Originally posted by Kriz_4
I am tired of this "if they have oil why do they want nuclear energy?" argument, isn't it very obvious?

Sell the oil to idiots that drive 8mpg SUVs in the West and make cleaner energy for themselves. As someone said they have good Uranium resourses. Why do they want to produce their own fuel? Again obvious, so they do not have to PAY for it from another country, sensible huh. They have also said that they think that within 20 years there will likely be a large world need for supply of nuclear fuel, they can then sell it to the West, sensible huh. They have agreed to give spent fuel to Russia, good idea huh.

Some people are either unaware of facts, know little of Iran, are paranoid or just like the thought of killing.

[edit on 13-3-2005 by Kriz_4]

OK == lets think this one out. Iran - supports Hizbualla, Al-Qaida, Islamic Jihad, Sworn to the destruction of Israel, build nuclear facilities spread out all all over their country in bunkers. Attempts to fool UN inspectors by dismantling suspected sites. reneged on previous agreements with the EU repeatedly . Things that make you go HHHHMMMMMM.

Originally posted by 00PS

Hmm that's too bad. I always thought Shabaat was pretty special, but if you wan't to consider yourself an endangered species that's pretty bad.

Do you know what that's called? Victimization. Many of the African American community found themself insuch an arguement around the turn of the 1970's after federally funded programs to integrate them into society had come into full effect. When failure on their side happened they cried Victimization. It is still a social pattern and problem in the community.

You are saying that after 2000 years of Survival as a tribe, evolving into a civilization and culture that you are now endangered as a species? Sorry bud, we are the same species. If you think Jews are a different 'Species' you must have some superiority issues with your vicimization issues, but I'm sure you unintentionally put that 'secies' word in there right?

When you speak to me, you don't sound like Jews are equal to Arabs, you sound like Jews are different than Arabs (rightly so) however different in a 'good' way which would insinuate the 'other' is 'bad'.

Do you always babble so much?

Zionism is not mere Nationalism and I think we both understand this and don't really have to pursue a philosophical discussion on the origins and foundation of Zionism nore the political and cultural undertones that allowed it to incubate and manifest itself throughout the world.

Again babble.

I also think this....

Ahh good to the nitty gritty.

The United States continually stands in the way of world peace and will not stand in the way of world war.

Ahh is that why the US forced Shamir into the Madrid conference and subsequently Rabin into OSLO?

The United States has shown with continuity that it is in no way interested in the health of this planet, its
own citizens or the world.

Is that why the entire world bases its environmental policies in line with the EPA? Drug laws with the FDA and disease research with the CDC?

Is that why the US provides astonomical grants for health research to US and foreign companies? I do not see Europeans doing that.

The U.S. has blocked Humanitarian and Military assistance from the U.N., (1) It
has blocked legislature on the regulation of Environment laws (2) nationally and internationally the latest
of these the Kyoto Accord. With the loosening of regulations on logging companies and opening up Alaska
for oil drilling, the polices of the USA show the rape of a continent and planet. The U.S. has blocked
the development of the third world, health of the planet, and care of it's own citizens.

On environmental issues I tend to agree - The US has a capitalist thinking that is detremental but I think that with time that will be corrected.

But it will not block
Israel from Bombing Iran.

Well read current events - the US is supporting European appeasement policies to sway Iranian ambitions away from their Nuclear Ambitions. If that doesn't succeed the whole Iranian issue will be transferred to the UN security counsel for sanctions. Again diplomacy - My guess is that the Israeli 'threat' is a ploy to force Iran into concessions on the Nuclear issue. In parallel the US will work on Iranian movements destabilizing the government and ultimately an internal democratic reform away from a theocracy.
Of course, if Iran is not persuaded by economic concessions then their ambitions are more likely to be military than economic. Then they deserve a beating.


[edit on 13/3/05 by JudahMaccabbi]

Originally posted by JudahMaccabbi

Originally posted by Kriz_4
I am tired of this "if they have oil why do they want nuclear energy?" argument, isn't it very obvious?

Sell the oil to idiots that drive 8mpg SUVs in the West and make cleaner energy for themselves. As someone said they have good Uranium resourses. Why do they want to produce their own fuel? Again obvious, so they do not have to PAY for it from another country, sensible huh. They have also said that they think that within 20 years there will likely be a large world need for supply of nuclear fuel, they can then sell it to the West, sensible huh. They have agreed to give spent fuel to Russia, good idea huh.

Some people are either unaware of facts, know little of Iran, are paranoid or just like the thought of killing.

[edit on 13-3-2005 by Kriz_4]

OK == lets think this one out. Iran - supports Hizbualla, Al-Qaida, Islamic Jihad, Sworn to the destruction of Israel, build nuclear facilities spread out all all over their country in bunkers. Attempts to fool UN inspectors by dismantling suspected sites. reneged on previous agreements with the EU repeatedly . Things that make you go HHHHMMMMMM.

Whatever, more propaganda rantings. If you can give me a realistic opinion on what I have said then I will debate with you. The fact remains that there is no evidence that Iran is trying to build weapons. The belief that Iran only wants to destroy Israel and the US is plain ludicrous. And please do not come back with some silly picture of an Iranian missle with "death to america" on it. I have seen the same "phrases" on many Western missles, relating to other countries. After the amount of threats made to Iran, are you suprised by this kind of thing? My guess is, you leave Iran alone, and they couldn't give two hoots what happens in the US.

