Law Suit - Covid-19 Escaped from Lab

Here a more educated information about its possible origins on pys.org:
The COVID-19 coronavirus epidemic has a natural origin, scientists say

I take Occam's razor and stick to this news.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
If it was an accidental leak obviously they are not seeing a concentrated dose in a specific area, which would change the projected reactions.

Also Italy called they would like to have a word...

What is an 'incidental leak' when it comes to a virus? Either it spreads exponentially or it doesn't.

a reply to: looofo

Aw brill:

"By comparing the available genome sequence data for known coronavirus strains, we can firmly determine that SARS-CoV-2 originated through natural processes," said Kristian Andersen, Ph.D., an associate professor of immunology and microbiology at Scripps Research and corresponding author on the paper.

An official scientist in an official document says it is FIRMLY evolved through natural processes.

That's it then. the science is settled, as they say.

(I will put the suggestive language used in the article down to chance and nothing more nefarious).

The sequence data is going to be available to all scientists. Everybody is free to proove it has been genetically modified in a lab.

charles lieber and his 'harvard' cronies are to blame.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Outside of China it has come to each country in dribs and drabs, if you wanted to use it as a weapon you would want to "seed" as many areas in a city or country as possible as close to the same time frame to get a spike in cases quickly.

instead we got dribs and drabs in different areas getting an uneven rise in cases, allowing some places to actually get ready rather than a surprise butt sexxors moment.

ETA: you do realize I am not saying it was done in a lab, I am merely spit balling thoughts off the original OP article.

originally posted by: Irishhaf
Outside of China it has come to each country in dribs and drabs, if you wanted to use it as a weapon you would want to "seed" as many areas in a city or country as possible as close to the same time frame to get a spike in cases quickly.

instead we got dribs and drabs in different areas getting an uneven rise in cases, allowing some places to actually get ready rather than a surprise butt sexxors moment.

See above, it wasn't a weapon. Setting that aside, your post is an example of how viruses don't propagate in the real world.

A lawsuit may not be a foundation for validating an origin theory, but if or when this goes to court, the facts should be brought to light during the proceedings (maybe).

Also, I think that this argument that COVID-19 was not an engineered bio-weapon because of the relatively low reported death and transmission rate is a faulty assumption. It may be in the stages of development as a weapon, but not quite completed. Otherwise it is is assumed by the experts that it was engineered, so the ultimate purpose of this virus is irrelevant, it's about the damage caused by it's release and who is responsible for that.

a reply to: MichiganSwampBuck

I agree, arguments about if it is a weapon or not should not be based on its 'strength'. Because none of us understand the development process of a weapon.

The only thing that makes me think it’s not manufactured and released on purpose is it isn’t that deadly. Sure, we can say it has like a 3% mortality rate, but that is based on hospitalization numbers and doesn’t account for most likely millions of people that have had the Coronavirus and never went to the doctor. What percentage of people go to the doctor for the flu is probably about the same for the coronavirus.

a reply to: looofo

Ok lets analyze that article shall we...

The scientists analyzed the genetic template for spike proteins, armatures on the outside of the virus that it uses to grab and penetrate the outer walls of human and animal cells. More specifically, they focused on two important features of the spike protein: the receptor-binding domain (RBD), a kind of grappling hook that grips onto host cells, and the cleavage site, a molecular can opener that allows the virus to crack open and enter host cells.

The scientists found that the RBD portion of the SARS-CoV-2 spike proteins had evolved to effectively target a molecular feature on the outside of human cells called ACE2, a receptor involved in regulating blood pressure. The SARS-CoV-2 spike protein was so effective at binding the human cells, in fact, that the scientists concluded it was the result of natural selection and not the product of genetic engineering.

So the fact it's highly tuned for binding to human cells is proof it evolved huh? Seems to me the opposite is more logical, it could only be that tailor made for humans if it was spliced with other human viruses which have already evolved highly effective mechanisms for binding to human cells. They also say that this evolution occurred in the first person it infected or an intermediate host was involved, but we'll get back to that point in a moment.

This evidence for natural evolution was supported by data on SARS-CoV-2's backbone—its overall molecular structure. If someone were seeking to engineer a new coronavirus as a pathogen, they would have constructed it from the backbone of a virus known to cause illness. But the scientists found that the SARS-CoV-2 backbone differed substantially from those of already known coronaviruses and mostly resembled related viruses found in bats and pangolins.

Ah bats, yes, the very same creature that a researcher was studying at this Wuhan lab, and specifically working with different bat Coronaviruses. It differs from any known Coronavirus in the wild probably because it's been altered and spliced with other crap. This "science" and the conclusions are extremely weak, these are actually assumptions rather than hard science (aka propaganda).

