has any one seen..Demon's?

It is MY world as it is yours and others. Donkey look outside your borders go to the east and tell me the majority are christian. In sa we have a mix infact there are countris in africa where christianity does not even feature as on statistics. in america christianity may be big but america isnt the whole world. so i will except your apologie for those remarks. oh and just for the record satan is not the ruler of all evil.

I don't get it. Why does it matter? All that matters is the RIGHT way. That's how you bump into God, not by following a majority.

Originally posted by radardog

Let's be candid here, the break down of world religion looks something like this:

Christianity 2 billion
Islam 1.3 billion
Hinduism 900 million
Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist 850 million
Buddhism 360 million
Chinese traditional religion 225 million
....

We can see that most of the world is not christian; it is something other than christian.

Let me put it to words even more simply so your stubborn mind will have a chance to grasp what I mean.
To most people in Europe the year is now 2005
To most people in America the year is now 2005
To computers in Azia and the Middle East it is also 2005

Our world and society is influenced so strongly by christianity, that even people who are not christian live by these christian concepts.

I was not saying most of the world is christian, neither was I saying that there can not be exceptions or people who believe we also live in a different type of yearcount.

If this is still not clear for you I am afraid I am giving up.

[edit on 21-4-2005 by Jakko]

Originally posted by saint4God
Up until this point, it sounded medical but...

Originally posted by BIGFOOT
Once while i was in my room alone i wrote down something like "God, Jesus, 777, f*** Satan" and some other stuff on a piece of paper, put it infront of me on my bad, and passed my self out. I immeadiently slammed my hand against the paper and then often hit other things before "waking up."
I was worried about some people i knew that i thought this demon or devil might hurt so i wrote downs family members name on paper while i passed myself out but the possesser didnt touch the paper, as if saying im not here for them im here for you.

People may say im making this up but in my mind i KNOW WITHOUT A DOUBT their is know other explanation.

I know this isnt seeing a demon but its defninately related.
Well here you go

this is off the charts I think. It makes sense, when you lose conciousness intentionally, it opens you up for more invasive things. I've heard of forcing a pass-out, but this is a first I've heard of a possession after. Usually possession comes from asking something in, challenging something to do it, or in some way projecting the concioussness away from the body. Much appreciated. Where are you at now with the whole thing?

Pray, train, study.
God bless.

I haven't done it since the time when i broke the ladies plates, i was to worried about hurting myself or someone else.





MoonBeam you have me curious as to what the powers in the underworld are. You say that Satan isn't the worst thing to fear and their is things not known to man far more worse. If their not none to man then how do you know of such things? Im not questioning if your lieing or not just wondering how you found out.
thanks
BF

Originally posted by saint4God
I don't get it.

Why does it matter? All that matters is the RIGHT way. That's how you bump into God, not by following a majority.

I agree

MoonBeam you have me curious as to what the powers in the underworld are. You say that Satan isn't the worst thing to fear and their is things not known to man far more worse. If their not none to man then how do you know of such things? Im not questioning if your lieing or not just wondering how you found out. thanks BF

Hmmmm....that is an interesting question, I second it.

sorry for not being here you all i have been busy with work overloaded infact i need to get to bed its 6 am and i havent slept yet heh night

i have seen them, look this is a public descsion so for my own reason i would rather not say exactly how i have or when i have seen them. but there are things that have no name far worse than satan. (oh and for the record im not a satanist)

Originally posted by Jakko

Originally posted by radardog

Let's be candid here, the break down of world religion looks something like this:

Christianity 2 billion
Islam 1.3 billion
Hinduism 900 million
Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist 850 million
Buddhism 360 million
Chinese traditional religion 225 million
....

We can see that most of the world is not christian; it is something other than christian.

Let me put it to words even more simply so your stubborn mind will have a chance to grasp what I mean.
To most people in Europe the year is now 2005
To most people in America the year is now 2005
To computers in Azia and the Middle East it is also 2005

Our world and society is influenced so strongly by christianity, that even people who are not christian live by these christian concepts.

