It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
originally posted by: oloufo
a reply to: Jonjonj
why doesn't someone go to the public with such a video? he could make a lot of money and become famous...
fake, of course.
I think you are making a lot of asumptions. The shadows move around because of the atmospheric distortion.
If the shadows move because of the atmospheric distortion then they wouldn't be the only thing moving, as the shadow of the topmost "UFO" does, there's a moment when it jumps one pixel in one direction then in the other.
IF you were going to fake this, the methods used in any approach would at the very least create correct shadows. Trying to use the shadowing as negative evidence in my book is folly.
No, there's one approach in which the shadows would have to be made manually, and would be very difficult to make them correctly.
You have to consider approach...
1) The moon footage is real, the UFOs added afterwards. In this set up, you'd need to perfectly match the natural atmospheric distortion... a near impossible task. I don't even know how you'd do that.
There's no need to match the atmospheric distortion, the objects and their shadows are too small for us to see if the distortion is correct or not.
2) The moon and the UFOs are all CG. In this scenario, the lighting and ufos shadows would be correct because it is easier to get it right than to get it wrong.
I agree, that's why I mentioned 3D models of the Moon in a previous post. That would look perfect, with only the need to add the atmospheric distortion.
So doing number 1)... this would be a really hard way of faking it, and I'm not sure why you'd bother... too many hoops to jump through. A) You'd have to create and match the surface of the moon we are looking at accurately, in order to get the shadows working at all.
That's why I don't think this is real, because the shadows do not match.
B) Try to match the atmospheric distortion to all of your work... again, near impossible. Go ask any 3d artist how you'd match the distortion without a tonne of work.
No need to match the distortion, you just have to move the objects around a little, being so small they cannot be affected in the same way as the Moon.
PS: in your 25 years in CGI as an animator/effects/video guy, have you worked with 3D models? If you did then you shouldn't have any problem recreating the video, by creating a sphere with a light source with parallel rays being cast on it, more or less from the same direction as we see on the video, and add some small cigar-shaped objects over it to see if the shadows look the same. I'd do it if I knew how, but I haven't used a 3D program in a long time.
originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People
originally posted by: saladfingers123456
I'm not seeing any major fame and glory agenda with this footage, unless Jean-Michel Tenac and his friend are fake people in service of Zeal the youtube channel.
People make up stories for reasons other than fame and glory. Some people make up stories simply because they "get their jollies" from the act of trying to fool people.
No fame, glory, or monetary gain is required.
It is Earths atmosphere that is distorting, so everything behind it is effected in the same way. I see no issues with how the UFOs and the moon are affected. It would seem to be a perfect job. Stretching and bending along with the surface of the moon behind it.
originally posted by: saladfingers123456
To make a video such as this manually, i.e. by hand is beyond reasoning... It would be the most silly way of doing it, and with the quality of the result, I wouldn't imagine such a low brow approach to creating it. Period. I totally reject that concept for creating it... the person would have to be a masochist.
But ONLY adding atmospheric distortion is a big ONLY. Not so easy. As a telescope user, this looks like a perfect simulation of it. That is not easy. But of all the methods, this would be the most likely. Unless there are tools to achieve this (not saying there aren't yet!) then it still means it is a complex fake.
But I see no reason to fake this. I mean the guy who filmed it said “I regularly film the moon by day, at time of the first and last crescent. I think hidden activity has to be visible on the Moon, it is at that moment the population does not observe it because the first and last crescent makes it more discreet” ...that sounds like someone who has studied this subject and it presents a strong logic... genuine reasoning.
Too many variables? For what? If the shadows do not match reality that's the result of a bad work, not many variables needed for that.
I don't agree with you on this point. I see no evidence to show the shadows don't match. Too many variables.
You're still thinking about the manual approach here. You need to throw that idea away... it wouldn't be a logical approach for such a polished result.
I could do some approximation, but I'm not sure how good a 3d model of the moon is out there, or if it is freely accessible... any ideas? I'd love to give it a go. Really not an easy task either. But I'm also cautious not to muddy the waters if this is genuine. The originator of the clip needs to come forward really for an interview with someone, a bit of authenticity.
Anyway, any idea on the origin of a correctly mapped 3d object of the moon?
p.s. Regarding the Haiti UFO clip... yes, for research, but they came out and said that... they owned up to it. I'd expect similar here.
But I refer you again to what the originator said about his efforts to capture something during the cresent moon. This sounds like it comes from someone genuinely interested in the subject. This might be the first time they ever caught anything... who knows how long they have been trying.