BRAVO to the British population for electing the strongest Conservative majority since Thatcher !

originally posted by: PublicOpinion

originally posted by: Freeborn
Just want to add that I don't think Labour will be electable until they free themselves from the control Momentum has over the party and realises that the London Labour, champagne socialist, politically correct, minority promoting clique are not representative of their core traditional support.

This is the pit of old farts, and they'll agree with you.

You guys are history already, there's a new generation coming and they wont be that easy to fool with remnants of a Cold War mentality. This is more about your old fears from the Iron Curtain than it is about reality and actual politics.

We'll need new solutions for this dying species of naked apes, and we wont find it in your old textbooks from a Brave New Oiligarchy. This Boris might be the last Thatcher we'll see, who knows?

If you want to argue that post-modern socialism based upon identity politics will replace the centrist values of classical liberalism as those new solutions, then it is you that will be history. The current ideological struggle between the pseudo-left that does not believe in truth and classical liberalism that does has NOTHING to do with the old politics of Iron Curtains and capitalism vs. the new politics. You just don't understand what is really going on. Instead, you resort to fake ad hominems that merely betray your lack of perception that globalism and the destruction of sovereignty and democracy are the goals of the NEW Left.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: PublicOpinion
You are forgetting one very pertinent point. Every day, little by little, you yourself are getting older. It is a well-known factor in politics that people drift from left to right, from "progress" to "conservatism" as they get older. Now you are Edmund Burke praising the American Revolution. In a number of years, you will be Edmund Burke attacking the French Revolution. When your children are as old as you are now, you will be the old fart hailing the heir of the old Johnson traditions.

It's the old cliche -
If you're not a liberal at 20 you've got no heart.
If you're not a conservative at 30 you've got no brain.

a reply to: PaddyInf
I think originally Clemenceau (who would have said "socialist").
Churchill used the liberal-conservative version.

originally posted by: PaddyInf

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: PublicOpinion
You are forgetting one very pertinent point. Every day, little by little, you yourself are getting older. It is a well-known factor in politics that people drift from left to right, from "progress" to "conservatism" as they get older. Now you are Edmund Burke praising the American Revolution. In a number of years, you will be Edmund Burke attacking the French Revolution. When your children are as old as you are now, you will be the old fart hailing the heir of the old Johnson traditions.

It's the old cliche -
If you're not a liberal at 20 you've got no heart.
If you're not a conservative at 30 you've got no brain.

And that cliche is going to die with them, if it aint a walking dead already. Which part of those conservative values would be the one appealing to the brain, if I may ask?

a reply to: micpsi

If you want to argue that post-modern socialism based upon identity politics will replace the centrist values of classical liberalism as those new solutions, then it is you that will be history.

Preach to all those young people who voted this way. It's in the data, ya know?

a reply to: eletheia

Judging by the Scots on ATS you wouldn't think so! They have North Sea Oil....

Any idea how much of that money actually goes back into the economy or how much ends up in untaxed offshore bank accounts.

a reply to: purplemer

EUAN McCOLM: As a Scot, I wouldn't blame the English if they told us to get lost

Much has been made of the Scottish oil fields and the wealth that would flow into an independent Scotland. During the 2014 referendum campaign, for example, the Nationalists promised that North Sea oil would underpin a booming economy.
But the price of oil, which peaked at almost $150 a barrel in 2008-09, has fallen steadily over the years. By the time Scots came to vote on membership of the UK, it was trading at about $50 a barrel – a figure that blew a multi-billion-pound hole in the SNP’s prospectus for an independent Scotland. It is still only at $65 a barrel today

Under the Barnett Formula – the mechanism by which public spending is divided across the UK – Scotland receives a full 20 per cent more per head of population than England, a substantial sum, however the SNP tries to spin it.
And if English voters are exasperated, many of us north of the border are deeply worried.
Breaking up the Union would not only put an end to this large subsidy, it would leave Scotland in serious financial trouble. Indeed, economists have warned that an independent Scotland would face years of cuts in public service, or tax rises, or a combination of both..

And the Scots are concerned about conservatives austerity !!!

Despite the generosity of the Barnett Formula, Scotland’s spending deficit was seven times higher as a percentage of GDP than the UK average during the last financial year. And that was after a heavy round of cuts to public services.
An independent Scotland would lose the security of sterling and would no longer have the protection of Bank of England to underwrite its debts. So it’s hardly surprising that Ms Sturgeon claims an independent Scotland would be welcomed back into the EU with open arms, joining as a fully fledged member.

Breaking up the Union would not only put an end to this large subsidy, it would leave Scotland in serious financial trouble. Indeed, economists have warned that an independent Scotland would face years of cuts in public service, or tax rises, or a combination of both.
She diverts attention from the fact that the financial circumstances in which an independent Scotland would find itself might make it ineligible to join.

www.dailymail.co.uk...


I would say she would be better to sort out the economy than an independent

Scotland

a reply to: PublicOpinion

The values of equality of opportunity, not outcome.
The values of fair taxation, allowing a man to enjoy the fruits of his OWN labour.
The idea that the welfare state is a safety net for when we need help, not a safety blanket for when we don't.
The idea that enterprise, hard work aspiration, innovation and success are rewarded, not punished.
The idea that I can pass on my belongings to my family after I die rather than having the state seizing them.
The value of individual rather than state responsibility for how I run my finances.
A state where government provides public services, but doesn't insist on running them.

