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Supposedly socialism has killed 200 million people

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posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 05:50 PM
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I lived in a project building in the BX for years. Plenty of folks are happy to stay in that lifestyle. If they make more money, there rent goes up. Why make more money? Instead they make money on the black market selling drugs and their bodies so Uncle Sam doesn't take a piece. Many many people do live that way. Not all, and I wouldn't be so bold as to state a %. To deny people do live this way is ignorant though. a reply to: pexx421




posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 05:54 PM
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Im also sick and tired of trolling threads that the OP won't regularly engage in. If you are willing to make claims, especially ones negative towards others in bigoted broad strokes, your lack of response shows your weakness of mind. a reply to: dfnj2015



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 06:11 PM
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a reply to: pexx421

The government doesn't but its employees do.

That's the waste. It has no reason to be efficient in its spending. There's a reason why bureaucrats are always making fat retirements. There's a reason why you hear about them going on paid junkets. There's a reason why double and triple dipping is a thing -- bureaucrats gaming the retirement rules to get two and three full retirement packages. Government employees never get fired. They simply get re-assigned. Haven't you heard of teachers in so-called rubber rooms? And on and on and on ...



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 06:36 PM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: dfnj2015

“power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely"
-Lord Acton

Political systems aren't evil. Economic systems aren't evil.

People are.

Any political or economic system that gives more authority to those few at the top will be corrupt and cause more death because people are corrupt.



That is why we will not be a dictatorship even as some people claimed a few of the last POTUS were Dictators. DJT being living rent free in their minds is the worse thing they think they see.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 07:53 PM
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a reply to: pexx421

Really? is that why his supposed constitution is so similar to Stalin's constitution of the U.S.S.R.?

Bernie Sander's Constitution is Equal to Stalin's Constitution of the USSR.

None of you whom keep proclaiming lies about socialism, or communism know what you are talking about. You claim things that are not true.

Karl Marx himself said it, and he was talking about SOCIALISM.




The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.

Karl Marx

www.brainyquote.com...

In socialism, just like in communism, there can be no opposition to these systems, which is why they turn into dictatorships.

You can't get ahead as you can in capitalist countries, such as the Scandinavian countries leftists wrongfully claim are socialist, when they are capitalists...


edit on 6-11-2019 by ElectricUniverse because: correct comment.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 07:57 PM
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originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: pexx421

Yeah.

Communists really don't like free speech either.
...


Neither do democrats whom have shown themselves to be socialist at least.
In the U.S. the left use the claim "the right are all nazis" to suppress people's free speech for daring to disagree with leftists' ideals. They are the true nazis, but they are too blind to understand this.
edit on 6-11-2019 by ElectricUniverse because: correct comment.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:05 PM
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originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: pexx421

Yeah.

Communists really don't like free speech either.
...


Neither do democrats whom have shown themselves to be socialist at least.
In the U.S. the left use the claim "the right are all nazis" to suppress people's free speech for daring to disagree with leftists' ideals. They are the true nazis, but they are too blind to understand this.


That’s funny. Because the only speech I’ve seen legally banned or attempted to be, is the republicans trying to ban bds and criticism of Israel.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:06 PM
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originally posted by: ElectricUniverse
a reply to: pexx421

Really? is that why his supposed constitution is so similar to Stalin's constitution of the U.S.S.R.?

Bernie Sander's Constitution is Equal to Stalin's Constitution of the USSR.

None of you whom keep proclaiming lies about socialism, or communism know what you are talking about. You claim things that are not true.

Karl Marx himself said it, and he was talking about SOCIALISM.




The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism.

Karl Marx

www.brainyquote.com...

In socialism, just like in communism, there can be no opposition to these systems, which is why they turn into dictatorships.

You can't get ahead as you can in capitalist countries, such as the Scandinavian countries leftists wrongfully claim are socialist, when they are capitalists...



You mean like when the us initiated the coup in Argentina, and assassinated all the economics professors, priests, nuns and teachers??? Like that?



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:10 PM
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originally posted by: Rob808
I lived in a project building in the BX for years. Plenty of folks are happy to stay in that lifestyle. If they make more money, there rent goes up. Why make more money? Instead they make money on the black market selling drugs and their bodies so Uncle Sam doesn't take a piece. Many many people do live that way. Not all, and I wouldn't be so bold as to state a %. To deny people do live this way is ignorant though. a reply to: pexx421



People selling drugs and prostituting are not lazy. They’re self employed, and no different than pharma selling drugs, or cnn and fox selling entertainment. Except they actually have to sell at market value, rather than manipulating the market to drive their own prices up. But they are putting in their own work, making their own profit, and hey, I’m ok with that. Because they are a perfect example of what I’m saying, even people in poverty want to work. Not their fault that 50% of jobs offered want to give them such a crap return in their efforts.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:15 PM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Notice how most people calling for socialism here have never actually lived under a socialist system?

