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The sons of god and the giants

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posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:00 PM
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The first four verses of Genesis ch6 form a famously obscure passage.
I suggest that the key to understanding them is to remember that Genesis is a work of theology, more than a work of history.
It presents a series of theological statements;
God made the world, and the human race in particular.
Something has gone wrong in the relationship between God and man, resulting in Sin.
“Judgement” has been considered (in the Flood story), as a way of dealing with Sin, but God is unwilling to carry this through to the final conclusion.
As Sin continues to prevail, despite partial judgement, God set in motion an alternative approach, by establishing a community committed to teaching the world about his ways.

This theological emphasis, incidentally, is the reason why controversies about the possible origins of the narratives matter less than people think. Academics are curious about the sources of the stories in Shakespeare, but audiences are only interested in what he has done with them. In the same way, the reader of Genesis need only be interested in what the writer has done with the stories which were available to him.

In order to understand these four verses, we need to place them within the theological structure of Genesis.
The rest of the chapter sets the scene for Noah’s Flood, and then leads into the Flood itself.
So these four verses have to be considered as part of the explanation of the Flood.
They describe the kind of society that made the Flood necessary.

The statement about marriage found at the beginning of Genesis tells us that “a man leaves his father and his mother and cleaves to his wife”.
If we look at this closely, it implies what the anthropologists call a “matrilocal” marriage system, in which a husband leaves his own people and lives with his wife’s people, instead of the other way round.
Modern readers tend not to notice this point, because we’ve got used to married couples leaving both sets of parents and setting up independently.

If the matrilocal principle is applied to kingdoms, it might mean that the kingdom is inherited not by the king’s son, but by the man who comes in from outside and marries the king’s daughter. This could offer the best of both worlds, combining dynastic stability with the ability to choose a man of proven qualities.
It may be possible to detect symptoms of this practice in Greek mythology. For example, Bellerophon fled his native Corinth, after killing a man, and married a daughter of the king of Lycia, becoming one of his heirs.
And Bellerophon was supposed to be a son of the god Poseidon, Similar claims are made for many of the Greek heroes, such as Perseus and Heracles.

I surmise, then, that the first two verses of Genesis ch6 could be describing a similar combination. That is, a warrior caste, claiming for themselves the prestige of being sons of gods, and sometimes winning kingdoms for themselves by marrying the relevant heiresses, “the daughters of men”.

Their children, in v4, are the NEPHILIM. This word is translated in early Greek versions as “giants”, or sometimes as “violent ones” or “mighty men”.
The latter translations would simply mean that the ruling warrior caste was hereditary. The “sons of god” rulers would sire mighty men who would be eligible to become rulers in their turn.

If they were “giants”, then the implication would be that the dominant caste was taller than the more subjugated strata of society, which is very plausible. We only have to remember the history of Ruanda, and how the dominant Tutsi tended to be taller than the subordinate Hutu.

There would be a vicious circle operating. The height difference would help to keep them dominant, and their dominance would exacerbate the height difference by giving them better access to food supplies.
In the most extreme version of this relationship, the shorter and weaker peoples would be pushed out into the desert, just as the African pygmies have been pushed into the rainforest, and the shortage of food would keep them comparatively stunted.

That would be why the desert-dwelling Israelites saw themselves as “grasshoppers” alongside the established residents of Canaan, “the sons of Anak, who come from the Nephilim”.

On this theory, the first four verses of Genesis ch6 would be describing a Fertile Crescent dominated by a tall, swaggering warrior caste, as seen from the viewpoint of the outsiders camped in the desert. Genesis calls them “sons of gods” simply because that is what they called themselves.
And that is exactly the kind of society which would follow on from the aggression of Cain, and would in turn lead into the conditions of the following passage, “the earth was filled with violence” (v11).
In short, their purpose is to be part of the explanation for the necessity of sending the Flood,



posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:09 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Giants have been a topic of interest for me recently. I am currently trying to piece together a timeline between the Cyclopes of Greek Mythology and ancient Greek life in general, it's quite a journey so far.

Interesting take on linking the giants of the bible and the Nephilim. Would you disagree tho that the idea of giants came from Sumerian myths and legends? The Anunnaki have strikingly similar attributes and characteristics.
edit on 15-5-2020 by strongfp because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:11 PM
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a reply to: strongfp
Possibly, but it does depend on what the Hebrew word actually means.




edit on 15-5-2020 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:13 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

I would recommend The Researchers Library of Ancient Texts: Volume One The Apocrypha Includes the Books of Enoch, Jasher, and Jubilees.

