a reply to: dfnj2015
For me the idea of "MODERATE" socialism such as we in the UK had after WW2 AND also such as Sweden and Norway had is a perfectly workable model and
while it allows corporate economic and private enterprise to run and compete it also provides state care and social safety net's of the highest
ANY totalitarian system will oppress and necessitate the death, imprisonment and brainwashing of a very large portion of the population.
That is ANY.
There is no such thing as a FREE economic system or a pure capitalists system as some on this site spout like brain washed indoctrinated automaton's
trying to pursue merit's that simply do not exist.
Like wise there is no such thing as a true Socialist system above the level of cooperative movement's that are mostly family or community owned and
exist only on the small to very small medium scale such as the Kibbutz of Israel (not the tourist one's the real one's were the people all worked and
shared in common from the proceed's of there communal project and community).
All systems' have killed but as Socialism is the relatively new kid on the block as far as modern organized systems are concerned it has actually
killed far less than capitalist based system's.
Crime's of Communism were about totalitarian control and not about the ideology of communism itself.
For example Mao killed millions, some claim up to a potential hundred million and perhaps even more during his cultural revolution which was not a
communist move the move of a despotic tyrant wanting to hammer the people of China into a clay mold of his choosing, his REFORM'S were like a
re-enactment of another famous Chinese Tyrant by the name of Qin, he murdered scholars, historian's, farmers (for being land owners), village elders
and many others in his drive to destroy OLD class based Chinese society but in the event all he really managed to do was to put a new class system and
a new form of Mandarin in charge called the party while he and his successors simply became the Emperors of the new China.
Lennin was not as bad as some on this site believe but he was no saint, Communism in Russia which had already become a mess early on then had to
suffer the years of Stalinist rule, the terror of the Purges and the secret police as the whole system of freedom for the people was turned on it's
head and the Army with it's general in charge, the NKVD forerunners of the KGB acting as secret police and anyone that disagreed with there NEW TSAR
Stalin likely to be sent to a gulag or machine gunned into a trench in a forest (there are thousands of mass graves scattered across Russia were this
happened) never to be heard from again, even Moderate - Original - Leninist communists were likely to be purged in this way.
The communist's also tried to stamp out Religion.
Capitalism, oh were to begin, mass killing's, purges, theft of land, colonization, slavery if we could see a death toll based on greed (and remember
it was still greed that worked the same in Communism were being a member of the party was a meal ticket to the big time) then it would likely dwarf
the communist death list.
But over a period of time, during the twentieth century there can be little doubt that Communism killed more people in less time, perhaps even
dwarfing the death toll caused by the hideous Nazi's (whom some illiterate fool's on here claim were Socialists having never heard of the night of the
long knives and how the NAZI's purged the socialists from there own rank's).
But if we look at how people have been liberated, given the right to vote, rights in work, food enough to eat, a right in many country's to shelter
and food and water and education for there children (though in the UK under the Tory's these have been severely eroded with one TORY candidate a
female even claiming that benefit claimant's should be put down like sick animal's) we can positively point out that these reform's were due to
CHRISTIAN SOCIALISTS of the past, communists and anarchists hijacked and co-opted the Christian socialist movement but it still remained and until
recently most Labour Leaders were genuinely Christian men while the Tory's while they may go to church have most often not been in any way the kind
that st Peter is likely to allow past the pearly gates.
I believe your point is correct therefore, ALL political ideology's especially when taken to the extreme have cost lives.
BUT you know what remain's the best - TRUE (it no longer exists sadly but the concept does) DEMOCRACY were every man is expected to have access to
the truth in the form of a FREE (NOT a corporate owned or politically biased but show me one that is not) PRESS and to be so informed that they can
then make there decisions to the best of there future and expect the duly elected representative candidates to do there utmost to carry out the
promises they make (Another failing most of them just fill there pockets or worse are corporate stooges these day's).
Christian socialism is NOT communism, there is such a thing as ethical state ownership, Capitalism is NOT Christian either as it is the religion of
the very money changers that Christ flung body and soul out of the house of God - so if he did that to them down here what is going to happen to them
when they try to buy a ticket into heaven?.
As you treat the least of these (the poor and downtrodden, society's rejected and sick, the widow's and the elderly, the small orphan's on the
streets) so too do you treat me.
You won't get through to them, many of them have a very unchristian feel good abuse the name of Jesus and pray for money belief system and follow
guy's with million dollar smiles whom live as multi millionaires with private jet's and sport's cars while they pay those scoundrel's money in the
form of donation's, they will sit there listening too and watching there religious TV personality's and never once get off there arse and go and look
at JESUS in the poor and downtrodden, all it takes is for them to VOTE for the good guy's for once but NO you see GOOD for them is not GOOD in the
sight of GOD.