Could the belief in god considered a mental illness ?

originally posted by: KindraLaBelle
Great thread

Last year I took my mil to a psychiatrist because she started to act weird. After many tests he diagnosed her with chronic psychosis. Nothing can be done about it and medication doesn't work or has to many side effects. So we just have to let her be for now and hope it never gets worse.

When I discussed this with the psychiatrist he told me to look at it this way:
One of her things is to have conversations with people on the tv, she is convinced they are talking to her directly. The Dr said that in a way this isn't very different then a deeply religious person who talks to God and is convinced that God talks back to him. The 'believing it to be true without a doubt' is the same process in both examples.
Also, in both examples, the believing makes the person happy and hopeful and it fulfills a need in their lives and therefor is looked at as a positive thing in his/her life.

Dr said that it doesn't really matter what anyone else thinks of it. As long as they are happy and not harming anyone else, it won't be treated as a mental illness, but in the textbook both cases are considered psychosis. Be it mass psychosis in the second.

I had several experiences myself that could count as textbook psychosis, although I consider myself in perfect mental health! Maybe it's just part of human nature...

Until your psychosis convinces you there is a war on and it is you vs your neighbors. Revelations is a scary piece of literature.

a reply to: TzarChasm

I think the ones that believe there is a war going on are merely following their 'leaders' with maybe a more severe ... psychosis?
When one is ready to take up a weapon in the name of whatever religion, that might be the time to pick up the meds imo

a reply to: KindraLaBelle
Most terrorist are operating for political ends,
The forthright must pickup weapons if there is a violation of justice.
To fight for what one believes is true and just, may be the only sane thing to do.
Mental illness can come from bitterness and resentment brought about by injustice.
If it is let loose as revenge supposedly in the name of God, it can be truly terrifying.

If a belief in God leads one, away from anger, bitterness and revenge, and toward justice.
then God is good.
not a figment of a diseased mind.

To know God is a huge ask.
To question whether he exists is futile.
Read the stories and lessons, benefit from the lessons learned by the suffering man kind brings upon it's self through pride.

a reply to: gosseyn

NOT to believe in God is an illness - of willful ignorance.

Put it this way.

Regardless if you 'believe' in the Bible or not? All the 'prophecies' of Christ have come true with not many more left to go.

So - you can choose:

A: The Bible proves the existence of Christ by mathematical probability based on those prophecies.

OR

'It's all just made up'....

And if you choose, the mathematical (near) impossibility those prophecies are a 'coincidence'?

You've got a mental problem.

And it's called 'willful ignorance'.

originally posted by: silo13
a reply to: gosseyn

NOT to believe in God is an illness - of willful ignorance.

Put it this way.

Regardless if you 'believe' in the Bible or not? All the 'prophecies' of Christ have come true with not many more left to go.

So - you can choose:

A: The Bible proves the existence of Christ by mathematical probability based on those prophecies.

OR

'It's all just made up'....

And if you choose, the mathematical (near) impossibility those prophecies are a 'coincidence'?

You've got a mental problem.

And it's called 'willful ignorance'.

But... literally none of this is true.

a reply to: TzarChasm

Yeah, sure
But who is “we”
It needs a little clarification
While I might agree with your opinion of keeping religion out of politics, who gets to decide what is religion. I believe many atheists have a religious bent as we both know

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: TzarChasm

Yeah, sure
But who is “we”
It needs a little clarification
While I might agree with your opinion of keeping religion out of politics, who gets to decide what is religion. I believe many atheists have a religious bent as we both know

What I said before. Any questions related to who god is or what it wants does not belong in court or in congress. Keep it in the bar or the bedroom with other matters of personal relevance, far away from legislature.

a reply to: TzarChasm

So whatever you and yours decides, even your religious beliefs but only yours

You know what hypocrisy is don’t you TC
If atheists were genuinely good people, but they are not
I find you no better in most circumstances than an extremist fundamentalist christian, a wesborough equivalent but atheistic
Compromise I guess

a reply to: TzarChasm

Our laws are based on those set out in ancient scripture.

Granted, they are a little more complex, but the general idea is to behave morally or face the consequences, both physically and spiritually.

a reply to: Grenade

Morales are subjective, no one knows morales as comprehensively as an atheists.
They are uniquely tapped into self and others, truely altruistic in everything they do.
Just ask Mao and Stalin, no need for any faith at all.