The researchers proposed bats as the most likely reservoir for SARS-CoV-2 as it is very similar to a bat coronavirus. There are no documented cases of direct bat-human transmission, however, suggesting that an intermediate host was likely involved between bats and humans.

In this case, the current epidemic would probably have emerged rapidly as soon as humans were infected, as the virus would have already evolved the features that make it pathogenic and able to spread between people.

In the other proposed scenario, a non-pathogenic version of the virus jumped from an animal host into humans and then evolved to its current pathogenic state within the human population.

Then the other distinct spike protein characteristic of SARS-CoV-2, the cleavage site, could have evolved within a human host, possibly via limited undetected circulation in the human population prior to the beginning of the epidemic.

This is a lot of assumptions... no documented cases of direct bat-human transmission so they assume an intermediate host was involved. Then they say the other protein they studied probably evolved in humans but conveniently went undetected while it was evolving, until miraculously one person is infected with the new and improved human tailored Coronavirus that starts a pandemic.

Then we have other biologists saying there is evidence that "pShuttle" technology was used to splice a SARS protein into Cornavirus but apparently that hard science is outweighed by far fetched assumptions... now lets briefly analyze another article I found from Vox which tries to claim Covid-19 has natural origins.

The virus originated in bats and then jumped to humans, perhaps through other animals

Soon after the Chinese government acknowledged there was an outbreak of a mysterious new virus in late December in Wuhan, scientists raced to sequence its genome. By mid-January, they had it and shared it with the World Health Organization.

Soon after that, scientists saw that the virus closely resembled viruses that circulate in bats. “If you look at the genetic sequence of the virus, it’s closely related to a bat virus, about 96 percent the same,” Jim LeDuc, head of the Galveston National Laboratory, a level 4 biosafety lab in Texas, told Vox. “There’s been talk about a pangolin intermediate host; that’s probably not true.”

Humans also have a 96% genetic similarity with Chimps, again this argument is nothing but an assumption. Just because it resembles a bat Coronavirus doesn't prove anything, and once again there was at least one researcher at the Wuhan lab working with bats and Coronavirus, so if anything this just gives weight to that theory.

Chinese officials also reported that several of the first cluster of cases had ties to a live animal market where both seafood and other wildlife were sold as food. (The market has since been closed.) The market soon became the leading hypothesis for how the virus made the leap into humans, where it’s been able to spread efficiently ever since.

The genetic evidence and epidemiological information, according to three esteemed infectious disease researchers writing in the New England Journal of Medicine, “implicates a bat-origin virus infecting unidentified animal species sold in China’s live-animal markets.”

Now they are pushing the debunked wet market theory, bats aren't sold at those markets and the first people infected never set foot there. And why can't they identify the intermediate host, surely the first people infected would remember any animals they recently came into contact with or if they ate anything unusual. Again these are nothing but weak assumptions.

“The widespread hypothesis that the first person was infected at an animal market in November is still plausible,” Stadler said in a statement. “Our data effectively rule out the scenario that the virus circulated in humans for a long time before that.”

So it didn't circulate in humans for a long time, but that would oppose the other theory that it did circulate in humans undetected for a time in order to evolve.

In other words, nature came up with these weird characteristics in the genome, either in an intermediary animal between bats and people or in humans after the virus infected one. As Racaniello put it on his podcast: “Humans could never have dreamed this up.”

Riiiiight so the theory here is "Humans could never have dreamed this up". Lmao... this is not an argument, it's pure nonsense and not true at all, our current biotech is capable of crazy things and humans are very crafty. This is worse than an assumption, it's just a personal opinion, scientists damn well could create this even if it was by accident.

A lawsuit would be good to clear the air, not that I trust verdicts given by a dozen amateurs. It couldn't be any worse than all the biochemical experts on ATS weighing in on the finer points of this virus.

a reply to: and14263

This means war.
Not since WW2 have countries/economies/societies
buckled down like this.
More so than September 11th.
This is unprecedented.

The guilty parties do not want to Face
their responsibility.
The Godless will call it an "Act of God".
S&F

originally posted by: and14263
At first I was irritated by the speed at which a law suit has been filed against China. Typical litigation behaviour upon which America is built, not so easily accepted by other regions; this suing culture is growing of course, to the detriment of society.

But then I read a little further into the paperwork:

"Furthermore, there are only two known Chinese government bio-weapon research labs in the PRC and one of them — the National Biosafety Laboratory at the Wuhan Institute of Virology — is, at its name suggests, in Wuhan, and is close in proximity to the marketplace where COVID-19 allegedly originated. It is considered China’s only “level 4” microbiology lab – meaning it deals with the deadliest of viruses. An alternative theory here is that COVID-19 escaped from the Wuhan lab because of lax controls, or that Chinese researchers sold lab animals to the marketplace in question, as researchers have been known to do in China, instead of cremating them as PRC law requires. In either case, such conduct, as an alternative theory, has caused the pandemic."