Defender Publishing.



posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:20 PM
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a reply to: infolurker
Thank you, though I think those themselves might be later interpretations.



posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:44 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Well by God you're close...

www.youtube.com...



posted on May, 15 2020 @ 05:48 PM
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a reply to: ArchangelOger
I was their historical adviser.



posted on May, 16 2020 @ 01:21 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI
Disrael I do belive that Jude brother of Jeses full of the Holy Spirit spoke this verse ]
And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
That theses were not large men but angels who lift their first estate and that was not only their dwelling place but their life forms. Now theses evangelized flesh forms matted with the women of earth to produce the Nephilimn. Which was the reason for the flood the response by God against the corrugation of all flesh thus preventing the birth of Jesus.



posted on May, 16 2020 @ 02:06 AM
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a reply to: PhilbertDezineck
Just to make it clear- your first paragraph is quotation from Jude. Your second paragraph is not a quotation from Jude, but a traditional speculation around his words.




edit on 16-5-2020 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2020 @ 11:40 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI
Jude the brother of Jesus states they were not big men and I have never read the the Jewish nation were pygmies.
Do you have any scholarly papers saying the Jews were pygmies?



posted on May, 16 2020 @ 11:51 AM
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a reply to: PhilbertDezineck
Jude does not say that he is talking about those mentioned in Genesis ch6. The applicatiion of his words to Genesis ch6 is the later interpretation.

As for the second point; "All the people that we saw in [the land] are men of great stature... we seemed to ourselves like grasshoppers, and so we seemed to them" (Numbers ch13 v33). The point is about comparative height.






edit on 16-5-2020 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 16 2020 @ 05:12 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

What are you going to say next that the sons of God are children of Seth?



posted on May, 16 2020 @ 05:23 PM
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a reply to: PhilbertDezineck
That wasn't in my mind. Is that what other people say?



posted on May, 17 2020 @ 08:57 AM
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What if the story of the Sons of God/Giants was about the evolutionary change and appearance of Homo Sapiens from Neanderthals?

Homo Sapiens were taller and had less hair then their earlier cousins, who should still be considered Adam's children, while probably couldn't swim as well.
Who probably had a rough time breeding with them at first, but as time went on, the cave dwelling neanderthal was drowned out ether by time, the flood, or the possible melting of the giant ice walls by some vengeful Sun, God who I shall not name.

Now the Homo Sapien the chosen children, and call themselves Able, when it should be Cain.


edit on 17-5-2020 by Specimen88 because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-5-2020 by Specimen88 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 17 2020 @ 10:07 AM
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a reply to: Specimen88
"There were giants on the earth in those days" implies that the giants are the ones who have disappeared. That line of thought would work better if the Neanderthals were the giants.



posted on May, 17 2020 @ 11:14 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Yea but it is also implied that the giants/nephilim are the offspring of the sons of god, and the daughters of men. Im inclined that their interactions of the sons of god who seemingly show up out of nowhere an the daughter of men, who name suggest that they are so different they shouldnt be able too.

Although I dont doubt that there were other mutations that could of been bigger, that not up for me to decide.

Yes there giants in those days...Dire wolves, Sabretooth Tiger, Sloths,...mankind's ego.

The story of Gilgasmesh was said to have great walls although doesnt say what, and it filled up like soup bowl.




edit on 17-5-2020 by Specimen88 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 17 2020 @ 11:51 AM
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a reply to: PhilbertDezineck


What are you going to say next that the sons of God are children of Seth?

As taught by the Nazarenes.
There were two invasions to this planet. The first invasion is when the Satan’s [disobedient angels] of the first creation were cast from that first realm [we now call heaven] to this second realm [we now call universe]. This entire universe is formed from earth.

As the Creator cast the Satan’s from heaven to earth He did not cast them directly to this planet. He cast them to earth or more clearly He cast the evil ones into this universe. In time from their wondering about the universe the Satan’s came to this planet of this terrestrial realm and because of its beauty took charge for well over 385,200 years or until the flood swept over the planet.