I was not saying most of the world is christian, neither was I saying that there can not be exceptions or people who believe we also live in a different type of yearcount.

If this is still not clear for you I am afraid I am giving up.

[edit on 21-4-2005 by Jakko]

hahahahaha Jakko. From people to computers? Are you sure that you're not a troll? Seriously, though most people do not live in Europe or America (again, I can go to the trouble and bring the figures up the figures for you), and moreover, most (okay, all) people are not computers.

If you want to prove that most people revolve around christianity (or another statement like that), then go ahead. I await your scholarly citations. HINT: " Because I said so" doesn't count as very good evidence.

HINT: " Because I said so" doesn't count as very good evidence.

Well said Mr. Dog.

Please remember that when making statements like this:

... it is really hard to argue that God was fair to the angels when he created humans.

I think it would be much hard to argue that, man or angels, both being creations of God would have a better sense of justice than the Creator where they obtained there sense of justice from? Would it not?

Maybe your statement would be better like this:
....it is really hard to argue that angels were fair to God when he created humans?


Now as to Dog and Jakko's debate, I think you both have beat the dead horse long enough, over "Does the world revolve around Christianity" it is not part of this tread, so we are all hijacking it by continuing.
Yes Dog, Jakko could have phrased it better, so his meaning would be far more precise, but you could give a little bit to allow that he never meant that Christianity was the controlling force in the world, only that it is a major player and moon should not be shocked by it mention.

So back to the thread, has anyone seen Demons?

I think it would be much hard to argue that, man or angels, both being creations of God would have a better sense of justice than the Creator where they obtained there sense of justice from? Would it not?

When we speak of justice in terms of equality and 'fair share' (wherein the word historically has the past/root), I think it is really hard to show that humans and angels were created equally, thus the result of Satan's jealousy and/or pride being shown. Satan being jealous, imo, is great evidence that injustice was being done (i.e. God has infinite resources to distribute as he and form as he wishes, yet angels did not get an equal share of resources as humans.) Thereby in this situation we have God being a provider of injustice towards humans and angels.

This can be seen apart by God being just towards humans; God made all of us equally human -- nothing fundamentally different between all of us and our possible actions. We all get to live in paradise (or what's left of it ), we all get to believe or not believe in God, and we have his gift of salvation. In the contrary, comparing us to angels, they did not get to live in paradise, they did not get the choice to believe in God, and God's son never died for the sins of an angel.

It's late and I'm bored. This thread looks as good as any other to suffer a post from me.

There are many opinions raised in this thread I strongly disagree with. I'd quote people and respond directly but I've been reading this over a few days and have lost track of who said what where and when.

I actually think this thread should be moved to a religious forum. Demons are largely a Christian topic. In that context, no one could be disparaged for believing Christianity were the only true religion.

A lot of posts are about ghostlike entities and noncorporeal "in the mind only" demons. Again, wrong forum I think. Isn't cryptozoology about strange physical beasts? Many of the demons described in this thread don't sound very physical to me.

Someone said something about demons possibly protecting them for a "purpose". I may not be popular for saying this, but anytime someone tells me something like "demons/angels/aliens are speaking to / protecting me for a reason" I think "get over yourself".

Humility, people. You are no more important than anyone else. If you think you are, you are being selfish. Most people are. Which further demonstrates how mundane thinking that way is. Don't think that I'm saying you aren't important. You are. Just no more than anyone else.

Why am I saying this? Because people who see things like this tend to ignore everyone else's perspective. By extension, they ignore generally accepted facts about such visions, which includes ignoring the usual means to wellness. I can understand why. It must be hard to accept things contrary to what you perceive. Demons must exist, I see them! I'm sorry, but you are probably wrong and you must accept that.

If you see demons, it isn't normal. If these demons negatively impact your life (or the lives of others around you), you need medicine. Whatever your personal beliefs are, it has been clearly demonstrated that the right drugs do a far better job of eliminating harmful demons than exorcism or prayer. Accept the truth for what it is.

People...there is not one religion that takes up most of the world... in order to be most, it has to be over 50% of the world _> I dun see any religion thats more than 50%...do you?

