It's Time to live with this Pandemic, not be scared of it.

originally posted by: AnonyMason
a reply to: Liquesence

The president says a lot of things that aren't true. It's called lying. He does it regularly.

We have no where near the amount of tests required nationally to gain real metrics on covid 19 in the US. And we won't for a while.

Do you understand the shear mechanics of testing everyone in the USA for Covid-19, lets say they simplified the test down to a swab test like with the flu even still it would be quite a feet of social engineering to get it done.

But its not a simple swab test , If I understand correctly its much more complicated.

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

It requires actual engineering. Social engineering is akin to tricking someone into doing something you want them to do.

The logistics aren't as sheer as you may think. Daunting, yes. but we have firm numbers. To test everyone requires roughly 331 million tests, required medical staff, and PPE to administer said tests, facilities, probably drive through stations, etc.

There are several tests available that are administered in different ways. Learn about them here.

Just to be clear, right now production can't keep up with the spread of the virus. So the best thing to do is stay home, and wait it out like the rest of the planet. Work will resume when it's able. But any notion of returning to what we considered normal life should be completely dismissed for the rest of 2020. The virus doesn't care what we think or what politicians say.

a reply to: LoveSolMoonDeath

Wait, if volontary efforts is the same efforts as we do now (enforced) then, there can be no difference.

In terms of total patient numbers and the rate of the spread, there may or may not be a difference, depending on how many voluntarily chose to participate in safeguarding measures, and how many choose to continue as usual. But yes, voluntary measures would achieve the same goal of slowing the spread, and not overwhelming hospitals, as the same measures imposed by law (and the barrel of a government gun.)

However, in terms of freedom, respect for natural and enumerated rights, and not setting any precedents that we don't want to keep, it makes all the difference in the world!

Did you check the "flatten the curb covid"?

No, I haven't yet. I was responding to other comments to me. I am already read up on the principles and theories of flattening the curve, basically the same thing as "slowing the spread."

But any notion of returning to what we considered normal life should be completely dismissed for the rest of 2020. The virus doesn't care what we think or what politicians say.

a reply to: AnonyMason

I cant refute what you said, but I do hope your wrong.

I don't see how we can keep this up for an entire year, Socialism would be the only option to keep this up for a year, even still would that even work?

it requires actual engineering. Social engineering is akin to tricking someone into doing something you want them to do.

No doubt , I would say it requires both, because what is happening right now to this country is social engineering whether people want to see it like that or not , it is the case.

a reply to: Boadicea

Sadly, and it's been proven over time, lawless states doesn't survive and people will do as they see fit. It's a pandemic and yes, there is the choice to have many more deads, like Italy/NY, or sacrifice money to start economy later...you can't have both. Best wishes for the later

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
a reply to: Boadicea

Sadly, and it's been proven over time, lawless states doesn't survive and people will do as they see fit. It's a pandemic and yes, there is the choice to have many more deads, like Italy/NY, or sacrifice money to start economy later...you can't have both. Best wishes for the later

So six of one and half a dozen of the other? If that's the case, then I would still take my chances with the virus -- which only gets one shot to do its damage -- than with a dictatorship that will do its damage for far longer. I also have a much better chance fighting a virus than fighting a dictator pointing a gun at my head.

But ya know what's saddest of all? I'll bet we could save the most people by telling them to take Vitamin C to reduce the severity and duration of their illness. Or the benefits of Vitamin D, and sunshine. Or zinc... or silver... or probiotics... or olive leaf extract and oregano oil...

If people were educated and informed on the many many nutritional and herbal supplements with the appropriate healing qualities, people would be far more like to have mild cases easily nursed at home -- no hospitalizations necessary, and no deaths.

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
a reply to: Boadicea

Sadly, and it's been proven over time, lawless states doesn't survive and people will do as they see fit. It's a pandemic and yes, there is the choice to have many more deads, like Italy/NY, or sacrifice money to start economy later...you can't have both. Best wishes for the later

There is something else to consider, and that is the many people who will be harmed -- even killed -- by these enforced rules. How many of the elderly and vulnerable living alone and self-isolating will become ill and die from complications because they couldn't take care of themselves, and no one was allowed to take care of them? No one who could recognize that they need medical aid immediately? Much less get them that medical care? How many people are stuck in dark and dingy apartments with no fresh air or sunshine or exercise, quite possibly jeopardizing their health, especially if they have underlying health conditions? How many people with chronic health conditions are going to lose their job, and their health insurance along with it? How many of those people will die later, because their resources and healthcare was taken away from them? How many people are going to be malnourished and weakened without access to adequate quality nutritional foods? How many wives are being beaten by their abusive husband with no escape? How many children are likewise being being or sexually abused by their parent or another family member, with no relief and nowhere to run?

There is no virtue in sacrificing some in order to save others.

