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We The People... even in times of Peking Pestilence

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+13 more 
posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:09 PM
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So to facilitate an apparently called for "safe space" of doom pornography, negativity, wallowing in fascist policies, celebration of tyranny of the masses, and general support of the ideologies of mass hysteria, it has become clear that the real casualties of the Chinese Coronavirus... the western world citizens' Rights, freedoms, livelihoods, and economies, aren't to be discussed in update threads specifically intended for the discussion of the impacts of the virus. God forbid someone rain on the pathetic fear mongering parade taking place in those threads as it seemingly kills the hallucinations of doom and paranoia buzz many of the participants are basking in. So we find ourselves here, in this thread... in a new world of horrors where support of basic human and Constitutional Rights is now considered a "Mud Pit" topic and is political mudslinging and antagonistic to champion Rights and freedoms over celebration of illogical paranoid delusions.

Let's be blunt here, I'll keep this to the USA specifically as that is the country I pay every year in the form of taxation. The rest of the world governments can do whatever they wish to do, that's between them and their sheep and I have no business judging it. If the people of Europe are satisfied pissing away centuries of progress in the name of an invisible boogeyman, then that's on them. In the USA, however, I actually do have a vested interest and a voice... at least until these bastards decide Freedom of Speech will be added to the list of other Rights and liberties shot in the back of the head in the name of Coronavirus.

The Constitution of the United States
It's a beautiful document, but more than that, it was a divinely inspired document. The signing of the Constitution represented a huge leap forward by humanity, righting wrongs that had flourished in the world and recovering from progress lost during the Dark Ages centuries before. In the 233 years since it was penned, nearly 1.4 million soldiers have directly died defending the document and the principles held within and another 1.5 million have been maimed doing the same. Countless lives have been taken from our enemies, countless lives have been turned upside down in this country as fathers, mothers, husbands, wives, daughters, and sons have gone off to fight for this country and returned dramatically changed or not returned at all, and during many of those wars civilians were asked and ordered to sacrifice major components of their lives to support those efforts.

Now along comes a virus which *may* impact a lot of lives. It *may* even reach the point of total US military casualties. It *may* not even come close, we don't know. What we do know is, at the time when states and cities began "locking down" in this country (March 19th) there were 12,000 cases nationwide and less than 200 deaths.

Let's look at this concept of "lockdown". It's called stay at home in some places, self isolation order in others, hunker down here in Alaska, but it all seems to be directing towards the same thing... defacto restriction of the liberties of everyone within the borders of the entity issuing the order. We're hearing news stories of Chicago, LA, and NYC threatening arrest and fines to people who are outside of their homes for "unapproved" reasons or are outside of their homes for "too long" during "approved" activities. Businesses are being shuttered due to arbitrary and often unilateral government decisions of what is "essential" and what is "non-essential," all absent any court ruling and absent any declaration of martial law. Millions have lost their livelihood not due to valid market factors like supply and demand, but due to the government threatening major action against employers who dare remain open for business in the wake of a tsunami of 12,000 cases on march 19th in a nation of 330 million citizens. Governments are shuttering churches and forbidding congregation and free exercise of religion. Governments are declaring firearm and ammo sales businesses "non-essential" and shuttering them, fully infringing on the 2nd Amendment Rights of American. Governments are picking and choosing what medical procedures are "essential" and forbidding American medical providers from conducting any non-essential procedures, violating Americans Rights over their own bodies. Governments are doing all of this in total absence of the one legal avenue to remove Americans' Rights, a declaration of martial law.

This is wrong, this is criminal, and this is insanity. We're allowing our country to be gang raped by a gaggle of frightened doom porn junkies when it had stood for nearly 250 years as a pinnacle of freedom and liberty, ideals which were allegedly more important than individual's lives because, without those ideals, life wasn't worth it anyway. What the hell is wrong with this country? Where does this stop? We're at 1500 deaths presently and the Tyranny of the Majority has long ago deemed that's enough deaths to demand all happily surrender these freedoms and not rock the boat, WTF are we all gonna look like when we pass 10,000? 100,000? A million? What's next on the neck chopping block, the Right to freedom from slavery? Will we reach 100,000 deaths and the majority suddenly demand that every American report to their local hospital to start working each according to their ability to each position according its need? Will a million deaths see us demanded to abdicate the Right over our own homes and those who are hunkered down in their residences while testing negative will be demanded to open their homes to provide uninfected quarantine zones to strangers? Where will this nonsense end?

For those who disregard the Constitution, how about something more international to ruminate over?
The Universal Declaration of Human Rights

It's funny, I don't see "Have your fears pandered to and coddled" anywhere in either of these documents... yet here we be, all knees must bend before the Tyranny of the Majority and their undying demand that all must be active participants in this fear fest of mass hysteria or remain silent lest the fearful suddenly realize "Hey, I'm acting a fool here and the price tag for this exercise is getting a bit much."

