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Colonel Vindman Tells Ukraine to Ignore Requests From His Boss President Trump.

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posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 08:58 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Grambler




If the Republican candidate loses in November, some observers suggest Kiev’s actions may have played at least a small role.


Well except that the republican candidate didnt lose did he?
What only your side can have no harm no foul? Standard hyprocracy.


What are you talking about?

So election interfence from a foriegn government is perfectly fine as long as the candidate they interfered for loses?

Either we investigate all foriegn election interfernce, or we investigate none.

Your democrats claimed invcestoigating it was the biggest deal, foriegn election interfence was tantamount to an act of war, and it could destory our elections. And so we had to have a three year investigation looking at crimes from years ago that had nothing to do with the 2016 election, raiding lawyers houses in the middle of the night, and so on.

Now all the sudden, its hypocrisy to say foriegn election interfence that benefited hillary should be investigated?

Thats laughable even from you.




posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:02 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

The Ukraine did not interfere with the US election in 2016. The Russians did.

Known and proven FACT.




posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:03 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: grey580

And its the reason Zelenski still has not made any announcements.
The only big mouth is Shokin. The guy that got fired for not investigating corruption. And he only started his crap after trump did his little song and dance about the Bidens.
You just cant make this stuff up.


You make up # all the time. Please source your claims.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:11 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: grey580

And its the reason Zelenski still has not made any announcements.
The only big mouth is Shokin. The guy that got fired for not investigating corruption. And he only started his crap after trump did his little song and dance about the Bidens.
You just cant make this stuff up.


If shokin was the one not investigatiing zlochevsky's corrution, how come after he was fired, and the investigation was kicked to the Obama allied NABU, did they let Zlochevsky go with a slap on the wrist?

Why werent Obama and biden outraged that the new prosecutor allowed zloichevsky, who they said was guilty, walk free?



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:17 AM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Grambler

The Ukraine did not interfere with the US election in 2016. The Russians did.

Known and proven FACT.



You just posted a response to the article I posted that shows Ukranians admitting to interfering in the election to help Hillary.

Let me help you again


For years, Serhiy Leshchenko, a top Ukrainian anti-corruption campaigner, worked to expose kleptocracy under former president Viktor Yanukovich. Now, he is focusing on a new perceived pro-Russian threat to Ukraine: US presidential candidate Donald Trump.

The prospect of Mr Trump, who has praised Ukraine’s arch-enemy Vladimir Putin, becoming leader of the country’s biggest ally has spurred not just Mr Leshchenko but Kiev’s wider political leadership to do something they would never have attempted before: intervene, however indirectly, in a US election.

Mr Leshchenko and Ukraine’s anti-corruption bureau published a secret ledger this month that authorities claim show millions of dollars of off-the-book cash payments to Paul Manafort, Mr Trump’s campaign director, while he was advising Mr Yanukovich’s Regions party from 2005.


www.ft.com...

It is extremely sad to see you so invested in defending the dems and their corruption that you can look at an admission from Ukrainains saying they interfered in the election to help hillary, and say it doesnt exist.

Seek help
edit on 12-11-2019 by Grambler because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:21 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

It’s completely fair to say that one of the two of us is being dishonest.

Vindman stated that on July 31 he had a conversation with his Ukrainian counterpart. He did not testify that he counseled him to stay out of American domestic politics. In fact, Vindman DIRECTLY answers the question with the statement “I was certainly not going against the orders of my Commander in Chief.”

You are simply parroting what Rep. Radcliffe was trying to imply, which is pointedly not true. VIndman’s counsel points that out repeatedly.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:25 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

So your source to counter an acknowledged expert in foreign policy particularly in regard to Ukraine is to quote an opinion article from Financial Times?

LOL.

Your own source states clearly that any actions by Ukraine would have only had a “small effect” on the election, but hey, that’s just another opinion from an opinion article.