Nothing complex about atheistic morales and standards, we are all just cattle

TC is speaking tongue in cheek, he will let you know it’s a joke soon

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: TzarChasm

So whatever you and yours decides, even your religious beliefs but only yours

You know what hypocrisy is don’t you TC
If atheists were genuinely good people, but they are not
I find you no better in most circumstances than an extremist fundamentalist christian, a wesborough equivalent but atheistic
Compromise I guess

So you judge him for being a hypocrite and deciding what it is good or bad , but then you say atheists aren't good people ?

Do you know every atheist on earth? and who made you the arbiter of whether atheists are good or bad people?

I know plenty of atheists and religious type people and they all make mistakes and do stupid # , are they generally good people with morals , Yes , but they are human and are prone to doing what humans do , and that is make mistakes and learn from them.

An atheist can be as good or as compassionate as any religious person because of the fact we are all humans
nothing to do with your "beliefs"

people dont kill other people or do bad stuff because they have beliefs or dont have beliefts its because they are #s
there must be a gene for that surely

a reply to: Raggedyman

Are these dictators etc not showing classic examples of sociopathic or psychopathic behaviours though ?
absolute power corrupts absolutely so any human would likely succumb to doing dastardly deeds if left unchecked

I wouldnt say they killed millions directly as a result of their non belief in deities or the afterlife though

has there ever been any studies done on atheism and psychopathic behaviour
or atheism and genocide or atheism and mass murder ?

Most serial killers are all psychopaths , most terrorists that commit genocide have extremely disturbed minds
and it is the fact that they have abnormal brain functions is the reason they do what they do

a reply to: sapien82

Nobody is good Sapien, nobody, according to christian morales. According to atheist morales everyone is good, it’s subjective.

I know many atheists who I respect and consider better than many christians

TC, particularly fundamentalist atheist who hates religion, hates. Doesn’t want any religious people having any power or representation at all, in any government. You don’t have to read between the lines to see that, well I didn’t think so
If you read TCs post it’s clear religious people shouldn’t be allowed to vote or be represented at all

I am as equally dismayed by fundie Christians as fundie atheists.

So yes, a hypocrite and if you read my words, I used compromise because I have to
You won’t see TC use or offer compromise

But I suspect you already know this and are just trolling, people are not that dumb in general

a reply to: sapien82

Sorry Sapien, there is an underlying disagreement between me and TC you have missed completely, I don’t intend to explain it
Suffice to say, religion and non religion have caused many deaths.

a reply to: Raggedyman

I think we have the potential to be both good and bad, but neither belief or non belief have any real affect on that

I get ya mate , I just missed that I am not so much trolling just having a bit of banter with you !

I agree with you we shouldnt have politics affected by religion
but history is a shining example of how we seem to have the two always combined

its like in the frank herberts Dune , religion is embedded so deeply that even when we give religious freedoms , its still underpins everything we do.

America is land of the free, they can worship who they please, yet the nation has "in god we trust" and "one nation under god "

doesnt seem very free from religion , it seems to represent religious people more , or favour them more.


The good thing about you mate is that you admit when you are wrong
we are all hypocrites at some point eh

a reply to: Atsbhct

Ya know what is true?

All of it.

And - there are no atheists in hell.

originally posted by: silo13
...And - there are no atheists in hell...

Whom might argue against that ?

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: TzarChasm

So whatever you and yours decides, even your religious beliefs but only yours

You know what hypocrisy is don’t you TC
If atheists were genuinely good people, but they are not
I find you no better in most circumstances than an extremist fundamentalist christian, a wesborough equivalent but atheistic
Compromise I guess

What's so wrong with what I said? I didn't say silence the Christians or abolish the church. I said theism as a general principle is not relevant to government.

originally posted by: TzarChasm

What's so wrong with what I said? I didn't say silence the Christians or abolish the church. I said theism as a general principle is not relevant to government.

It is most relevant to social conduct. If everyone on earth were to actually live according to Christian ideals, a global utopia would ensue. We shouldn't beg government to mandate us how to behave, it begins with people behaving according to truth.

a reply to: TzarChasm

TC, you vote or not, your decision who you vote for or not
A religious person has that same right, their decision who they choose
You imply they shouldn’t have that free will and shouldn’t have a choice because religion has no right in politics
You are denying religious people the right to vote for who they want

Me, personally, against abortion, a terrible thing but
I think, as terrible as it is, a woman has a right to choose, she can kill her own baby, free will, her choice

But you can’t see that a religious person has a right to choose, you demand that right to vote or choose whoever be removed
That’s hypocrisy, that’s pure fundamentalism/dictatorship policy. You are as bad or if not as bad, far worse. You deny others the right to vote based on your extreme hate of faith

As for me, I agree with you, different reasons but I don’t think Christianity and politics should mix

Jesus dealt with all people on an individual and personal level not a political foundation