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Things that won't happen- The Rapture

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posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 03:53 AM
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originally posted by: muzzleflash


There is more than one God.

If you are not referring to the Trinity, you just lost my interest in anything you say.




Purely by definition of the word God it infers there can only be "one who won", so therefore One.


God = Omniscient, Omnipotent, Omnipresent, Infinite and Eternal, the creative force behind all physical manifestation and it would be the underlying energy of the universe. It also likely exhibits consciousness and can manipulate the universe.

By this grand definition there is no logical way there could be more than "one God", because the word God means literally "the one and only one that encompasses all that is".

As a result I don't even see how a "Trinity" makes any sense because all 3 of those things are the same thing anyways, God.

It always reduces to The 1.


Evidently Almighty God Yehovah disagrees with you in some respects.

Yes, one God in essence, values, priorities, agreement--UNITY IN DIVERSITY solving that age-old philosophical conundrum. . . . expressed through 3 personalities & roles.

Doesn't seem wise to me to try & tell Almighty God how He cannot do something or do something in HIS way.

The TRINITY is evident in the Old Testament.

Holy Spirit of God is referred to.
The Son is referred to.

Psalm 2:7 "I will surely tell of the decree of the LORD (Yehovah): He said to Me, 'You are My Son, Today I have begotten You."

Psalm 2:11-12 "Serve the LORD (Yehovah) with fear, And rejoice with trembling. 12 Kiss the Son, lest He be angry, And you perish in the way, When His wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all those who put their trust in Him."

Prov 30:4 "Who has ascended into heaven and descended? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? who has wrapped the waters in His garment? Who has established all the ends of the earth? What is His name or His son's name?"

Isaiah 7:14 "Therefore the Lord [Yehovah] Himself will give you a sign: Behold, a virgin will be with child and bear a son, and she will call His name Immanuel."

Also: Isaiah 9:6-7 "For a child will be born to us, a son will be given to us; And the government will rest on His shoulders; And His name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace, 7 There will be no end of the increase of His government or of peace, On the throne of David and over His Kingdom, To establish it and to uphold it with justice and righteousness From then on and forevermore. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will accomplish this."

Daniel 3:25 "He answered and said, "Look! I see four men loosed and walking about in the midst of the fire without harm, and the appearance of the fourth is like a son of the gods!"

Hosea 11:1 "When Israel was a youth I loved Him, And out of Egypt I called My Son."

etc.

Certainly The Father is referred to.

edit on 122020 by JoseGarcia because: addendum



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 04:24 AM
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originally posted by: DISRAELI
I’ve also noticed how fervent believers in the Rapture are prone to attach a high value to belief in the Rapture, coming close to making it one of the conditions of salvation.
I’ve been told (on this site) that I was in danger of missing out on the Rapture, if I did not believe it was coming.


So you are saying that some Christian said that we Christians are saved by the rapture if we have faith in the rapture and our faith in Christ is invalid
That’s truly disappointing but unsurprising



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 04:42 AM
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a reply to: Raggedyman
It was implied, but hardly conscious and not really thought out properly. It was just a warning that I was in danger of "missing out".



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 06:51 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Christians today place their faith in anything and everything but Jesus, works, bible, rapture, prepping and whatever. Did Jesus die for nothing, it’s no longer the good news but the bad news for christians
Safe in Jesus, well I believe I am



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 07:14 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI According to the Jews the rapture will take place Sept 20 this year the nephimil will land space ship on Mt Hermon and take 144,000 chosen ones,guess in a few months we will see if they are full of crap,or they have knowledge of the future and we are screwed,I go with latter



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 07:24 AM
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a reply to: Oldtimer2
I think you must mean "some of the Jews". The Rapture, being a Christian theory, is not part of mainstream Jewish thinking, even without people being taken away in spaceships.




edit on 1-2-2020 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 09:26 AM
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a reply to: schuyler

Really? Where you gonna get electricity to charge it?

Solar? Good luck with that.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 09:26 AM
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a reply to: schuyler

Really? Where you gonna get electricity to charge it?