Those types of values.

originally posted by: PaddyInfIt's the old cliche -
If you're not a liberal at 20 you've got no heart.
If you're not a conservative at 30 you've got no brain.

and if you're neither by age 40 you've figured out it's all garbage anyway.

a reply to: PublicOpinion

Ha ha.

I admire the passion of youth.

Please bear in mind your talking to someone from the punk generation.
I didn't want to 'smash the system', I wanted to blow it to #ing bits.

And I still have that passion and drive and my core values are still the same.

But they are tempered by the reality of life and the realisation that for all our idealism unfortunately there's always one thing that spoils it; human beings.
There will always be people who will use every single given situation as an opportunity to manipulate and exploit for their own benefit be it power or money, or both.

So unless there is some sort of significant step change in the collective human psyche I see very little changing.

You may think that's cynical, unfortunately its just reality!

Smash it up still rings true to me.....unfortunately I KNOW I'm very much in the minority.

originally posted by: PublicOpinion

a reply to: micpsi

If you want to argue that post-modern socialism based upon identity politics will replace the centrist values of classical liberalism as those new solutions, then it is you that will be history.

Preach to all those young people who voted this way. It's in the data, ya know?

No, it is not in the data. Postmodernism does not recognise the existence of data, as there are no scientific facts, according to this outlook. The so-called "facts" presented by postmodernism are but ideas masquerading as facts taught by closet Marxists in their textbooks. Postmodernism has been discredited by leading philosophers, only its students don't know it because they are not told the truth about it! Instead, they are programmed into a way of thinking that denies truth, asserts the relativity of all values and the meaningless of life.
Preaching to young people is a waste of time. Instead, universities should return to their main purpose of teaching people how to reason and think impartially, instead of wanting to be businesses that attract the largest numbers of customers because they teach courses that intentionally dumb down intellectual standards by denying that academic excellence and rigour are worthy qualities to acquire.

a reply to: M5xaz

it will be the last of great britain

Scotland is leaving and with it the union shall collapse
gone will be Britain

about time the end of conservative rule over Scotland
and its death grip on the UK

a reply to: sapien82
The separation of Scotland would pretty well guarantee Conservative rule in England. The collapse of the Labour vote in Scotland has already been one of the factors in their recent defeats.

a reply to: DISRAELI


once Scotland is out the Union things wont be as cosy for he conservatives in England

originally posted by: sapien82

once Scotland is out the Union things wont be as cosy for he conservatives in England

EUAN McCOLM: As a Scot, I wouldn't blame the English if they told us to get lost

Much has been made of the Scottish oil fields and the wealth that would flow into an independent Scotland. During the 2014 referendum campaign, for example, the Nationalists promised that North Sea oil would underpin a booming economy.
But the price of oil, which peaked at almost $150 a barrel in 2008-09, has fallen steadily over the years. By the time Scots came to vote on membership of the UK, it was trading at about $50 a barrel – a figure that blew a multi-billion-pound hole in the SNP’s prospectus for an independent Scotland. It is still only at $65 a barrel today

Under the Barnett Formula – the mechanism by which public spending is divided across the UK – Scotland receives a full 20 per cent more per head of population than England, a substantial sum, however the SNP tries to spin it.

More on sixth post on this page..........

Not ALL Scotland agrees with you and Nocola

a reply to: M5xaz
The conservatives do care about the environment.... And have voted to become Corbyn neutral!

a reply to: eletheia

Who said anything about OIL

a reply to: Freeborn

So unless there is some sort of significant step change in the collective human psyche I see very little changing.

You may think that's cynical, unfortunately its just reality!

Nope, it rings true with me. With the only difference that I tend to see a rather small minority of ignorant naked apes, who'll have to be dragged into the future kicking and screaming.
Heck. Even I can find some common ground with the usual conservatives in my neck of the woods, which is probably why I feel that most people stepped up already.
This outlook seems to hinge on personal experiences, you're probably just older than me and had more negative experiences. At some point in the future I might sound exactly like you, slightly pessimist.

However. I like the way Rosco coined this:

and if you're neither by age 40 you've figured out it's all garbage anyway.

Behold the garbage bin of lobbyism and revolving doors!

a reply to: eletheia

Aye I think yer talking #e considering SNP got the highest votes in any general election in the past 50 years of the vote share , we got 45%

SNP secured 45% of the scottish vote in that general election which is higher than any other vote share in the rest of the UK

we won 48 out of the total of 59 or something , Scotlands voice has clearly spoken and its SNP unity

so your comments about scotland not sharing my opinion is rubbish

we had a voter turn out of 68%

the stats dont lie

2019 election results

a reply to: micpsi

Instead, they are programmed into a way of thinking that denies truth, asserts the relativity of all values and the meaningless of life.

Look at you relativizing actual votes, which would fit said "denial of truth".

All the young people voting Labour is anything but meaningless. They wont find adequate representation due to the suboptimal system in place, but that's not their fault. It's pretty much the same with all those people under 30 years voting for Sanders.

originally posted by: sapien82
a reply to: eletheia
Aye I think yer talking #e considering SNP got the highest votes in any general election in the past 50 years of the vote share , we got 45%
SNP secured 45% of the scottish vote in that general election which is higher than any other vote share in the rest of the UK
we won 48 out of the total of 59 or something , Scotlands voice has clearly spoken and its SNP unity
so your comments about scotland not sharing my opinion is rubbish
we had a voter turn out of 68%
the stats dont lie

Hey!!! don't shoot the messenger those words and stats came from a

genuine Scotsman.......EUAN McCOLM: