The President Opened the Can

a reply to: Gryphon66
I really have no problem with it. Although I was in no way a special operations member kicking down doors and ducking bullets nightly, I have deployed with them and supported them. They are every bit the professional force we think they are. You have to remember, what this guy was prosecuted for was very trivial in comparison to what they do everyday. A photo with a dead body? To these guys a dead body becomes an everyday occurrence and it’s easy to understand how one can become immune to this after awhile. He was acquitted on more serious charges and I believe that resulted in a ridiculous sentence on the photo charge. Yes....if I were Trump I would have pardoned him. It was vindictive for his leadership to go after him like they did after being acquitted on more serious charges.

I will also admit I am biased in how I see this. I have supported special ops while deployed. 2016-2017 in Iraq was a complete blood bath when Gallagher was there. I was NOT there at that time. What those guys faced everyday, day in day out, would mess with anybody’s head. Those guys never stopped in those 2 years. They lived praying they would see the sunlight next day. I am telling you, it was no joke for them. Gallagher May have done a selfie with a dead body but what he saw daily was much much worse. Civilians understand the danger they face....but I don’t think they understand the monotony of killing terrorists daily and the stress of facing punishment if they make an error in the fog of war.

a reply to: Gryphon66
I really have no problem with it. Although I was in no way a special operations member kicking down doors and ducking bullets nightly, I have deployed with them and supported them. They are every bit the professional force we think they are. You have to remember, what this guy was prosecuted for was very trivial in comparison to what they do everyday. A photo with a dead body? To these guys a dead body becomes an everyday occurrence and it’s easy to understand how one can become immune to this after awhile. He was acquitted on more serious charges and I believe that resulted in a ridiculous sentence on the photo charge. Yes....if I were Trump I would have pardoned him. It was vindictive for his leadership to go after him like they did after being acquitted on more serious charges.

I will also admit I am biased in how I see this. I have supported special ops while deployed. 2016-2017 in Iraq was a complete blood bath when Gallagher was there. What those guys faced everyday, day in day out, would mess with anybody’s head. Those guys never stopped in those 2 years. I am not sure how long he was there but They lived praying they would see the sunlight next day. I am telling you, it was no joke for them. Gallagher May have done a selfie with a dead body but what he saw daily was much much worse. Civilians understand the danger they face....but I don’t think they understand the monotony of killing terrorists daily and the stress of facing punishment if they make an error in the fog of war.

a reply to: Assessor

The reason the charges seemed more relevant is that Gallagher has a history of being accused of actions on the edge of being war crimes. These were just the latest iterations.

I want to be clear that I am not opposed to any service member being pardoned appropriately, I just think the what and the where and the why for Trump’s actions are extremely out of line, even though, to possibly prevent the Chorus from striking up, I know he’s the COC.

I’d also like to thank you for your service. That’s not something said lightly despite the opinion of the peanut gallery. Thanks for taking time to respond so fully.

a reply to: Assessor

Because you seem logical - - I will say this: "The Rules of War" - - is such an odd statement.

Politicians make rules.

a reply to: Gryphon66

There wasn't any substance to respond to, just complaints that I called the rank and file the rank and file and ignoring anything I said. That's why I said your response was petty.

originally posted by: Dfairlite
a reply to: Gryphon66

There wasn't any substance to respond to, just complaints that I called the rank and file the rank and file and ignoring anything I said. That's why I said your response was petty.

Okay.

Rank and file to me would be the standard enlisted soldier/sailor etc.

SEALs are elite specialists, perhaps you’re technically correct on rank.

If you a point though, aside from ad hom, sing out.

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: Assessor

Because you seem logical - - I will say this: "The Rules of War" - - is such an odd statement.

Politicians make rules.

Assessor said "Fog of war"...

It's important that this phrase is understood correctly.

a reply to: Deplorable

If the rank and file military personnel are okay with it, then the POTUS did the right thing. The top brass can go hang since they're only looking out for themselves anyway. And while they may not have been as corrupted as other federal agencies have become like the State Department, Justice department, FBI and CIA, they have been slowly being turned.

originally posted by: Wide-Eyes

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: Assessor

Because you seem logical - - I will say this: "The Rules of War" - - is such an odd statement.

Politicians make rules.

Assessor said "Fog of war"...

It's important that this phrase is understood correctly.

I wasn't quoting anyone. "Rules of War" is my own words. I know enough to verify other peoples quotes if I use them.

See Law of War: en.wikipedia.org...

But, Fog of War is also interesting: en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Assessor

You describe the situation well, and it is miles away from what most of us have ever been through, or can easily imagine.

So if it's 'acceptable' for 'your side' to engage in these reported behaviors, would you also think it was 'acceptable', if it was an opposing army, doing the same things to American soldiers ?

originally posted by: Nothin
a reply to: Assessor

You describe the situation well, and it is miles away from what most of us have ever been through, or can easily imagine.

So if it's 'acceptable' for 'your side' to engage in these reported behaviors, would you also think it was 'acceptable', if it was an opposing army, doing the same things to American soldiers ?

Actually....that is a very good question. I remember the anger I experienced in Iraq when those two US contractors were dragged behind cars and then hung from a bridge burned. Gallagher never did anything like that but that is the closest thing I can think of off the top of my head that was a blatant disrespect to our dead. Like many I was fuming. So no....I don’t accept things like that. If you recall the incident in Kandarhar, Afghanistan when Army Staff Sergeant Robert Bales went on a rampage and killed 16 innocent Afghans in their sleep, I certainly believe he should never be pardoned and execution was not out of the question in my opinion.

I guess I find each case situational and in Gallagher’s case he should have never received the punishment he got. That is my opinion. I will admit this....in Gallagher’s case the accusations were awful. If true I wouldn’t be defending him. However, there was no evidence to support it. The Navy relied on hearsay. I am one to give these guys benefit of the doubt. It just seems to me that his guilt was a result of undue command influence....not actual evidence.

a reply to: Assessor

Thanks for your honest answer.
Am glad you took the challenge of looking at the situation from another angle.

For the rest: can't imagine going though it. Too scary and traumatizing.

Peace for you, and all.

a reply to: Bigbrooklyn

Remember the elder years when our government was asking only for a few good men? That's where they all went.