Solar? Good luck with that.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

We can't come with him in the clouds unless we are gathered to him first

There are three different gatherings that will take place during the Tribulation. You have just made them all one gathering thereby making the words of God of none effect, thereby destroying the faith and trust in God's word.

We are to judge people with spiritual judgement and in so doing I can conclude one of two thoughts, 1) you will have no be rewards at the Judgement seat of Christ, which takes place at the gathering. Or 2) you are unsaved.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 01:04 PM
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a reply to: muzzleflash

What is called the trinity is referred to in the Bible as the godhead and is clearly taught in 1 John 5:7 (one of those verse Disraeli believes is in error).

1John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
The Word is Jesus Christ.

John 1:1-2, 14 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. . . . And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
There are no opinions in the Holy Bible but you can find most of that in Commentaries and in Disraeli's posts.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 01:16 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn
I'm focussing on the interpretation of 1 Thessalonians ch4, which is evidently about the return of Christ. The concept of "Rapture" was inspired by that passage (the name, based on the Latin for "caught up" gives that away), so it does come down to the question of how that passage should be understood.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 01:28 PM
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originally posted by: ChesterJohn
What is called the trinity is referred to in the Bible as the godhead and is clearly taught in 1 John 5:7 (one of those verse Disraeli believes is in error).

You have never seen me say so. You are making things up now?


The Word is Jesus Christ.John 1:1-2, 14 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. . . . And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
There are no opinions in the Holy Bible but you can find most of that in Commentaries and in Disraeli's posts.

I've done a thread on that passage; The Word became flesh
I think I can defy you to find any rational objection to it. (Unfortunately, you are starting to go beyond the point of being rational)



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 04:58 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI


One of them, for example, is the “one is taken, the other left”, of Matthew ch24 vv40-41.
In fact this act of selection should be referred back to the ”gathering of the elect”, which was mentioned a few verses previously (v31).
It is another way of describing the final judgement, which appears in the next chapter as the separation of “the sheep and the goats”.
This event is “the coming of the Son of Man”, which is about the full and open Return of Christ and the Final Judgement even more clearly than is the case in Thessalonians.



Why the Sheep/Goat Judgment and Great White Throne Judgment Are not the Same Event


mikevlach.blogspot.com...



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 05:07 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined
So far I've taken a very brief look at the link, and my first thought is that many of the differences which he finds could be put down to the use of different metaphors to describe the same event.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 05:14 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

The Sheep/Goat Judgement takes place before the Millennial reign here on earth. The Great White Throne judgement takes place after the 1,000 years are over.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 05:37 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined
In my Revelation threads, I came to a different understanding of what the 1000 years means (essentially, I agree with Augustine), so I don't need that distinction.



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 07:56 PM
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a reply to: ChesterJohn



We are to judge people with spiritual judgement and in so doing I can conclude one of two thoughts, 1) you will have no be rewards at the Judgement seat of Christ, which takes place at the gathering. Or 2) you are unsaved.


But how does one know they speak from the pneumatikos.

"If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters--yes, even their own life-such a person cannot be my disciple".

Do you hate your mother, ChesterJohn?



posted on Feb, 1 2020 @ 08:43 PM
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originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Deetermined
In my Revelation threads, I came to a different understanding of what the 1000 years means (essentially, I agree with Augustine), so I don't need that distinction.



In order to come to your "understanding", you would have to ignore the related texts in Isaiah 65, Ezekiel 36, and Zechariah 13 which all talk about the physical aspects of the Millennial kingdom.



posted on Feb, 2 2020 @ 12:56 AM
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a reply to: Deetermined
The issue of how Christians, under the guidance of the Spirit, should be interpreting Old Testament statements was the theme of my Peace Restored series last summer.


edit on 2-2-2020 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on Feb, 3 2020 @ 09:50 AM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

So, now you're going to ignore New Testament scriptures on what Jesus had to say about that?

Luke 24:44

44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.




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