 30 2020 @ 11:14 AM
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a reply to: solidshot

That's not surprising. I'm just surprised it took this long to blacklist them.



posted on Jul, 9 2020 @ 11:44 AM
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34 pilots have seemingly had their licences suspended by the CAA?


Pakistan International Airlines 34 more pilots licenses’ were suspended by the Civil Aviation Authority (CAA) for allegedly holding holding fake degrees.
According to a notification issued by the aviation authority, licenses will remain suspended till the inquiry against the pilots has not been completed.

Separately, the European Union Aviation Safety Agency (EASA) on Tuesday ordered its member states to bar Pakistani pilots from working.

EASA has asked its member countries for details of Pakistani pilots. The letter sent to the member states by EASA stated that the CAA has revealed irregularities in the issuance of 40% of licences.


www.airlive.net...



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