[edit on 13-3-2005 by Kriz_4]

[edit on 13-3-2005 by Kriz_4]

Originally posted by Kriz_4
My guess is, you leave Iran alone, and they couldn't give two hoots what happens in the US.
[edit on 13-3-2005 by Kriz_4]

That is what was said about Hitler and Nazi germany prior to WWII.

IN all honesty - do you think that any type of proof would convince you? If an Iranian official knocked on your door and said that the Nuclear program was military and not civilian you would say that it was a Mossad operative. If Iran attacks Israel you would say that the Israelis did it as an excuse to attack Iran.

Originally posted by JudahMaccabbi
OK == lets think this one out. Iran - supports Hizbualla, Al-Qaida, Islamic Jihad, Sworn to the destruction of Israel, build nuclear facilities spread out all all over their country in bunkers. Attempts to fool UN inspectors by dismantling suspected sites. reneged on previous agreements with the EU repeatedly . Things that make you go HHHHMMMMMM.

I am sick and tired of people saying Iran supports Al-Qaede. al-Qaded are Wahabists. The hate Shias (for example look at Iraq).

And about the EU, it was the EU that left Iran not the other way around. It was promised that they would join the WTO if they suspen their enrichment program for a while. They did and the EU didnt pay back. So it was a one way relationship and Iran left it.

Originally posted by soficrow

Apparently no one cares. When will these fools ever learn? But Bush opened the door to "pre-emptive attacks." Now, it's a "strategy" available to everyone - and the Geneva Conventions be dammed.

President's Bush fault once more?....

Do tell me, did president Bush also opened the door for the Israelis when they attacked the Iraqi nuclear facility in 1981?....

When will you learn that many countries, as they have stated, hate Israel and would destroy it if they have a chance?.... the extremist Islamic state of Iran having nukes is bad news for everyone, more so for Israel.

[edit on 13-3-2005 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Kidfinger
..............
If this scares you, I suggest you go hide in a deep cave. When Isreal strikes Iran, this will be the outcome.


[edit on 3/13/05 by Kidfinger]

When Israel attacked Iraq's nuclear facility in 1981 nothing like what you stated happened....and back then Iraq was more powerful than Iran is now.

Originally posted by Muaddib
When Israel attacked Iraq's nuclear facility in 1981 nothing like what you stated happened....and back then Iraq was more powerful than Iran is now.

Back then Iraq had more to worry about than attacking Israel. See Iran-Iraq war.

Originally posted by Sep
Back then Iraq had more to worry about than attacking Israel. See Iran-Iraq war.

And now Russia has a lot to worry about too, and so does China, if they ever attack the US, this plan would have to have been in the works for quite a long time now...you don't just start a war out of the blue, and much less against the US and our true allies. China and Russia would need the help of other countries in any war agains the US, as well as all sorts of tactics to weaken the US, and this takes time. So, if at any time these countries do attack the US, they have been planning this for a long time....before the Bush administration or even before the Clinton administration.

Edited to add--- They certainly have been trying to weaken the US, but as to what goals they are doing this?...well, most of you know what i think, but I guess we will see in time what these countries really have in mind.



[edit on 13-3-2005 by Muaddib]

It is not implausable that it has been in the works for some time Muaddib is it?

Imagine.... the Iran situation worsens, and "someone" bombs Iran's nuclear facility. Iran shoots at Isreal (everyone will assume Isreal did it). Isreal retaliates the US acts to help. Iran and Syria attacks Isreal, and US forces in Iraq. They are all caught up in a long drawn out fight.

Near the same time....during the upcoming South Korea/US manuvers next week, North Korea shoots a warning shot accross the bow of one of the ships to warn them off. Lets say it is pretty close, or even hits it. The US thinks it is going to hit, or it does hit, they retaliates with a couple of tomahawks. NK starts shooting more and is paranoid enough to think it is all out war. They are all caught up in a long drawn out fight over nothing.

This would be a hard time financially and in terms of manpower/resources for the US. Similar I guess to a double Vietnam?

Meanwhile, Russia, China, and their minions sit back and quietly support N. Korea, Iran, and the others with weapons, money, etc., without risking anything. Dragging the conflicts out. Similar to China's actions during the last Korean war, and Russia's actions during the vietnam war.

This is not even bringing nuclear weapons into the scenario.

How would the chessboard look after that I wonder and worry. Just a scary thought in my head I guess. Sorry, didn't mean to say that out loud.

[edit on 13-3-2005 by makeitso]

Mauddib;

What do you think your government policies are aimed at?

It's aimed at the containment of China and Russia, US now has bases in most middle-asian countries, not to mention the Southeastern asian countries like Japan, SK, Phillipines. Not to mention the pacific countries like Australia, etc.

Before you talk about other countries, take a look at your 160+ military bases across world and stop being so damn paranoid.


[edit on 13-3-2005 by rapier28]

Originally posted by Sep

Originally posted by Muaddib
When Israel attacked Iraq's nuclear facility in 1981 nothing like what you stated happened....and back then Iraq was more powerful than Iran is now.

Back then Iraq had more to worry about than attacking Israel. See Iran-Iraq war.

It was a different world then Muadib. There are new tensions and an accumulation of hate and fear being played on. The world governments are all on edge right now and the tension is thick. It will take little to accomplish what my first reply said.

[edit on 3/14/05 by Kidfinger]

Have Israeli forces ever struck a nuclear site before. I recall hearing recently that they might have... Unsure about that one though. I think that if Isreal did this then they would be starting war pretty much. If they do not do it then they will just be living in fear whether justified or not I do not know.

I guess we could see this one coming.

Might not be a bad idea to research the timeline of events that led to the Israeli attack on the Iraqi reactor in 1981.