Why don’t you tell us the specific actions taken by Mr. Leshchenko to “interfere” in our election?

What are those actions, because we sure as heck know what the Russians did.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:27 AM
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originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: carewemust
Wait. What?
Now someone who defies to follow illegal orders is called a traitor?


What is it called when the military officer undermines his commander-in-chief?


According to former Ambassador Nikki Haley this morning on FoxNews, we'll probably learn that former Secretary of State REX TILLERSON and Chief of Staff JOHN KELLY worked against their boss, swamp-drainer, President Trump.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:28 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

... and your “article” states clearly that the Ukrainians knew that Trump was pro-Russian and that there were Russian state actors working to get Trump elected.

Thanks for proving that the Russians were working for Trump ... once again.




posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:29 AM
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originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: carewemust
Wait. What?
Now someone who defies to follow illegal orders is called a traitor?


What is it called when the military officer undermines his commander-in-chief?


According to former Ambassador Nikki Haley this morning on FoxNews, we'll probably learn that former Secretary of State REX TILLERSON and Chief of Staff JOHN KELLY worked against their boss, swamp-drainer, President Trump.


Vindman was talking to an equally low level functionary in the Ukrainian government, and he states, very specifically, that he was not disobeying the orders of his Commander in Chief.

The fact that so many are so willing to lie so openly about an American soldier tells us all we need to know about Trump apologetics.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:34 AM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

It’s completely fair to say that one of the two of us is being dishonest.

Vindman stated that on July 31 he had a conversation with his Ukrainian counterpart. He did not testify that he counseled him to stay out of American domestic politics. In fact, Vindman DIRECTLY answers the question with the statement “I was certainly not going against the orders of my Commander in Chief.”

You are simply parroting what Rep. Radcliffe was trying to imply, which is pointedly not true. VIndman’s counsel points that out repeatedly.




On the following page, Vindman again say he told his counter part not to get involved with domestic US politics

Now he can say he wasnt undermining Trumps policy, but this clearly is.

He admits he felt trump asking for this investigation was wrong, becaiuse it would be an interfernce in US domestic politics. He then admits he counseled his counterpart not to get invlded in US domestic politics.

Thats undermining trump, regardless of his claim it wasnt.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:38 AM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

So your source to counter an acknowledged expert in foreign policy particularly in regard to Ukraine is to quote an opinion article from Financial Times?

LOL.

Your own source states clearly that any actions by Ukraine would have only had a “small effect” on the election, but hey, that’s just another opinion from an opinion article.

Why don’t you tell us the specific actions taken by Mr. Leshchenko to “interfere” in our election?

What are those actions, because we sure as heck know what the Russians did.


Absoultely pathetic response.

This "opinion piece" has admissions by a Ukranian politicians that he and the anti corruption bureau (the same NABU that buried let the case into Hunter bidens sons company go with a slap on the wrist) intervened in the election to help Hillary because they didnt like trumps policies.

It says what they did, released details of a black ledger about Manafort to harm trumps campaign.

Politico even reported on this


Ukrainian government officials tried to help Hillary Clinton and undermine Trump by publicly questioning his fitness for office. They also disseminated documents implicating a top Trump aide in corruption and suggested they were investigating the matter, only to back away after the election. And they helped Clinton’s allies research damaging information on Trump and his advisers, a Politico investigation found.

A Ukrainian-American operative who was consulting for the Democratic National Committee met with top officials in the Ukrainian Embassy in Washington in an effort to expose ties between Trump, top campaign aide Paul Manafort and Russia, according to people with direct knowledge of the situation.


www.politico.com...



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:38 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

And Alexander Vindman is NOT on Schiff's list of witnesses for the open hearings. As pointed out in another thread, it's possible (likely?) that Colonel Vindman is a co-conspirator with Adam Schiff to this Impeachment farce.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:40 AM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

... and your “article” states clearly that the Ukrainians knew that Trump was pro-Russian and that there were Russian state actors working to get Trump elected.