Ignorance sure does have its consequences.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:20 PM
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Now, I suggest you all take a good long look at South America. Because it’s very educational. There are two types of countries there. One type are the socialist nations, or former socialist nations. Each constantly beset by attacks from us insurgents and ngo funded coups, economic warfare, sanctions, attempted assassinations etc. Like we are even now doing to Bolivia.

The other type are your true capitalist paradises. Where a very tiny minority of 5% live in the nice city blocks and mansions. And the vast majority live on the outskirts, Work slave labor, have no utilities and live in ramshackle lean tos. And that’s largely under the auspices of American corporations like Chiquita, and dole. Or companies like nestle, who just admitted to using slave labor in Thailand at the same time it’s found guilty of child labor on the Ivory Coast.

What makes you think the American corporations you are supporting, with your dreams of free market deregulation, value your lives any more than the peasants in these other nations? By removing the regulations and lowering government involvement you would be removing the very barriers that keep them from doing that to you and your children. I don’t think future generations will be grateful.

Of course, you probably all imagine yourselves as John Wayne or Clint Eastwood, like you’re stronger than those oppressed brown folk in other areas. I hate to tell y’all, there were no John Wayne’s or Eastwood’s in the real Wild West. And many of your ancestors lived oppressed under the heels of often the very same robber barons that you would bring back to power.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:21 PM
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originally posted by: loam
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Notice how most people calling for socialism here have never actually lived under a socialist system?

Ignorance sure does have its consequences.


That’s because there are no real socialisms, you twit. Just like no one here has ever lived in a free market.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 08:54 PM
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a reply to: pexx421

Well, educate this 'twit' then.

Define this brand of socialism you think we all need to have.



posted on Nov, 6 2019 @ 09:11 PM
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a reply to: loam

To be honest, nobody is actually advocating for socialism. Socialism has become that chameleon phrase that some use to mean “anything supporting the people instead of business” or to others it’s every boogeyman from fascism to nazism to dictatorship to mob rule.

The actual discussion is really about two things. A)How much we allow businesses to exploit workers and dominate the political process, and b) what do we spend our taxes on.

The majority of Americans want reasonably priced medical care, reasonably priced education, and wages that reflect the profit they generate. The majority of corporations want fixed market controls that mandate their products and allow them to charge what they like, at the same time paying workers as close to slave labor as they can get away with.

The American people are largely pulled between deregulation being the answer, Convinced that nationalizing any industry will instantly lead to breadlines and purges, or hyper regulation believing that.... well, I’m not sure what the “horrible end” most leftists fear. For me it’s a corporate tyranny state.

This division is likely intentional in order to distract us as tptb rob us blind during this inevitable collapse of empire before they move on to their next economic empire building project, most likely China I’m thinking.

But your answe is in there. This “brand of socialism” that I would support is limited federal govt, no taxes on labor or non profit corporations, pay scales based upon ability, productivity and the profit that you personally create. Reinstatement of the bill of rights, and the right to privacy. Curtailing police power and militarization. More direct democracy in national decisions, with penalties for representatives that go against the will of their people. Eradication of the drug war and release of all non violent drug offenders with records purged. Extremely simplified tax code with no loopholes. Repeal the healthcare law of 1973 that allowed for profit medicine, as well as nationalization of all natural monopolies like utilities. Free airtime for all candidates during elections with long one on one discussions with candidates that outline their plans in depth, maybe done by joe rogan, with whisky and weed involved. No more wars of adventurism, and roll back the military budget by 50%.

That’s a start.
edit on 6-11-2019 by pexx421 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 7 2019 @ 01:24 AM
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originally posted by: pexx421
a reply to: loam

...limited federal govt, no taxes on labor or non profit corporations, pay scales based upon ability, productivity and the profit that you personally create. Reinstatement of the bill of rights, and the right to privacy. Curtailing police power and militarization. More direct democracy in national decisions, with penalties for representatives that go against the will of their people. Eradication of the drug war and release of all non violent drug offenders with records purged. Extremely simplified tax code with no loopholes. Repeal the healthcare law of 1973 that allowed for profit medicine, as well as nationalization of all natural monopolies like utilities. Free airtime for all candidates during elections with long one on one discussions with candidates that outline their plans in depth, maybe done by joe rogan, with whisky and weed involved. No more wars of adventurism, and roll back the military budget by 50%.


