No Wonder We Are In Such INSANE Debt- Americans MUST Put a Stop to This, page 3

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 06:48 PM

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I dunno guys. We could sit here for days and argue about the big budget items like defense spending. But to me it is the other things, which are totally ridiculous, which will really require a very pointed effort to elect fiscally conservative members to Congress in the next years. People like Rand Paul who have a grip on this and are trying to actively do something about it. As of now the government is a monster completely out of control, with no end in sight.

They should be the ones providing the example of sound economic policy and spending, and any extra after eliminating all this should be given back in tax cuts to give the American people a break. SERIOUS tax cuts. What ever happened to the National Tax, and the elimination of the IRS? Talk about saving some money!

Charliebrowndog

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 07:20 PM

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a reply to: TrueAmerican

Defense in my opinion is one of the fundamental items the government should pay for with our tax money. Unfortunately there are still tons of projects s and “favors” that our taxes go towards which have no business being used for.

The other thing that really concerns me is when was the last budget passed? Essentially they have been running things with a blank check which is a total disgrace.

Charliebrowndog

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 07:21 PM

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a reply to: TrueAmerican

Exactly the tax situation is a huge waste. Major reform and elimination of the IRS would be a major step in the right direction

Arnie123

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 07:35 PM

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originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: zatara

Except they usually don't. Those stories all started with the $600 hammer, which it turns out, was all on paper. The actual cost of the hammer was no more than you'd pay in any hardware store.

Kinda like Independence Day movie where the General was asking, "Where do you get funding for this???" And Julius remarked, "What? you don't really think they spend 20,000 dollars on a Hammer? 30,000 on a toilet seat, do you?" 😂

carewemust

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 07:43 PM

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Aren't tax revenues down due to tax cuts? Also, 44% of Americans pay NO Federal Taxes.

Source: www.marketwatch.com...

Maybe America is PRINTING extra money to spend. Better to print, than to borrow from China, isn't it?

Zaphod58

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 07:48 PM

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a reply to: Arnie123

They don't. The most famous one is the hammer I mentioned. They bought a bunch of parts in bulk, and when they broke down the engineering costs they divided them amongst all the parts equally, instead of by individual part. That increased the cost of the hammer, on paper, to $432.

The military bought the hammer, Kelman explained, bundled into one bulk purchase of many different spare parts. But when the contractors allocated their engineering expenses among the individual spare parts on the list-a bookkeeping exercise that had no effect on the price the Pentagon paid overall-they simply treated every item the same. So the hammer, originally $15, picked up the same amount of research and development overhead-$420-as each of the highly technical components, recalled retired procurement official LeRoy Haugh. (Later news stories inflated the $435 figure to $600.)

www.govexec.com...

lordcomac

posted on Dec, 21 2019 @ 11:13 PM

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How much have we paid congress in the last three years?
Have they done anything for us?

500+ people at over 150k a year each, and lately all they've done is waste time. They take more vacations than anyone I know- and are paid better, too. When they do work, they vote on stupid crap. Have they passed a single bill this year that's good for we the people?

Same line of questioning for:
-fbi
-cia
-atf

Pretty much any government funded agency, actually.
Maybe I should run for president 2024. My pitch? Cut government spending in half. Every year.
Disband the FBI, as they're obviously corrupt to the core. Disband the CIA. Track down ex-presidents from the last 30 years and hold a public lynching for their crimes against the people.
Then, of course, bring back green backs and hold the members of the federal reserve accountable for their crimes against humanity.

xpert11

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 12:37 AM

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a reply to: TrueAmerican

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

I respect Rand Paul for highlighting gross wastage in U.S. Government spending. Local councils in New Zealand embrace the culture of tax and spend to pay for projects not relating to their core functions. (The core functions of local government are a rubbish collection, infrastructure, Civil Defence and libraries). So, I don't need to even tackle wasteful spending by the New Zealand Government to have a good grasp on the issue.

On the issue of defence spending: Vested or conflict of interests are at work. Towards the end of his book, Topgun: An American Story, Dan Pedersen, touches upon this subject matter.

Does tax reform reduce wastage in government spending?
Don't confuse tax reform with reductions in the rates of current taxes. Tax reform consolidates tax systems by replacing a number of taxes with a single tax. Naturally the method of taxation changes from direct or sales to Value Added/Goods and Services Tax. In the U.S. context, Tax reform is supporting the removal of existing tax loopholes is applicable to this discussion.

Note: In New Zealand, local government is primarily funded via direct taxation known as Rates. This will make sense to the reader in a moment.

In theory, diverting (NZ)GST revenue to local and regional councils is the way to end the culture of tax and spending wastage. However, there is no guarantee GST revenue would be returned to councils on the basis of revenues generated. This issue has occurred in Australia. The Australian Federal Government doesn't distribute GST on the basis of revenue earned. (GST revenue raised in Western Australia is or was used to subsidies for Victoria and New South Wales).

[I don't agree with Rand Paul's foreign policy views. Nor do my views on the F-35 fall within the realm of this topic. But I stand by my above remarks].

