Valhall has a legitimate point what about 616??

Used to be my area code for the phone. They changed it not too long ago. Doubt it is related.

Yeah, right...I'll be watching you Advisor.

A lot of interesting reading.

BUT, I have a question. For all the answers that were posted, only one (from Maddas) even referred to the subject matter correctly.
That meaning: 666 is the 'mark' of the beast and not
the number of the beast.
At least it is as I understand it.

Originally posted by Toltec
Valhall has a legitimate point what about 616??

Some of the parchments containg the Revelation uses 616 instead of 666. The Greek letter for 10 is iota. The Greek letter for 60 is xi. This is an old discussion, and has always ended with 666 being the correct answer. I haven't looked into it too much, so if anyone knows anything about this debate, please fill me in.

Blessings,
Mikromarius

The big question at this point Advisor at this point is what you got under the hat

mikromarius can you elaborate on your most recent point?

Originally posted by Toltec
mikromarius can you elaborate on your most recent point?

Well I don't know much more than what I wrote about this. One early MS use 616 instead of 666, but it has somehow been dismissed because of reasons unknown to me.

In geometry: A ten "horned" star uses skips of 6 in a clock of 60 minutes or skips of 36° in a circle. The clock is the very basis in circular geometry. The Star of David is clock geometry. The five pointed star uses skips of 12 minutes or skips of 72°, while the six pointed star uses skips of 10 minutes or 60°. This is very simple geometry. Try to figure out the septagram, the seven pointed star. Then you'd probably got the nobel price in math if it had only existed......

Blessings,
Mikromarius

[Edited on 13-7-2003 by mikromarius]

Originally posted by Starwalker
A lot of interesting reading.

BUT, I have a question. For all the answers that were posted, only one (from Maddas) even referred to the subject matter correctly.
That meaning: 666 is the 'mark' of the beast and not
the number of the beast.
At least it is as I understand it.

666 is the number of the beast and the mark/law of the beast along with it's name can be calculated into 666.

Revelation 13:16 And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead, 17 and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name. 18 Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six.

Blessings,
Mikromarius

Thank you mikromarius it is obvious you have done your best.

It apparent that biblical scholars would not have suggested the number 616 with respect to there most credible recourses, unless there existed some validity with respect to it.

Any other responses???

[Edited on 13-7-2003 by Toltec]

There are reasons to believe that the thing with using 616 instead of 666 in early Bibles is based on a miscalculation together with gnostic dogma. The gnostics found the golden incission or the golden figure (sorry, I don't know the exact word for it in English) in everything they concidered evil. The five edged polygon or the pentagon presents a perfect fi or golden incission within it's geometry. If you draw a line from any of the five corners to another you divide the shape in two with the proportion 61.8% to 38.2%. This may indicate that the reason for the 616 may be a miscalculation of 1+[root of]5, divided by 2, minus 1. Probably due to the fact that they didn't have a very good numerical system for calculating relatively advanced math like this.

For instance if you measure your body from head to toe in the ratio mentioned and put your finger there, you'll see that you're holding your finger in the navel. The opposite way around you'll be holding your finger at, well, good Christians wouldn't say it straight out, but I'll say it anyway: your genitals. You also find this ratio/proportion in the way fractals "move", we all know the Fibbonacci numbers I guess: 1,2,3,5,8,13,21..... and in the way spiral galaxies are shaped, how our genome twirls, well you'll find it anywhere, even in the Great Pyramid. But to say it's evil would be to stretch the rubberband a little far I think, for it would be like saying everything created is evil. But we all know Paul's speeches about how all flesh is evil, so perhaps we are at the core here. Perhaps this is what he was getting at in the first place. I don't know, but it's a facinating subject no matter how you put it.

Blessings,
Mikromarius

999=666 evil b'stards the police are sorry to say.

You are back on the trail that was lost, drunk, but be careful with who is listening.

Huh u are speaking in tongues MA
that what it represents to me anyway

dont mean to offend anyone.

[Edited on 15-7-2003 by drunk]

Maybe whoever listening really wants to hear otherwise, he would not be waisting his time
listening.

While batteling with the people who call themselves Catholics in the thread about anti-Catholicism, I got an urge to go to Daniel, to the part where he is cast into the lions' den to underline the folly of the church. My point was to show what consequences comes from the ways of the church. For after reading about Catholicism in historybooks etc. they donot stand out as just lawless. They may have denounced the Law of God, but they seem to keep another law in high regard: The law that cast Daniel to the lions. In the time of Daniel the Medo-Persians had a law that said "That no decree nor statute which the king establisheth may be changed". Well the thing is that this law is described in Daniel 6:16 (or 6:15 in KJV for some reason) and wait there is more. Alot more....

The Tannakh holds the keys to unlock the last book of the bible, the Book of Revelation. About the 666/616 mystery, it has many referances in the Tannakh. It teaches that having a mark on your forehead and right hand means keeping a law or a tradition in mind and action. Like Passover, the Law of Moses and the priesthood of Aaron. All of them are discribed as having a mark on your forehead and your reight hand. Further the number 666 is mentioned several times in the Tannakh too: twise in connection with taxation and once in connection with cencus, the two things that above all stands out as evil in the Tannakh and the Gospel.

Well, let's get back to Daniel. The part where Daniel is cast to the lions is a story with many aspects. Medo-Persia is most likely the great bear Daniel saw in his vision of "the beasts". They let the Jews home after the captivity in Babylon, and they ordered the Temple to be rebuilt. It took over world power after they had conquered Babylon and ended when the Greeks overthrew them. The story contains all the caracteristics connected to the mark of the beast: There is a beast/world power here -- a king who is elevated into godhood and who's words whether good or bad could never be challenged or undone, the very occurance of the number 616 which in old bibles is written instead of 666, a perticular godless law and a conspiracy against holy people (Daniel alone this time). And look it's even got lions in it.

"The mark of the beast" should be interpreted "the law of the beast", and as far as I can see there is only one foreign law directly refered to like this in the Tannakh: Daniel 6:16 -- "That no decree nor statute which the king establisheth may be changed".

In the end I want to say that I naturally don't hate catholics, but I have come to hate the Catholic Church. And for good (even obvious) reasons too, which I have elaborated on at several occations. Only sad though that catholics seldom see this, while everyone else seems to understand it perfectly. Even those who don't believe at all (often because of such paradoxes I discribe within the Catholic church). Not strange at all, for it is difficult for anyone (even the children of a tramp) to find any faults with their mother. They can't see the paradox between the teachings of Jesus and the worshipping and praying to spirits of dead men and women. And they don't understand how kneeling before statues, works of artists, is folly, even after reading how God, the Father expresses his anger and fury over this throughout the Prophets. Hey, even after reading time and time again how even Arch Gabriel warns those who bend down and face the earth before him. And EVEN after reading about how the highest wish of the adversary Satan is that Jesus might fall down before him and thereby worship him, they still find no reason why their ways should be profane or wrong in any way. To a child, kneeling down before art means to worship the works of man, then why does the church allow it and teach the opposite? Children are the greatest in the kingdom of God. And it doesn't matter what you say to exhaust it. The Israeli probably said the same things when Moses destroyed the golden calf: "We didn't worship the gold infront, we worshipped what it represents, namely the highest among the sons of God". Well you are not allowed to do either. BASTA!

Blessings,
Mikromarius

[Edited on 17-7-2003 by mikromarius]