People, this is about Demons, not about what religion is superior or which religion is most of the world, its about Demons, back on topic please.


And for the record, one of the major religions in Africa is Christianity

Reikuro, Thank you.

Mr. RadarDog,

We do need to keep this thread on topic, but our new discussion is relative to the topic, so I will keep going.

My question to you is: How can the created have greater properties than it's creator?

Originally posted by Balaams donkey

Reikuro, Thank you.

Anytime, I'm here for a reason (yes, there is a reason other than to bother Rel, Day, Asala, and CPR)

Originally posted by uca6usev2FeDREmU

I actually think this thread should be moved to a religious forum. Demons are largely a Christian topic. In that context, no one could be disparaged for believing Christianity were the only true religion.

do people not research other relegions. in hinduism kali was created to rid earth of demons, muslims, budists, voodooists, native american and many other religions believe there are demons. infact i am not aware of a single relegion that does not beleive that demons exsist. so it is NOT only a christian thing. can we please move AWAY from christainity and stay on the topic of demons.

A lot of posts are about ghostlike entities and noncorporeal "in the mind only" demons. Again, wrong forum I think. Isn't cryptozoology about strange physical beasts? Many of the demons described in this thread don't sound very physical to me.

we did not say demons were physical, infact we have not even really defined what a demon is. so um your judegement yet again is um wrong.

Someone said something about demons possibly protecting them for a "purpose". I may not be popular for saying this, but anytime someone tells me something like "demons/angels/aliens are speaking to / protecting me for a reason" I think "get over yourself".

you have not made a single contribution to this disccusion so where do you get off? you need to actually read the disscusion properly because you obviously havent done that yet mr opinion.

Humility, people. You are no more important than anyone else. If you think you are, you are being selfish. Most people are. Which further demonstrates how mundane thinking that way is. Don't think that I'm saying you aren't important. You are. Just no more than anyone else.

where does this come from exactly?????

Why am I saying this? Because people who see things like this tend to ignore everyone else's perspective. By extension, they ignore generally accepted facts about such visions, which includes ignoring the usual means to wellness. I can understand why. It must be hard to accept things contrary to what you perceive. Demons must exist, I see them! I'm sorry, but you are probably wrong and you must accept that.

and what makes you so right?

If you see demons, it isn't normal. If these demons negatively impact your life (or the lives of others around you), you need medicine. Whatever your personal beliefs are, it has been clearly demonstrated that the right drugs do a far better job of eliminating harmful demons than exorcism or prayer. Accept the truth for what it is.

no it not normal no one said it was, but just because you are closed to it doesnt make it a medical condition. again i will go and read everything before you fumbl in and make stupid comments like this.

Originally posted by Balaams donkey

My question to you is: How can the created have greater properties than it's creator?

How can vary depending on the situation, but I can show it has occured. Humans have created devices with greater strength than humans. While you may be hard pressed to find a human to carry a few tons, there are plenty of manmade machines around that can do the job.

Just for the sake of discussion, can we define what a demon is, and how one would objectively identify one?

do people not research other relegions. in hinduism kali was created to rid earth of demons, muslims, budists, voodooists, native american and many other religions believe there are demons. infact i am not aware of a single relegion that does not beleive that demons exsist. so it is NOT only a christian thing. can we please move AWAY from christainity and stay on the topic of demons.

By the same logic, how about we move AWAY from hinduism, islam, buddhism, voodoo, tribalistic beliefs, and so on in our discussion of demons. Towards what exactly?

I'll accept that my "largely a Christian topic" statement was badly worded. But the main point of what I said was that it's a topic of religious belief, so everyone complaining about seeing others reference Christianity or any other religion in this thread should abandon that complaint. The only good discussion about demons in no religious context has no participants.

you have not made a single contribution to this disccusion so where do you get off? you need to actually read the disscusion properly because you obviously havent done that yet mr opinion.

I think my first post qualifies as a single contribution. And I read the whole thread before posting it, thank you.

no it not normal no one said it was, but just because you are closed to it doesnt make it a medical condition. again i will go and read everything before you fumbl in and make stupid comments like this.