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

TomLawless

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 06:41 AM

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originally posted by: carewemust
Aren't tax revenues down due to tax cuts? Also, 44% of Americans pay NO Federal Taxes.

Source: www.marketwatch.com...

Maybe America is PRINTING extra money to spend. Better to print, than to borrow from China, isn't it?

Tax revenue actually goes up when taxes are cut. Sounds counter intuitive, but it's been that way throughout history. The tax base increases because more people get hired.

Bloodworth

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 07:06 AM

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originally posted by: drewlander

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: TrueAmerican
That's like the time they wanted to find out which ketchup was better. Also the time that they made a new branch of the military called the space force.

Space force likely already existed just not as its own branch.

And we are way behind China...the Chinese announced a space force years ago .

Creep Thumper

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 10:42 AM

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a reply to: TrueAmerican

Proxmire used to have his Golden Fleece awards. Same principle.

The feds have been raping and pillaging our economy for decades, basically since WWII.

openminded2011

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 11:19 AM

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originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: TrueAmerican
That's like the time they wanted to find out which ketchup was better. Also the time that they made a new branch of the military called the space force.

Whoever dominates the high ground of space will dominate the world. I would rather that not be China or Russia.

ambassado12

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 11:23 AM

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a reply to: TrueAmerican

It's ok, it's in the Central Banks best interest that the US does not collapse. But if it ever gets to that then we would just end up nationalizing the Federal Reserve the debt would be wipe clean. Remember America is exceptional because it's the dollar that runs the entire global system, so debt doesn't matter because in the end the world depends on us. They have no choice.

Creep Thumper

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 11:40 AM

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originally posted by: openminded2011

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: TrueAmerican
That's like the time they wanted to find out which ketchup was better. Also the time that they made a new branch of the military called the space force.

Whoever dominates the high ground of space will dominate the world. I would rather that not be China or Russia.

Obama murdered our manned space program. We need to retake supremacy.

openminded2011

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 12:00 PM

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originally posted by: Creep Thumper

originally posted by: openminded2011

originally posted by: Skid Mark
a reply to: TrueAmerican
That's like the time they wanted to find out which ketchup was better. Also the time that they made a new branch of the military called the space force.

Whoever dominates the high ground of space will dominate the world. I would rather that not be China or Russia.

Obama murdered our manned space program. We need to retake supremacy.

To be fair it was Obama and Bush II, the shuttle program was already almost dead when Obama entered office, Bush needed the money to fund the wars of course.

edit on 22-12-2019 by openminded2011 because: (no reason given)

dogstar23

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 12:26 PM

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originally posted by: crayzeed
a reply to: TrueAmerican
CHICKEN FEED!!!!!
You've got two go to frighteners that people on here use:-
Russia
China
With a new one just added.
Aliens.
Millions of $s nothing. Last year the defence budget was $648 BILLION. That's billion not million. Oh, and they lost about $21 billion that they cannot account for.
Can ANYONE on here come up with a sincere convincing answer as to why America needs anywhere near this amount of defence.
Russia?? Russia can just about look after itself never mind about "NATO" countries or even the far off America.
China?? China has no intentions of attacking any US land and as I've said before < with the US deep in the cesspit, If China wanted America it would just buy it.
Now the biggie go to. ALIENS. "We must defends ourselves against alien invasion". There is not even an ounce of evidence that any alien race is going to try to take America.
But the nice bit about that is, on the one hand to frighten you of alien invasion, and on the other hand, Wait for it, according to the government aliens don't exist.
Now anybody want to answer just what is American DEFENCE for. And don't come out with the BS of fighting terrorists all over the world.

Is anyone indicating the DoD is preparing to defemd against "aliens?" I haven't seen that yet, at all, from anyone in the government or military.

Also, I bolded the bit about China buying the US if they wanted to. It seems a lot of people believe China has more wealth than the US, simply because our debt number is higher. The NET wealth of the US is estimated at around $107 TRILLION. China is around $64T (spread across 4x as many people.) Click for Rabbit Hole, care of Credit Suisse

crayzeed

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 01:42 PM

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a reply to: Zaphod58
I'm not saying stop spending I'm saying stop spending so much on, I'll use the word OFFENCE, cos it aint for defence. Yes i am saying spend your money on your country and your people and let the world go it's own way.

Zaphod58

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 01:45 PM

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a reply to: crayzeed

Yes, let's go back to being isolationist. We saw how well that worked out. Screw our friends and let them rely on themselves. I'm sure they'll all step up and start spending more to defend themselves.

crayzeed

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 01:58 PM

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a reply to: Zaphod58
I'm not saying be isolationist, I'm saying stop going overboard with trying to be the biggest dick in the playground.

Zaphod58

posted on Dec, 22 2019 @ 02:11 PM

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a reply to: crayzeed

And who else is going to help out nations that can't? China has laid claim to territory that isn't theirs to claim and has pushed and bullied everyone around them. So we just let that happen and give them whatever they want. That's what you want to see?

I have no problem with less spending, done right. Gutting the budget like you want to see, isn't doing it right. Neither is ignoring alliances and letting potential friendly nations get pushed around by their neighbors.