Was the Ukraine corrupt?

I think this is a fair question, regarding the current situation. Trump is accused of witholding aid. it's said that is somehow a bribe, or extortion. In the phone call, Trump is concerned with previous corruption. Where would he get the idea that corruption was even a thing there?

Perhaps he did a google search and came up with this:

Corruption is widespread in Ukrainian society.[1][2] Transparency International's 2018 Corruption Perception Index ranks the country in 120th place out of 180 countries.[3]

In 2012 Ernst & Young put Ukraine among the three most-corrupt nations of the world - alongside Colombia and Brazil.[4] In 2015 The Guardian called Ukraine "the most corrupt nation in Europe".[5] According to a poll conducted by Ernst & Young in 2017, experts considered Ukraine to be the ninth-most corrupt nation in the world.[6]

And this is the one country that Biden's boy decided to work for. it's the one country that seems to come up on so many conversations lately. With such a corrupt past, some say the third most corrupt in the world, should there be any checks and balances when giving aid?

Disclosure, I think that Trump screwed up by asking about this directly. He should have asked Barr to dig into this. But I fully believe that if this current kerfuffle didn't happen, this would still be going on, just on a different premise. The left has no choice, they have done nothing, and if they want anything come election time, they had better do something. Impeachment is that something. BAMN.

So in conclusion, Ukraine was corrupt, and Trump is being impeached because he asked that it be looked at. If something illegal is found to have occurred with Hunter Biden, then not only would Trump be exonerated, but the entirety of the left, MSM included would owe him an apology, a big one. And at this point, I think some facts have been released to team Trump.

If it's found that Hunter Biden did wrong, will the ATS left even acknowledge it? I'd bet no.

The so-called Aid package which Ambassador Taylor revealed yesterday was actually just an advanced Weaponry arms deal.

These Knuckleheads wanted to put Javelin anti-tank missile systems and probably manpads and who knows what else into the hands of essentially a mafia Run Country.

10% of those weapons would have gone unaccounted for on the first day guaranteed.

a reply to: dashen

I thought we did send them the weapons?

To the OP. I'm not sure Hunter broke any laws, but it appears his daddy did.

But you're right, if it wasn't this, it'd be some other manufactured goat rope.

a reply to: watchitburn

I'm not sure Hunter broke any laws, but it appears his daddy did.

i think that it is a safe bet that most of the cash hunter got paid went to his pop. he probably just got a small cut.

if investigators could get a look at hunters bank account, i bet they would see large sums compared to the payments made to him unaccounted for.

originally posted by: network dude
Disclosure, I think that Trump screwed up by asking about this directly. He should have asked Barr to dig into this.

I think he did this knowing full well what would happen. Think about it. It keeps them fully pre-occupied with 'impeachment', while Durham and Barr close in and dot all the i's and cross all the t's before unsealing the indictments and the arrests begin.

Obama/Clinton State Dept. was sending billions of taxpayer dollars to George Soros' International Renaissance Foundation (IRF)...essentially giving Soros total control of Ukraine.

PDF: "Comprehensive Strategy For The New Ukraine"...By George Soros.
www.cyber-berkut.org...


OF COURSE Ukraine was corrupt.

Leaked memo proves George Soros ruled Ukraine in 2014, minutes from “Breakfast with US Ambassador Geoffrey Pyatt”

theduran.com...

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: network dude
Disclosure, I think that Trump screwed up by asking about this directly. He should have asked Barr to dig into this.

I think he did this knowing full well what would happen. Think about it. It keeps them fully pre-occupied with 'impeachment', while Durham and Barr close in and dot all the i's and cross all the t's before unsealing the indictments and the arrests begin.

I'm all for the long game, but that is a bit above 4d chess. If that was the case, Trump is way smarter than even his base thinks. I don't think he's dumb at all, but I kind of doubt that was his plan. I'd like to be wrong.

originally posted by: network dude
"I think he did this knowing full well what would happen. Think about it. It keeps them fully pre-occupied with 'impeachment', while Durham and Barr close in and dot all the i's and cross all the t's before unsealing the indictments and the arrests begin."

I'm all for the long game, but that is a bit above 4d chess. If that was the case, Trump is way smarter than even his base thinks. I don't think he's dumb at all, but I kind of doubt that was his plan. I'd like to be wrong.