Alway bashing politically, never let it go to rest as your people say!!a reply to: Phage

a reply to: WUNK22

Or just pointing a flaw in someone's reasoning by presenting an example which they might relate to.

originally posted by: Boadicea

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
a reply to: Boadicea

Sadly, and it's been proven over time, lawless states doesn't survive and people will do as they see fit. It's a pandemic and yes, there is the choice to have many more deads, like Italy/NY, or sacrifice money to start economy later...you can't have both. Best wishes for the later

There is something else to consider, and that is the many people who will be harmed -- even killed -- by these enforced rules. How many of the elderly and vulnerable living alone and self-isolating will become ill and die from complications because they couldn't take care of themselves, and no one was allowed to take care of them? No one who could recognize that they need medical aid immediately? Much less get them that medical care? How many people are stuck in dark and dingy apartments with no fresh air or sunshine or exercise, quite possibly jeopardizing their health, especially if they have underlying health conditions? How many people with chronic health conditions are going to lose their job, and their health insurance along with it? How many of those people will die later, because their resources and healthcare was taken away from them? How many people are going to be malnourished and weakened without access to adequate quality nutritional foods? How many wives are being beaten by their abusive husband with no escape? How many children are likewise being being or sexually abused by their parent or another family member, with no relief and nowhere to run?

There is no virtue in sacrificing some in order to save others.

You raise some interesting points I've not seen anyone else mention , and your very right.

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

And how to we accomplish those check marks by going back to work? Opening up restaurants, church, etc.

Doing those things is not possible while also maintaing social distance, example A.

Concerts, shows, et all? Get used to alot of those things being pretty locked down for awhile.

And just that alone will make it so that the government WILL have to continue paying unemployment otherwise there will be people in the streets

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

You raise some interesting points I've not seen anyone else mention , and your very right.

The really scary thing is that once I saw how easily it could happen in one situation, I couldn't stop thinking of another situation and another and another and another...

a reply to: carewemust

Okay, you first. Believe it or not a lot of these people do not want to or have any oncentive to return to work currently with valid reasons.

Those who are able to work from home those that cannot and are unessential should get UBI for now. I mean you only care about people getting back to work eh?

I personally think the 2 week incubation is going to be too much to overcome, supposedly many people who have Corona never know even know it. As soon as isolation stops, we will quickly relapse.

Its the same thing with the flu, when you hear someone say they never get the flu(normally people who stay fit and eat well), the truth is they do get it, but their immunity is strong enough to just handle it.
People should take the isolation as an opportunity to increase their immunity with

-Exercise(2 days a week of high intensity interval - 15 minutes,try to get 30 minutes aerobic the rest),

-Sleep(1 hour after no artificial light and 6 hours after caffeine free)

-Good nutrition. Even with a good diet, most people are deficient in vitamin D, magnesium, vitamin K, probiotic, and omega 3s. As you get older a good digestive enzyme, lots of things decline with age(adding Collagen good idea), good digestion is key.

Like the common cold and flu, covid is probably here to stay.


Edit - From another thread, probably good idea to add quercetin and ECGC(green tea) to your diet to prevent virus replication, hopefully we get some good dosage information soon.

a reply to: Boadicea

I too am struck by your compassion . It's a very very difficult time for all of us , the world over .

This has been raised before that the states particularly trump seem to have a lax attitude to the gravity of coronavirus , for example education in the UK about social distancing has been excellent in comparison , we all. (vaguely) know why we re having a lockdown too. Vague because people have little idea how serious the circumstances really really are , and just how deadly the virus is . At the moment things are absolutely touch and go worldwide , containment is either going to happen or the virus gets away from control and it's looking very possible the later will be the case.
Lockdown in our countries is the only real means and by the way it's the appropriately designed means from even 100 years ago and it ought to work but we still don't know, it's more contagious and deadly than the Spanish swine flu . By enough of a degree to warrant strict measures . In a way were lucky we have systems that recognise when it's appropriate, and it is as of right now , but time is a healer and we'll see . It might be a six months or a couple of years yet. Laws made recently don't only require the public to stay at home they also for example can force Walmart to come up with the goods, at least in terms of information . They're appropriate measures given a highly sketchy global supply chain , which is having links broken all over as we speak. Export bans, surplus grabbing, trade deals scrapped borders shut, the EU tearing itself in chunks , etc etc etc , the world over .
We must have compassion on everyone at this time. Maybe it's good to remind people their general hospital services remain open and available while a huge problem is seen out . It's awful to see life as we knew it degrade before our eyes , but honestly there's no other option. Those old people even if lonelier are more likely to live and less likely to die of a terrible disease at the same time as most others and as ttue anarchy develops because honestly that's what would be the result. And then where would they be ?
Thanks for taking the time to explain because you're of a respected stature as also is phage. Please see the other side of this coin because if this was a nothing burger , you know he'd be saying so ?
But he's not, we need this to happen so the world doesn't go to absolute mayhem , and that cannot be allowed , the general suffering would be immense.