Adam was created about 1,600 years before the flood swept over the planet or about 383,600 years after the Satan’s claimed this planet. This was the first invasion from the first creation. As Adam was cast out of the garden and upon this earth, these first Satan’s were then cast into Sheol where they reside today.

The second invasion from the first creation came in the days of Yered [Jered]. Now Yered was born in 460 after Adam and died in 1422 after Adam. That made Yered the second oldest biblical recorded man to ever have lived. As Yered lived 962 years that leaves this window as when the second invasion occurred. This is referenced in the KJV bible as Great Giants living in the land in those days as being the Satan’s [Sons of God of the first creation]. Adam’s stature being about the stature of Noah [200 + feet in height] and the Satan’s stature as about 400 feet + in height. This is not set in stone but is based upon traditions of outside literature such as the works of Enoch.

So here we have the teachings of the Nazarenes that sons of God can only be of the first creation [angels] and not of man. Why so? Because Adam’s seed was procreated by man and not created by God while the angels were created by God and were the sons of God. Jesus was both the Son of God and the son of man and through his covenant we became the adopted sons of God. But not so in the days of Yered as there was but one covenant.

In those days of Yered, the invasion of about 200 sons of God left their estate and took women of the seeds of man and procreated a race of Great giants who then procreated a race of Nephiliym who in turn procreated a race of Elioud’s . These three races were the off spring of the union of sons of God and daughters of man and most were destroyed as the flood swept over the planet.

These Satan’s [of the Great Giants, Nephiliym and Elioud’s] that roam the earth today to inflict suffering and pain upon the seeds of Adam will be destroyed in the end of time. Meanwhile the Satan’s of the first invasion are in prison [hell] till the judgment of the last day.

According to this teaching the Sons of God are of the first creation [heaven] while the sons of man ore the procreated race from the seeds of Adam and this second creation.


edit on 17-5-2020 by Seede because: (no reason given)

edit on 17-5-2020 by Seede because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 18 2020 @ 02:09 AM
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a reply to: SeedeIs this where the gap ocured between the first and second creation?



posted on May, 18 2020 @ 02:03 PM
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a reply to: PhilbertDezineck


a reply to: Seede Is this where the gap ocured between the first and second creation?

In my understanding the Sumerian king list tablets are the key to the pre flood era. This antediluvian era had no time as we understand time today. Even though the universe was in motion we have no idea of when the motion started. It could have been unmeasured eons before the fourth biblical day. Adam was placed in the garden for a purpose and tradition tells us that purpose was to protect him from the castaways of the 1st creation.

To better understand time is to realize that as we read the clay tablets of the Sumerian king list, we are understanding time as translated from the tablets. Not that the Sumerians understood our time but only as they understood their idea of time. Both of us really do not understand time when it did not exist. It only exists as we understand it today but the angels of the first creation who were cast out of the heavenly realm also had no idea of time till time was created in the biblical fourth day era. So in effect we are looking at a possibility of unmeasurable eras.

In the 1st creation that we now call heaven there is no time. That is very hard for most people to understand because our very existence is constantly measured in time. As our terrestrial body returns to its source [earth], the spirit of life [mind] returns to its source which is the first creation. If the mind [spirit] is salvageble it will be given a new body and reside in the 1st creation realm forever. The problem with science today is that they cannot connect the Sumerian king list with Judaism or Christianity and the only connection that exists is the Hebrew bible and the Sumerian king list. In that lies the problem of modern science.

Judaism understands their creation as the beginning of both Adam and the universe in time. What they do not realize is that time cannot uniformly exist when it did not exist. That is impossible and one would think that an existing inanimate and a animate existence can not exist in its present form before it existed in its present form. So in that respect there is indeed a Gap which we call antediluvian. Through archeology we understand that the Sumerian culture came from the Akkadian culture but where did the Akkadian culture come from? Their culture came from an unknown culture and i am convinced that the even if that were to be discovered it would be just one more step to the king list.

When this is understood as a key to unlock some of the mystery of existence it also can never reveal all of the mysteries of our existence because those eras of existence are forever lost in the flood. As the flood destroyed the antediluvian periods it also changed the laws of physics of this world. As the world ages and runs down as an aged clock, the physics or laws that we think are permanent are not permanent at all. Most of us will never notice the difference simply because most of us will not be here to note the difference.
'



posted on May, 18 2020 @ 05:57 PM
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the Giants are here, been here all along, part beast part devil








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