Actress And Friend Get Brutally Assaulted Leaving NY Bar Where's The MSM Coverage?

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: neutronflux

You are pretty passionate about this aren't you?

I'm not defending mob rule and I'm also not defending anybody needing a beating but I'm not really prepared to jump on your little bandwagon of hate crime...

This story has a lot of holes and you nor I have the full info to draw conclusions.

If you want to speculate about who is right that's fine...have fun.

Peace

Passionate about what? In a city that supposedly cares about the rule of law and violence, a mob carried out what some would call a violation of civil rights especially if two black women were beat down by a white mob using hate speech?

I think it’s more an exercise how extreme discernment by law and the law is willfully taking on the state of minds in one case. Then going “mewh” in case of Jennifer Agostini. And people willingness in this thread to seemingly justify a mob beatdown?

Or, maybe some fear a growing trend of mob rule.

Again, any evidence to contradict Jennifer Agostini‘s account?

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: neutronflux

I have made no claims about beatings or the lack thereof.

We do not have all the facts.

You do seem to be justifying the beat down thought. Quote where you condemn the violent outcome and the management’s lack of concern regarding the mob action.

No, not a single thing I've said could possibly be construed that way in any rational fashion.

We do not have all the facts.

a reply to: neutronflux

okay...you want to discuss hear-say let"s discuss hear-say.

Let"s start with this mob. Who made the assessment it was in fact a mob?

We know what Jennifers says about this "approximately 10 - 15 people beat petitioners to the ground"

From the estimate (10 to 15) I would say that situational awareness wasn"t all that great but we"ll run with it.

Now we know that the "leader" of this mob was a black male, bald head, white goatee, wandering eye approximately six feet two inches tall wearing a black turtle neck and black pants and worked at the club as a bouncer.

The dictionary is pretty clear on this term:

a person employed by a nightclub or similar establishment to prevent troublemakers and other unwanted people entering or to eject them from the premises

Now this bouncer and his mob weren't "attacking" miss Agostini and her friend. according to her own report:

As petitioners started walking out petitioners GARCIA and STUART were attacked...petitioners AGOSTINI and SELLETTI in attempt to defend their friends were also beaten and attacked..

She was already walking out while her husband and his friend were still inside getting into a fight with earlier mentioned bouncer. I assume if Jennifer and her friend were already walking out and the fight started inside they clearly went back in to defend their friends..

We can keep this going all day but I think those camera images will reveal more accurate what happened.

Peace

a reply to: operation mindcrime

Can you cite a source? I should have been more specific. Can you cite and link to evidence that the actress’s account is false. Or do you only have innuendo?

So your sanctioning the beatdown? Can you cite where a bouncer is allowed to assault a person just asking for their credit card back?

What are Bouncers Legally Allowed to Do?

Bouncers, or nightclub security, do not have the same rights as the police or actual security personnel. They do not have the right to physically remove a person from the premises of the club, but this is a very common misconception. Bouncers do not have the legal right to engage in violence or force as they see fit. In general, bouncers are regular employees, not actual security personnel. Actual security personnel require special training and permits.

Bouncers are only allowed to use force if it is first used against them. Therefore, according to law, a bouncer may only ask you to leave the premises. They do not have the right to physically remove a customer. These same rights to self defense are granted to ordinary citizens, as is the right to call the police on someone.

www.legalmatch.com...

Do you have any evidence the actress first initiated any physical or violent act?

And by no means did you address

Passionate about what? In a city that supposedly cares about the rule of law and violence, a mob carried out what some would call a violation of civil rights especially if two black women were beat down by a white mob using hate speech?

I think it’s more an exercise how extreme discernment by law and the law is willfully taking on the state of minds in one case. Then going “mewh” in case of Jennifer Agostini. And people willingness in this thread to seemingly justify a mob beatdown?

Or, maybe some fear a growing trend of mob rule.

originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: neutronflux

I have made no claims about beatings or the lack thereof.

We do not have all the facts.

You do seem to be justifying the beat down thought. Quote where you condemn the violent outcome and the management’s lack of concern regarding the mob action.

No, not a single thing I've said could possibly be construed that way in any rational fashion.

We do not have all the facts.

Can you cite any law that justifies the actress being beatdown?

a reply to: neutronflux

Let's keep it simple...

This:

Actress And Friend Get Brutally Assaulted Leaving NY Bar Where's The MSM Coverage?

Directely contradicts this:

As petitioners started walking out petitioners GARCIA and STUART were attacked...petitioners AGOSTINI and SELLETTI in attempt to defend their friends were also beaten and attacked.

I'm no lawyer but if you jump in a fight to defend a friend you can hardly claim you were assaulted, right?

Peace

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: neutronflux

Let's keep it simple...

This:

Actress And Friend Get Brutally Assaulted Leaving NY Bar Where's The MSM Coverage?

Directely contradicts this:

As petitioners started walking out petitioners GARCIA and STUART were attacked...petitioners AGOSTINI and SELLETTI in attempt to defend their friends were also beaten and attacked.

I'm no lawyer but if you jump in a fight to defend a friend you can hardly claim you were assaulted, right?

Peace

What is the cited source and context?

a reply to: neutronflux

The cited sources are the OP's sensationalist title and attached article.

And ofcourse Jennifer Agostini's petition

Official petition



Peace

a reply to: operation mindcrime

What context are you setting up?

