Romans;- What happened to the Jews?

a reply to: DISRAELI

Something to consider here. What Paul pussyfooted around in Romans 11 is this. Israel and Judah was supposed to face a long term Leviticus 26 curse. And the description of the curse is contained in the book of Hosea. And the timeline of the "Day of Jezreel" prophecy is here.

Hosea 6.
1 Come, and let us return unto the LORD: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
2 After two days will he revive us: in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.
3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the LORD: his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth.

2nd Peter 3.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

Put simply Israel and Judah are under a two thousand year top level Leviticus 26 curse. And now if you reread Romans 11 and make the proper reference back to Isaiah 6 then it's extremely obvious. Paul figured out the curse. But he was probably under orders not to actually tell anyone.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Meanwhile, the whole religion about conspiracies.

Which Jews are we talking about...the ones that followed Jesus, the ones that didn't, or the ones that followed Paul?

The Jews just didn't get the Messiah they were expecting and wanting. They lived under the oppression of Roman rules, and their idea of a Messiah was a conquering King David who would liberate them and re-create the Kingdom of Israel on Earth. They were looking for an earthly, material kingdom, not the Heavenly, spiritual kingdom Christ was promising.

So they didn't see Christ as Messiah.

They chose not to hear the message to be in the world and not of the world.

They make their law tangible and earthly rather than a thing in their heart and of the spirit -- letter of the law instead of spirit of the Law.

IN short, they're too grounded in the earth and the material by the law.

a reply to: ntech
In that chapter, Paul explains that the apparent exclusion of the Jews is temporary and has a positive purpose. Next week.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
Yet it would be desirable to save them. They[The Jews] have been the recipients, and the guardians for the rest of the world, of everything that God has given in the Old Testament period, including the sense of his presence, his personal relationship, and the first revelations of his will.
They[the Jews] have been what I call “the first point of contact”.

This is a conflation and since your premise is built upon it it has no merits.The old testament clearly states around 920 BCE the nation of Israel split into two Kingdoms.The northen Kingdom (10 of the 12 tribes of the nation of Israel)) which retained the name Israel.The Southern Kingdom which was the two tribes of Judah and Benjamin which was named Judah(Jews).

Whomever Paul is speaking of he is not confusing Israel for Judah as you are.This is not a minor point it is a forest in the eye of a blind person.These are just signs of how convoluted Christian theology has conflated the scriptures into the doctrine of men just as Yahoshua stated.When I converse with someone who does not even know the basics of their arguments it nullifies all of their arguments.You continually do this in your writing and unfortunately I am positive you will continue to do so believing you are correct.

Yahoshua accurately stated why and how this would happen many times yet billions cannot see or hear because they “trust in their belief system so much they cannot imagine themselves being wrong.That is the state of being in Hades(the realm of imperception and death) which is ironic since most Christians that are presently in Hades believe everyone who does not believe as they do will be condemned to Hell by their “loving God” and submitted to torture or annihilation.

The very thing you believe you are doing(preaching the Gospel) is the exact opposite.Trusting in lies (being deceived) is not good news.Unfortunately for you you are doing exactly as Yahoshua said you would “You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let in those who wish to enter”.Fortunately, you will be delivered from Hades however when and how will be determined by when you stop trusting(and preaching) in the doctrines of men.

a reply to: Rex282
What I wrote was a paraphrase of Paul's words in vv4-5;
"... for the sake of my brethren, my kindred by race. They are Israeiites, and to them belong the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the worship and the promises; to them belong the patriarchs, and of their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ..."
I think my paraphrase was reasonably accurate. All I did was substitute other words for the jargon words.
See also ch11, where Paul puts forward the possibility that the Jews will be "grafted back onto the olive tree".

The continuity of God's people doesn't lie in any particular name. It lies in "having the faith of Abraham". (see ch4 v11)