Seriously? I consider this plain 2D chess. What is so complicated about a classical 'mis-direction' ploy?

a reply to: tanstaafl

weren't Barr and Durham going to do their job regardless of the pressure?

This certainly isn't a hill I want to die on, so I won't harp on it anymore. I hope you are right and it's all part of the plan.

originally posted by: watchitburn
a reply to: dashen

I thought we did send them the weapons?

To the OP. I'm not sure Hunter broke any laws, but it appears his daddy did.

But you're right, if it wasn't this, it'd be some other manufactured goat rope.

Trump held up the aid/ javelins until after verifying that the new elected Ukranian President was sincere in his policies and not just another corrupt puppet stepping into power. Obama never sent any weapons.

Yet, here we are today. Impeachment inquiry all because Trump wanted to ensure that the assistance would be used for good. Pence and Perry gave the okay...the aid was released. Yet, Trump is bad. Uh huh...sure.

originally posted by: network dude
Weren't Barr and Durham going to do their job regardless of the pressure?

Sure, but this makes it a lot easier...

This certainly isn't a hill I want to die on, so I won't harp on it anymore. I hope you are right and it's all part of the plan.

No worries... I'm still just hoping beyond hope that Barr/Durham really are the 'real deal' and significant Justice is on the way.

a reply to: network dude

Fact, the US and EU going in with the Anti Russian side of the Ukraine Equation was literally cosying up to the devil, why do I say this well it is a fact that the ANTI Russian side of that argument where the minority AND that they had a vast number of Neo Nazi's among there rank's whom hero worshiped people that had committed atrocity's on the Axis side of the second world war even to the point of erecting statues to those vile men and parading in Nazi regalia after they had ousted the democratically elected Ukrainian government.

It is also a fact that the EU really wanted the Ukraine's oil and gas BUT that the Ukraine's Oil and Gas were in fact Russia's Oil and Gas that a former Soviet Union president whom himself had been born in the Ukraine had given to the Ukraine since most of it is in Crimea, the Ukraine at the time was what to the Russia of his time essentially what Wales and Scotland are to the UK a nation in name and culture BUT even much more of simply a region of a greater nation of which they are an integral part.

Also the Ukraine is Ethnically mostly Russian though the Tartars were there in strong numbers for a long time - back and forth with the Slavic people's on that one as they invaded and conquered one another.

So that put a hitch in the EU's wish to gain all that oil as suddenly the Russian's whom still saw the Ukraine as really part of there nation and especially the Crimea then took the Crimea were all that Oil is back, illegally or legally is neither here nor there it happened and is not going to un-happen any time soon if ever.

The corrupt - NEO Nazi infested government's that the US and EU had put in place were indeed just that Corrupt and the people of the Ukraine new it and did not like them BUT they had just seen a coup take there government of choice from them and then the Russians whom many if not most of them still wanted a close relationship with Take back the Crimea and a violent war with the Russian backed rebels in Crimea that then killed many of there people in an almost instant continuation of the violent coup that had also killed many of there people take place so that once the chance appeared they voted in someone that had the gut's to go up against the Nazi thug's and he just happened to be a well known in the Ukraine comedian whom so far has turned out to be for most of them a better leader than the coup leader that only the right wing minority had wanted ever was was.

Now that's from an English observation BUT there are many sides to every story, in the US there is an allergic reaction to RUSSIANS and that goes so far that they will happily Cosy up to NAZI's, in fact after WW2 they did just that with operation paperclip a program that has caused lasting harm and corruption to the US itself as they gave former high ranking NAZI's positions of power and authority in all walks including the intelligence agency's themselves since they regarded the Soviets as a far more dangerous threat than the defeated NAZI's, they even whitewashed many former NAZI's whom then became house hold names such as Werner (VERNER) Von Braun the supposed father of Rocketry - he was not but that is the reputation and public image he was given some Chinese Alchemist probably beat him to it well over a thousand years ago.

It's about Geopolitics but no longer for national security, the game is now being played for the benefit of a few elite and very wealthy corporate puppet masters and we are all pawn's on the board for those scum bag's.

Putin is no saint but is he really worse than them?.

OR,

Just the same as but there current opponent as they play there power games?.

But you're right, if it wasn't this, it'd be some other manufactured goat rope.

Goat ropers need love too. He's 35 still drinkin at the honkytonk......

a reply to: network dude

Not only was it corrupt. It was corrupted by the obama/soros machine in a takeover bid. Obama and soros basically owned ukraine.