Your source? The Jennifer Agostini Petition.

www.scribd.com...



And this proceeds what you cited?



That shows a bouncer representing the management of the bar acted inappropriately. Do you have evidence otherwise? Then the inappropriate behavior by the representative of the bar lead to physical harm to “ The Jennifer Agostini Petition“.

Am I missing something?

originally posted by: neutronflux

That shows a bouncer representing the management of the bar acted inappropriately. Do you have evidence otherwise?

No and neither do you. This shows Agostini's account of what happened. As you pointed out earlier:

Bouncers are only allowed to use force if it is first used against them

According to Agostini the bouncer started pushing the friend looking for her creditcard. Maybe the bouncer was not allowing that person re-entry for the reason of an item that was forgotten.

Maybe mr.Stuart wanted to be the knight in shining armour and started a scene.

Maybe maybe maybe...

What is a little harder to discount is miss Agostini's own words saying:

petitioners AGOSTINI and SELLETTI in attempt to defend their friends were also beaten and attacked.

And so we are back to square one where we have to rely on video images to tell us what really happened. But we could go for an other round of he-said / she-said if you want...

Peace

a reply to: operation mindcrime

Its not a crime to jump in to help your friends if they were not the ones who started the altercation.

a reply to: yuppa

Indeed it isn't..some would even label it as an honorable thing to do. But if you choose to engage you are not being assaulted...

Peace

a reply to: operation mindcrime

You

According to Agostini the bouncer started pushing the friend looking for her creditcard. Maybe the bouncer was not allowing that person re-entry for the reason of an item that was forgotten.

Maybe mr.Stuart wanted to be the knight in shining armour and started a scene.

Ok? So it’s wrong to shield a women being wrongfully pushed around by a bouncer that had no right to react in a physical manner? Again. If the bouncer representing the bar acted inappropriately, then the bar is ultimately responsible. And if bar management did no seek to stop the beatdown by calling law enforcement, then that looks really bad.

a reply to: neutronflux

Yeah it's not going to help the bar's reputation but that wasn't the discussion here. It was about a brutal assault on two white women by a mob of angry black thugs...

Again...without video images you can not conclude a damn thing much less condemn.

Peace

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: yuppa

Indeed it isn't..some would even label it as an honorable thing to do. But if you choose to engage you are not being assaulted...

Peace

Tell that to Police officers who jump in and get hit defending their co workers. You absolutely can claim assault.

a reply to: yuppa

That's a whole different thing wouldn't you say?

I'd be more than happy to start a discussion with you on comparing apples with oranges but I'm still very busy with this other discussion where we are trying to proof things without evidence.

Peace

There is no excuse for what happened even if said the n word. Everyone has acted an assshole one time or other

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: neutronflux

Yeah it's not going to help the bar's reputation but that wasn't the discussion here. It was about a brutal assault on two white women by a mob of angry black thugs...

Again...without video images you can not conclude a damn thing much less condemn.

Peace

Would the situation be reported differently if two black women were beatdown in a bar in Atlanta Georgia? With attackers using ethnic slurs? I think it would. But I guess a Jennifer Agostini beatdown is daily business in New York? Ironic from a city who’s Attorney General’s official website reads.....

NYS Attorney General
Menu
Home
Our Office

ag.ny.gov...

As head of the Department of Law, the Attorney General is both the “People's Lawyer” and the State's chief legal officer. As the “People's Lawyer,” the Attorney General serves as the guardian of the legal rights of the citizens of New York, its organizations and its natural resources. In fulfilling the duties of the State’s chief legal counsel, the Attorney General not only advises the Executive branch of State government, but also defends actions and proceedings on behalf of the State.

The Attorney General serves all New Yorkers in numerous matters affecting their daily lives.The Attorney General's Office is charged with the statutory and common law powers to protect consumers and investors, charitable donors, the public health and environment, civil rights, and the rights of wage-earners and businesses across the State.

They're back open I heard.

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: neutronflux

Yeah it's not going to help the bar's reputation but that wasn't the discussion here. It was about a brutal assault on two white women by a mob of angry black thugs...

Again...without video images you can not conclude a damn thing much less condemn.

Peace

Would the situation be reported differently if two black women were beatdown in a bar in Atlanta Georgia? With attackers using ethnic slurs? I think it would. But I guess a Jennifer Agostini beatdown is daily business in New York? Ironic from a city who’s Attorney General’s official website reads.....

NYS Attorney General
Menu
Home
Our Office

ag.ny.gov...

As head of the Department of Law, the Attorney General is both the “People's Lawyer” and the State's chief legal officer. As the “People's Lawyer,” the Attorney General serves as the guardian of the legal rights of the citizens of New York, its organizations and its natural resources. In fulfilling the duties of the State’s chief legal counsel, the Attorney General not only advises the Executive branch of State government, but also defends actions and proceedings on behalf of the State.

The Attorney General serves all New Yorkers in numerous matters affecting their daily lives.The Attorney General's Office is charged with the statutory and common law powers to protect consumers and investors, charitable donors, the public health and environment, civil rights, and the rights of wage-earners and businesses across the State.

LOL

Would the situation be dealt with differently if the race of everyone involved was reversed?

It would be on every news program and paper in America with 24/7 nonstop coverage.