Has any other president withheld aid to another country before?

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: network dude

I think "personal benefit" is the key feature we should be looking at...

Peace

Semantics.

A president benefits from a successful foreign policy.

Mmmm... no. Not the same as securing an election win by disparaging opponents through foreign policy. Nice try.

a reply to: ravenshadow13

I wasn't aware that Biden won the nomination.

Imagine that!

I also wasn't aware that just accusations could harm someone's chances. I mean, at least Trump didn't hire someone to fake a dossier to attack Biden, that would be terrible!

Oh mercy!

Has any other president withheld aid to another country before?

Yep.

Every OTHER day and President it's called sanction and no fly zones, and invading a country like Pakistan to 'kill' Bin Laden.

originally posted by: ignorant_ape
a reply to: chr0naut

how did // does giving the aid [ to the ukraine ] advantage all the citizens of the US????

The USSR is an enemy of the US.

The Ukraine was actively at war with the USSR.

The aid was military aid, to an ally, against a common enemy.

originally posted by: butcherguy
a reply to: Auth3nt1k

counter-artillery and counter-mortar radars, secure communications, training aids, logistics infrastructure and IT systems, tactical UAVs, and medical e

DB said ‘no weapons’.
Your list includes no weapons.
But you knew that, right?

You are embarrassing yourself. We gave Ukraine AN/TPQ-37's. This is a weapon of war. There is no other use to the AN/TPQ-37 than to target where a motor or artillery came from so you can strike back.

Use some of that fat inside your head for something other than parroting what others tell you.

a reply to: lakenheath24

Obama held military aid for Ukraine indefinitely...and Biden told the Ukrainians he would not give them the over $1 billion aid unless they fired the prosecutor whom had Hunter Biden in his sight, and the link of the Bidens with the corrupt Burisma Holdings... In fact, when RUSSIA invaded part of Ukraine and they were sending their soldiers incognito as if they were civilians meanwhile they caused chaos in Ukraine. Ukrainian authorities asked for military aid to the Obama/Biden administration, and instead Obama/Biden only sent MREs and blankets...

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: lakenheath24

Obama held military aid for Ukraine indefinitely...and Biden told the Ukrainians he would not give them the over $1 billion aid unless they fired the prosecutor whom had Hunter Biden in his sight, and the link of the Bidens with the corrupt Burisma Holdings... In fact, when RUSSIA invaded part of Ukraine and they were sending their soldiers incognito as if they were civilians meanwhile they caused chaos in Ukraine. Ukrainian authorities asked for military aid to the Obama/Biden administration, and instead Obama/Biden only sent MREs and blankets...

You are showing your ignorance of this war. At the time the Obama admin gave aid 70% or more of the Ukrainian casualties came from Russia missiles/artillery. They had artillery but no way of identifying where the russian attacks came from. We gave them that capability which greatly diminished Russians artillery.

Now the javilines...how many have been used in combat? How many lives have they directly saved?

The javilines were a symbolic gesture. By holding them up trump sent a clear message to Russia.

originally posted by: operation mindcrime
a reply to: network dude

I think "personal benefit" is the key feature we should be looking at...

Peace

Like when Biden gave Ukraine six hours to fire the prosecutor investigating Burisma? The prosecutor who said he wanted to talk to Hunter, ask him what he did to earn at least $3 million in 18 months?

originally posted by: Auth3nt1k

originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: lakenheath24

Obama held military aid for Ukraine indefinitely...and Biden told the Ukrainians he would not give them the over $1 billion aid unless they fired the prosecutor whom had Hunter Biden in his sight, and the link of the Bidens with the corrupt Burisma Holdings... In fact, when RUSSIA invaded part of Ukraine and they were sending their soldiers incognito as if they were civilians meanwhile they caused chaos in Ukraine. Ukrainian authorities asked for military aid to the Obama/Biden administration, and instead Obama/Biden only sent MREs and blankets...

You are showing your ignorance of this war. At the time the Obama admin gave aid 70% or more of the Ukrainian casualties came from Russia missiles/artillery. They had artillery but no way of identifying where the russian attacks came from. We gave them that capability which greatly diminished Russians artillery.

Now the javilines...how many have been used in combat? How many lives have they directly saved?

The javilines were a symbolic gesture. By holding egickethem up trump sent a clear message to Russia.

Then why were the Ukrainians begging Obama for lethal aid? Do you think they wouldn’t mind if we withheld the Javelins from them? The Russians and everyone else familiar with military tech knows Javelins are incredibly deadly fire-and-forget missiles. They can be carried and fired by one man, from within a room or vehicle, or sitting on a motorcycle. As soon as the operator fires it, he can make his getaway. They’ve been proven hundreds of times in combat; incredibly accurate and can blow the turret off a main battle tank.

a reply to: Scapegrace

I understand what the javelin at weapon is. I also understand that we have given them 37 of them with 210 total missiles.

To my knowledge they have fired 0 of the missiles. If you have knowledge otherwise please correct me. As far as my understanding the trump admin required the javilines not be used in "conflict zones. These are 100% symbolic.

They did however use the AN/TPQ-37 to stop the barrage Russia was sending their way.

a reply to: Auth3nt1k

The javilines were a symbolic gesture. By holding them up trump sent a clear message to Russia.

According to Morrison's testimony, the javelins weren't included in the aid that was being held up.

a reply to: elDooberino

Right, they were not apart of the aid.

In the summary of the phone call

President Z. says he wants to do another round of purchases.

trump says "I'd like you to do us a favor though"

trump wouldn't let the Ukrainians use the missiles against Russia and then made purchase of more contingent upon "investigations"

a reply to: Auth3nt1k

Trump wouldn't let them use the ones we already sold them?
There hasn't been a tank battle in Ukraine since 2015. They haven't even had an opportunity to use them.
If I'm not mistaken, the only stipulation was where they store them. Yes, it is far from the front line but they can be transported pretty quickly if really needed. I don't necessarily think it's a horrible idea to put a little distance between weapons we're providing and the neighboring country with nukes. At least that way, if they're used, it's more likely to be a situation they were really needed; not just used to escalate the conflict.

I'm still not really seeing how taking a few months to sell Ukraine some missiles, that we've already sold them before and they haven't had to use, is sending a "clear message" to Russia. What is that message?

Frankly, I can kind of see where Russia's coming from on this one. The Obama administration overthrows their neighboring ally and then everybody starts pushing to make them a NATO member, effectively cutting off access to Russia's only warm water port. That would be a huge blow to them in numerous ways. If the roles were reversed, I have a hard time thinking we'd be ok with that and do nothing to prevent it from happening.

I can name one very recent administration. The Obama administration via joe biden withheld aid to the Ukraine. a reply to: network dude