Wake up people, you're being played and freely handing over everything America has fought and died for over the past 2 and a half centuries. Worse, it's not a loaded gun against your temple forcing you to hand it all over, it's a boogeyman and an irrational fear of "what if?" which, frankly, is present in your life 24/7 and has been since the day you popped from the womb. December 30, the day before the world at large knew of this pestilence China crapped onto this cursed planet you could have slipped getting out of the shower, conked your head, and been found dead in a pool of blood naked as the day your were born... did that make you so willing to piss away your rights and freedom? No? Then why are you allowing this to game us all this badly?



+20 more 
posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:14 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

I hope you don't die from Covid-19

It would actually be a shame, because you'd be remembered for the idiocy of this post and the fact that you just couldn't resist being all 'MURICA' about the situation.



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posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:16 PM
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a reply to: neformore

I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees, Nef.

The fact that championing Rights and Freedom are associated by you to "Murica" speaks volumes and basically proves that all those years of people like you saying "Freedom exists in countries other than America" were not being very honest with themselves.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:27 PM
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One of my nephews was pulled over and ticketed here in California for driving to a friends house. No freedom of movement, and a fine of $400.

We are only seeing the first stages of this. Crops are not getting planted or harvested. Livestock wont have the feed they need. Food prices will go way up, along with unemployment.

More people relying on the government, and more government control


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posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:30 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

A story.

When I was 15, I had a severe asthmatic reaction to some chemicals that were being used by construction workers at my parents house to install a damp proof membrane.

Over the course of approximately 8 hours my capacity to breathe diminished. Slowly and painfully. Those 8 hours felt like years as I struggled to take in the air I needed. The last hour was a decade. The last few minutes of being concious was a lifetime. I was tired, scared and wondered if I would ever see my family, my girlfriend and my friends again. I remember the ambulance ride to the hospital, and how I was screaming to be able to breathe.

And then I blacked out.

My heart stopped briefly, I was resuscitated and fortunately I woke up the next morning.

Now Covid 19 isn't a chemical. Its a virus. But the reaction that people with severe asthma or other underlying health conditions can have to it is exactly the same - the capacity to breathe diminishes over time, then they suffocate.

You - from your attitude here - appear to be wishing that on people.

You may be perfectly healthy. You might get the virus and have mild symptoms. I don't know.

But....you are being asked to stay home, kick back for a bit and help to slow or eradicate the spread of a virus that could kill someone like me.

And you are being a dick about it.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:30 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6


Oh, come on, you damn well know a large majority of those "wars" or "conflicts" so many US soldiers died in are purely political endeavors used to advance military-industrial and corporate interests, and not to "defend our freedom and way of life." Unless by

everything America has fought and died for over the past 2 and a half centuries
you mean that military-industrial-corporate-capitalist society.

But Peking Pestilence did give me a chuckle, so


+23 more 
posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:30 PM
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Nice doom porn post. That's some classic right-wing ATS hysteria.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:31 PM
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Gotta kinda agree with Nef here although you have valid points (Nef may be smiling ) still.... England I think is ahead of the curve here Lets not go to war here as Canada may win this one LOL Bring back the show heh a reply to: burdman30ott6 please and thank yous and stuff.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:34 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

We The People. . . .

Are too busy hiding behind walls of toilet paper and empty boxes of soy to consider rights and liberties right now.

Please stay 6 feet away until GrubHub brings the taco bake someone sneezed on but is culturally appropriate so it would be racist to complain.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:39 PM
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a reply to: visitedbythem

Well, here in MI, I just learned today, that we got you beat. Supposedly 2 people a friend knows, got 500.00 fines for driving around.

And yet, the governor is telling people it is ok to go for walks in the woods, in nature, ect.

How are you supposed to get to these spots?
Walk I guess.

And you damn sure better have your "letter" stating you are essential to be driving to work, if your lucky enough to still have a job.
I carry mine in my purse.
BS



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:40 PM
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a reply to: neformore

This is problematic. How in the blue hell does championing the concepts of fundamental human rights and questioning the restrictions on those in absence of actual declaration of what is legally required to restrict those liberties (an official declaration of martial law) "wishing [sickness/suffering/death] on people?" How? Dude, that's bullsnip.

Would I be "happy" if they just went ahead and declared martial law to enact these infringements? No, I wouldn't... Would I accept it? I'd sure as hell view it a bit more pragmatically if they took that step because it would, at the very least, indicate that protocol and the law was being considered and followed by those in power. As it stands presently, that's not happening and the only thing that seems to permit it is the bizarre fact that the majority are scared snipless over something that still hasn't produced the number of deaths in 3 months that heart disease, cancer, and accidents cause in a single day.