Why is thinking rationally and objectively considered "closed minded" by so many people? (I'm guessing you're one of them.) Just because I disagree with you is no reason for you to call me closed minded. Indeed, I think it's irrationally wrong for people to be closed minded. Scientists who won't accept a change in their model of reality when a new truth is discovered discredits the very science they practice.

and what makes you so right?

That I say something does not make it right. I did not claim that. What is said is right or wrong independently of who says it.

My point, which you obviously missed, was that people tend to favorably bias their own personal beliefs, whatever they are. Often at the expense of truth.

It cannot be denied that drugs make most "demons" go away. That is not my opinion, nor anyone else's opinion. It is an objective fact observed by medical health professionals and the people they treat.

So if demons are negatively impacting your life (or that of others around you), the best thing to do seems to be to visit a doctor and request the appropriate drugs. Regardless of what you personally believe. (That said, if they aren't a negative influence, there's no reason to seek their dismissal.)

moonbeam13, I suggest you consider why you responded so ridiculously negatively to my post. Are you aggressively defensive because you are not confident in your own position? Or perhaps you have met lots of people that argue like I do, but who are also mocking and condescendant, and you just assumed I was like them? (I'm not. Read my words as unemotionally as you can to get my drift.) Either way, calm down please.

it would seem that on this plane demons have no physical form they are in a sence etheral and can change theeir apperance

Originally posted by uca6usev2FeDREmU

By the same logic, how about we move AWAY from hinduism, islam, buddhism, voodoo, tribalistic beliefs, and so on in our discussion of demons. Towards what exactly?

this is the first time actually that other relegions have been brought up my point in saying it is to get of the christian thing and move out of relegion because there arent from what i have seen so far that many people who know much about other religions. i do though understand the point you were trying to make, but i would prefer to keep it out of relegion and talk about the beings themselves.

I think my first post qualifies as a single contribution. And I read the whole thread before posting it, thank you.

what i ment was you havent given any useful feedback only critized up to that point.

Why is thinking rationally and objectively considered "closed minded" by so many people? (I'm guessing you're one of them.) Just because I disagree with you is no reason for you to call me closed minded. Indeed, I think it's irrationally wrong for people to be closed minded. Scientists who won't accept a change in their model of reality when a new truth is discovered discredits the very science they practice.

prehaps i was a bit hasty in judging you irrational. but the fact though remains just because you cant see it how can you say it is a medical problem. as i have said before i have been tested for mental illness and the doctors say i am sane. i think everyone can see these things they just have to know how, and like some that are born with a natural abilty to ride horses and others must work at it to be able ride the same would apply here some must just work to be able to do.

That I say something does not make it right. I did not claim that. What is said is right or wrong independently of who says it.

sorry i was in a bad mood that is why i got so sarcastic with you

My point, which you obviously missed, was that people tend to favorably bias their own personal beliefs, whatever they are. Often at the expense of truth.

unfortunatly in this case truth can not be 100% proven or we wouldnt still be on this topic.

It cannot be denied that drugs make most "demons" go away. That is not my opinion, nor anyone else's opinion. It is an objective fact observed by medical health professionals and the people they treat.

just remeber drugs can make you fly and see things too

So if demons are negatively impacting your life (or that of others around you), the best thing to do seems to be to visit a doctor and request the appropriate drugs. Regardless of what you personally believe. (That said, if they aren't a negative influence, there's no reason to seek their ismissal.)

as i have said i did im sane. besides i will not take drugs, i hate medication.

moonbeam13, I suggest you consider why you responded so ridiculously negatively to my post. Are you aggressively defensive because you are not confident in your own position? Or perhaps you have met lots of people that argue like I do, but who are also mocking and condescendant, and you just assumed I was like them? (I'm not. Read my words as unemotionally as you can to get my drift.) Either way, calm down please.

i am sorry as i said i was in a really bad mood and you were an easy target to take out my fustration i will also apologise for being so hasty in my judgement of you. it is good to have those who disagree on, it is the only way to found out what is true, one must here both sides of the arguement