Thanks for proving that the Russians were working for Trump ... once again.



Yes yes I know. You are ok with foreign interference as long as it benefits your side.

I mean it was perfectly fine for Ukraine to interfere, because they thought trump was pro russian.

Thank you for making it clear to everyone just how hypocritical you all are.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:40 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

How interesting that you carefully choose what to cut and paste particularly in terms of page numbers, and that you carefully choose what parts you want to paraphrase to fit your argument.

Vindman, a highly decorated military officer, stated specifically that he did not disobey any orders from the President.

It is YOUR opinion that Vindman undermined Trump. That’s all.

You’re paraphrasing to fit your claim again. He stated that the movement which preceded the Trump-Zelensky call by Guiliani etc. was not in the interests of the United States in his opinion.

And your repetition of whether this undermined Trump is your opinion. Tell me, did Zelensky listen to the low-level functionary counterpart to Vindman? Did it have any effect on Ukrainian policy?

The answer is no, and you are quite aware of that fact.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:42 AM
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originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

... and your “article” states clearly that the Ukrainians knew that Trump was pro-Russian and that there were Russian state actors working to get Trump elected.

Thanks for proving that the Russians were working for Trump ... once again.



Yes yes I know. You are ok with foreign interference as long as it benefits your side.

I mean it was perfectly fine for Ukraine to interfere, because they thought trump was pro russian.

Thank you for making it clear to everyone just how hypocritical you all are.



I am not okay with any foreign interference in our elections. And I am not on a side. Unlike you.

Now, how did the Ukraine “interfere”? Specifically, since it’s all smoke an mirrors anyway, what did the individual you claim interefered “Lushchenko” ... what DID HE DO?

The only one who looks hypocritical here is you. You’re blatantly lying about what I said three posts above this one.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:43 AM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: ManFromEurope
a reply to: carewemust
Wait. What?
Now someone who defies to follow illegal orders is called a traitor?


What is it called when the military officer undermines his commander-in-chief?


According to former Ambassador Nikki Haley this morning on FoxNews, we'll probably learn that former Secretary of State REX TILLERSON and Chief of Staff JOHN KELLY worked against their boss, swamp-drainer, President Trump.


Vindman was talking to an equally low level functionary in the Ukrainian government, and he states, very specifically, that he was not disobeying the orders of his Commander in Chief.

The fact that so many are so willing to lie so openly about an American soldier tells us all we need to know about Trump apologetics.


Vindman admits he counseled his counterpart to not get involved in US domestic politics. Vindman admits he thought trumps request to the Ukraine was asking them to get involved in US domestic politics.

So for him to when he is caught admitting he asked his counterpart to disregard what trump asked to then say "Oh but this wasnt me asking to disobey the president" is laughable.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:44 AM
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a reply to: amicktd

I source more than I dont.
And I NEVER LIE...

Has Zelenski made the announcement that trump wants him to make?

Or do you deny that trump wants him to make an announcement?

Because the testimony says otherwise.

Repeating lies doesnt make them true.



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:45 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66

It doesnt matter if Vindman claims he didnt feel his comment was disobeying the Presidents orders. He admitted excatly what he discussed, and that was in fact telling his counter part to not adhere to trumps request because it would be getting involved in US domestic politics.

As to whether or not Zelensky listened, why is that releveant to the point that Vindman was telling to Ukraine not to comply with trumps request?



posted on Nov, 12 2019 @ 09:46 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

Funny that you consider counters to your blatant dishonestly “pathetic.” That clearly shows the mettle of your fallacious argument.

So, your source doesn’t state what Leshchenko did, and you want to pair that up with a totally different matter? (From another opinion article?)

Do you understand the difference between fact and opinion? Do you understand that repeatedly quoting someone else’s OPINION does nothing to prove your argument?

Pathetic, is that what you said?




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