Tell me this, what's the rationale for not following legal protocols here? What good can come from the fact that the world's governments now have identified just how low the threshold of fear needs to be to fully restrict their citizens' rights and do so with the blessing of the majority? Where TF is the point of resistance? The economy is in tatters, rights are absolutely being trod upon, and the majority seems too caught up in calling for more to even take a moment to pause and say "Why are we doing this in this manner?"



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:41 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

Surely Donald Trump wouldn’t let any of that happen.

You can trust him.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:46 PM
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originally posted by: neformore
But....you are being asked to stay home, kick back for a bit and help to slow or eradicate the spread of a virus that could kill someone like me.

And you are being a dick about it.


...and you're reading comprehension is found lacking. This goes way the hell beyond stay at home orders. People are watching businesses they invested their entire lives in crumble to dust, not due to market factors or a lack of customers, but entirely due to governments arbitrarily deciding what's "essential" and what is not and forcing closures of any unblessed endeavors.

It's goddamned funny... you, a guy who I've had a lot of back and forths with over the years. A dude who has always been insanely quick to call, for example, the barring of burkas in public "racist and religiously discriminatory." You've called a presidential order which had precedence and legal code authorizing the president to bar immigration from ANY specific country or within ANY specific qualifier "racist and Unconstitutional." Yet here we sit witnessing actual Unconstitutional infringements on wide swaths of people, including the government BARRING gatherings of religious congregations and I'm the "dick?" Yeah, well... to paraphrase Churchill, we've established what you are, now we're just haggling over the price, Nef.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:48 PM
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I'm not following the advice of a government that I don't trust. I'm following the advice of thousands of medical professionals person experience. It's doubtful they all are payed government shills...



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:48 PM
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originally posted by: chiefsmom
And you damn sure better have your "letter" stating you are essential to be driving to work, if your lucky enough to still have a job.
I carry mine in my purse.
BS


"Show your papers" always a favorite of fascists from Hitler to Mussolini to US governors in 2020...

This is a debacle and people are hostile against anyone who dares question it.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:50 PM
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When the Asshats are in charge , everything is up in the air I guess. I do admit that progress is being made. If that word was a violation please remove thank you a reply to: chiefsmom




posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:51 PM
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originally posted by: JAY1980
I'm not following the advice of a government that I don't trust. I'm following the advice of thousands of medical professionals person experience. It's doubtful they all are payed government shills...


"Following advice" is wonderful.
Once it has fines and threats of imprisonment backing it, it's no longer "advice," however. Then it's become legislation... and allegedly legislation in the USA is supposed to be tested against the Constitution and cannot, sans a Congressional amendment or official declaration of martial law, infringe on the Right guaranteed by the Constitution.

The Constitution exists not to define America's Rights, but to directly prevent the governments in the US from doing what they're presently doing.



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:52 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6

I'm kind of confused by these "Whatever in place" orders we keep getting. Nobody really seems to be enforcing anything other then telling people that they need to be 6ft from each other. At this point I'm pretty sure more local governments think that if they push Americans into a martial law type of situation it will go ugly fast. My cop friend was telling me that they received an order to just nicely ask people to go home, and if they refuse, then remind them to stay 6ft away from each other and drive away.

I asked them what they thought about going to a martial law system, and my friend told me that most of the force would just stay home, or push back like everyone else would. In some places it might work, but I think the only reason why we see people being compliant with these requests to keep people indoors is that they see the value in it, but some places (like Lakewood Wa) they are beginning to put in very socialist type of rules, but admit that there is no way to enforce them. People are beginning to speak out against this over reach.

So it seems like common sense orders are getting people to be compliant, but when anti-Constitutional laws get pushed out, people are going to put their foot down. Hell a Corona Virus blamed gun grab attempt in Bellingham Wa, got pushed off the public agenda because of public out rage of the Constitutional ignorance of the city council (I wonder if anyone here is from Bellingham Wa, could give an update on this)



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:56 PM
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a reply to: burdman30ott6



" Let's be blunt here.."


LOL . Like you Never are Dudeman ? .Oh , I Agree Completely with you here BTW ......................)



posted on Mar, 27 2020 @ 05:57 PM
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a reply to: Guyfriday

It seems to be very sporadic so far, location-wise. I know from news reports that California, Illinois, and New York are issuing fines and threatening jail time for people who are leaving their home for "unapproved" reasons or staying outside their home too long. I know from anecdotes that other states and cities are doing the same.

Alaska, so far, has zero enforcement of it. That said, people seem to be focusing on the stay home side of this when I'm really talking about a lot more than that. Stay at home *might* be the least Unconstitutional action we're seeing, frankly. The government ordering churches shuttered, forbidding religious gatherings and congregating (when those are key elements of many religions), and choosing which businesses are "essential" and which ones are forced closed is actually far, far more Unconstitutional.



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