This law suit is openly discussing the conspiracy we have known about for months.

I was very disappointed that it didn't include either of the two incidents that should be front and center in this kind of lawsuit...

On Jan 28th, Dr. Charles Lieber, chair of Harvard University’s Department of Chemistry and Chemical Biology, was arrested and charged by criminal complaint with one count of making a materially false, fictitious and fraudulent statement - namely, lying to the Department of Defense about secret monthly payments of $50,000.00 paid by China and receipt of millions more to help set up a chemical/biological “Research” laboratory in China, located at the Wuhan University of Technology.

Also, two 'student' associates of his working as research assistants were also arrested - one of whom arrested on December 10th, 2019 at Boston’s Logan International Airport and charged by criminal complaint with attempting to smuggle 21 vials of biological research to China.

I don't believe in coincidences like this.

And don't forget Xiangguo Qiu, a Canadian government scientist, is being investigated at the National Microbiology Lab in Winnipeg, who made at least five trips to China in 2017-18, including one to train scientists and technicians at China's newly certified Level 4 lab, which does research with the most deadly pathogens, according to travel documents obtained by CBC News.

a reply to: ChaoticOrder

Your line of reasoning is exactly the same as mine was when I read the articles on the natural mutation origin theories. In fact, many of your posts on this subject are like you are reading my mind.

I also have given consideration to the incidents tanstaafl has stated above and we all know how China steals all the tech it can get away with. I think both your posts are the theories I have believed most out of everything I've been hearing about the pandemic.

a reply to: and14263

It "escaped" alright. If, and that's a big "if", it originated from that lab, then you can't convince me it was accidental. China does a lot of crazy stuff to meet their agenda. What would they have to gain from unleashing it on their own people? I don't know. They kill their own people on a regular basis.

Perhaps they thought it'd give them a leg up in the trade war if they could bring America's economy to its knees and all those countries who we've been making deals with to undermine Chinese influence.

Perhaps they sought a different method for population control even though it didn't kill all that many Chinese people when you consider their population. God knows they LOVE population control. Perhaps they wanted to test a bio weapon in a real setting. Maybe they wanted a reason to flex their authoritarian muscles and remind everybody who is in charge. Or maybe they did it for kicks and giggles.

I don't necessarily think it came from the lab. I'm simply saying that if it did I doubt it was an accident.

a reply to: tanstaafl

China and that bio lab is sloppy. SARS got out, right after those sobs we're trying to get their hands on it. Whaddaya know, it swipes through the globe.

But this isn't the first time a pathogen got out. I remember when a lab was moving some Ebola and then a Ebola outbreak in Africa. Heck, some parts are still recovering.

And don't forget this tidbit, from Jan. 28:

Charles Lieber, the chair of Harvard University's Department of Chemistry and Chemical Biology, has been arrested and criminally charged with making "false, fictitious and fraudulent statements" to the U.S. Defense Department about his ties to a Chinese government program to recruit foreign scientists and researchers.

The Justice Department says Lieber, 60, lied about his contact with the Chinese program known as the Thousand Talents Plan, which the U.S. has previously flagged as a serious intelligence concern. He also is accused of lying about about a lucrative contract he signed with China's Wuhan University of Technology.

In an affidavit unsealed Tuesday, FBI Special Agent Robert Plumb said Lieber, who led a Harvard research group focusing on nanoscience, had established a research lab at the Wuhan university — apparently unbeknownst to Harvard.

In response to the charges against Lieber, Harvard said in a statement to NPR: "The charges brought by the U.S. government against Professor Lieber are extremely serious. Harvard is cooperating with federal authorities, including the National Institutes of Health, and is initiating its own review of the alleged misconduct. Professor Lieber has been placed on indefinite administrative leave."

from: Harvard Scientist is Arrested

stay safe,
tetra

Read the Wikipedia article on the Wuhan Institute of Virology. You won’t believe some of the research they’ve done there and how familiar it will sound. You’ll see words like “bats,” “coronavirus” and “hybrid” in the same sentence. It’s the first biosafety level 4 (BSL–4) laboratory in China.

en.m.wikipedia.org...

The rqzor is almost always right.

My simple answers:
A)someone failed at a safety protocol
B)someone sold corpses to the "wet" market instead of burning them for extra Juan.

Occam's razor means a) which is the simplest answer is most likely the right one. We can layers of bull#. In the end it is likely just that simple...