If you want a bugbear , think of the rest of the world. In Egypt , Vietnam , Bangladesh , Mexico etc they're banning social posts AND msm reports which describe the way this will spread . Given the poor education of the western public pre march 2020 regarding pandemics, imagine the confusion there is there , and those are places lockdowns do not work , and it hasn't worked in china . The public s have be n hood winked over the oncoming gravity of this event.
The UK government is furious with china, livid because they're outright lying about their caseload , at this time Corona about to take them down in effect. It's about to ruin the world is the report to note instead . News travels fast but it's travelling fast over people's heads right now , there really isn't time to talk about flu numbers or debate the ideology of lockdown response. Maintaining order and food security at least for now is more important for everyone including those more vulnerable people you care about too.

a reply to: asabuvsobelow

Look at the forum.. a page and then nothing.. where else can we talk...

a reply to: asabuvsobelow


Why do we list so few people as recovered in the United States? We have been doing this for weeks now and they don’t list people that are recovered to scare people. We have had the antibodies test for a while and will not let people take it to prove they have recovered and to give plasma to help others and you still can’t get a test unless you are sick enough to go to the hospital and they will not let people take the malaria drug - zpac combination.

This is a terror mission perpetuated on the masses.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: asabuvsobelow
"So I say it again lets prevent as many deaths as we can using Covid-19 prevention methods , and get back to work ."

The two seem to be mutually exclusive as of the present time.

Only to people who have no concept of reality, logic and reason.

originally posted by: vonclod
Whatever you think, this is more deadly than the flu.

You do realize that they don't actually count flu deaths, right?

You do realize that the algorithms they use to estimate flu deaths each year don't count people who do from co-morbidities as dying from the flu, unless the numbers of people getting the flu vaccine that year are lower than they like and they need to bump the CFR to try to scare people into getting the vaccine, right?

You do realize that there are a crap-ton of people currently being counted as having died from COVID-19 that wouldn't be counted if the model for counting flu deaths was followed, right?

The reality is, people make value judgements with respect to their lives and risk of death every hour of every day.

Some of you seem to prefer huddling in a puddle of whimpering fear, and forcing everyone else to join you, rather than simply facing life with a fearless passion.

Not me.

a reply to: DoctorBluechip

I understand what you're saying, but I don't accept the premise that there is nothing else we can do. Our first efforts should be to minimize the severity of the virus for those who catch it. What if we could nip this in the bud with something as simple as Vitamin C for everyone??? Yes, I know that Vitamin C cannot and will not prevent anyone getting Covid. Yes, I know that Vitamin C cannot and will not "cure" Covid. But we do know that Vitamin C can be used effectively for treating the symptoms of both the virus and complications.

Last night, I was looking up some of the clinical studies in progress right now. The following is taken from one of those studies:

Brief Summary: 2019 new coronavirus (2019-nCoV) infected pneumonia, namely severe acute respiratory infection (SARI) has caused global concern and emergency. There is a lack of effective targeted antiviral drugs, and symptomatic supportive treatment is still the current main treatment for SARI.

Vitamin C is significant to human body and plays a role in reducing inflammatory response and preventing common cold. In addtion, a few studies have shown that vitamin C deficiency is related to the increased risk and severity of influenza infections.

We hypothize that Vitamin C infusion can help improve the prognosis of patients with SARI. Therefore, it is necessary to study the clinical efficacy and safety of vitamin C for the clinical management of SARI through randomized controlled trials during the current epidemic of SARI.

Vitamin C Infusion for the Treatment of Severe 2019-nCoV Infected Pneumonia

The bolded is fact, as known and evidenced by previous clinical studies. The underlined is their well-informed theory that because Vitamin C has demonstrated healing properties in other viruses, that it will have the same with this virus. It isn't expressly stated in the above, but we do know that pneumonia (inflammation in the lungs) is one of the severe complications with Covid. So fair enough, right? Isn't that reason enough to think Vitamin C supplements could prevent or at least mitigate the worst complication?

And that's not even all. We know that many virus patients have depleted Vitamin C. Whether that's a pre-existing condition or caused by the virus or both, we don't know. But obviously, Vitamin C levels are important. We know that Vitamin C can reduce the severity and duration of symptoms. That's pretty significant, right?

These doctors all think so and their results are confirming their theory:

Hospital Turns to High-Dose Vitamin C to Fight Coronavirus

New York hospitals treating coronavirus patients with vitamin C

Coronavirus doctors treating patients with Vitamin C claim they’re doing ‘significantly better’

Arizona doctor believes Vitamin C could be game changer in COVID-19 treatment

How many of these severe cases could have been completely prevented with simple Vitamin C supplementation prior to getting sick? Or upon noticing symptoms? I'll bet a hell of a lot. And if the government is going to throw around money, I'd much rather have them offering free liposomal Vitamin C and/or injections to the people who want it than much of what's being done.

I won't get into the nitty gritty here and now, but I think we are totally dropping the ball on the health and healing effects of Vitamin D and good old fashioned sunshine. Our state recorded our first Covid case the end of January, but we're still below 3,000 cases with 64 deaths. And I know that many of those deaths were in nursing homes and retirement communities. Given the early presence here, and the many many retired people who snowbird here, one would think we'd have much higher numbers. But we also have warmth and sunshine and dry air... and I know Vitamin C was sold out everywhere! And we were literally just put on stay-at-home orders in the last few days.

There is much much more that could have been done and should have been done -- with or without quarantines and shutdowns.