I guess that's the challenge with labels. They're largely meaningless, because I would argue most of those are all conservative principles that I would completely support, save your definition of natural monopolies and your complete elimination of for profit medicine.

But hey, I'm just a twit.

Otherwise, good answer.



posted on Nov, 7 2019 @ 04:47 AM
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I only called you a “twit” in response to your labeling leftists as having ignorance. I’m sure you’re actually a very nice and intelligent person. I actually doubt any idiots actually make their way into a site like this and stay, despite how we may feel about some of the opinions we see here.

I consider utilities, telecoms, toll roads natural monopolies because they largely lack competition, allowing them to raise prices to extortionist levels. And I think hospitals did just fine prior to 1974. And we have plenty non profit hospitals today. The pay scale is just massively skewed due to insurance companies, litigation and insurance costs, and the Medicare expansion act which banned the govt from negotiations over drug prices. I feel this high cost burden limits our freedoms. It leaves us with less money as the average healthcare plan is 12000 a month, which is a huge drain, and it pressures us into specific jobs.

But the heart of the problem is I think we are largely in a class war. I feel that the banks and corporate boardrooms have taken the helm and rigged the game to their own benefit, at the cost of everyone else’s well being.

Honestly, I am not even a stickler for specific policies. I would be perfectly fine with as close to free market capitalism as we could reasonably get, so long as that was the people’s educated, free will. I may or may not like it much, but if it was the majorities will, I would support it 100%, as we all share this nation, and I don’t want to make others live by my rules if that’s not what the majority wants. But we don’t have an “educated” populace. We have a populace that is lied to and manipulated, and i think that intentionally misleading news coverage, education, and psyops or propaganda against the American people should absolutely be treated as a high crime. Democratic institutions and elections absolutely depend upon educated choices, and I think we can all agree that every mainstream news agency, many intel agencies, and now analytics groups intentionally do their best to mislead the public in order to achieve their own ends. This absolutely has to be curtailed somehow.

And while I may have very dim views of trumps intellect, integrity, and ability, he was absolutely my preferred choice over Clinton.



posted on Nov, 7 2019 @ 05:44 AM
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The differences in democracy vs one party state are these : #1 In the US the rich become the leaders then criminals. #2 Under state party rule the criminals become wealthy as a result of their position . #3 In a democracy you are on your own and you only limited by your drive or morals . #4 In communism your told what you can become . Both sides are rigged by the rulers yet I know of only one form of government that gives you freedom to escape tyranny by saving, investing , hard work, and a bit of cowboy behavior ! I’ll let you guess what is a better option



posted on Nov, 7 2019 @ 05:57 AM
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Worry not ! Teladyne and Skynet are way past sci-fi . In less than 200 yrs machines will be deciding who lives or dies ! Any guess as to whom the machines will spare ? It won’t be us that’s for sure ! Once man is gone Gaia will shut down and the world will return to Mother Nature.



posted on Nov, 7 2019 @ 06:14 AM
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originally posted by: pexx421

originally posted by: Turkenstein
a reply to: dfnj2015

I have a friend from Venezuela. You can ask her how awesome socialism is. There country went from top of the world to a #hole country in no time after moving to socialism. The lack of readily available common resources lead to many deaths. It lead to many more when the people of Venezuela realized they had made a mistake and wanted things to go back to the way they were before socialism.
Please leave fantasy land, aka- college campus safe space.


Right. It was socialism that did that. If you ignore the fact that during Chavez’s early reign they eradicated illiteracy, raised wages, provided free healthcare and education, had greater freedom and citizen participation and govt. Their current situation has nothing to do with the fact that we attempted multiple coups and assassination attempts, cut them off from global trade, embargoed their nation, stole billions of their dollars, engaged their business owners to not sell their products in venezuela, engaged in economic espionage, sabotaged their electric programs, etc. Let’s not ignore facts when presenting our own skewed prejudices shall we? Myopia hurts.
I'll take the word of someone who lived it over a pretensious, self important, America hating, communist regurgitating what his leftist college professor shared with him over pillow talk.. All the things you mentioned are derived from leadership greed made possible by the distributive power of a socialist government. The coups didn't start until his greed took over. They have to start the process on a good note to create the dependency required to operate unchallenged until they are in a position to turn toward personal gain and power.



posted on Nov, 7 2019 @ 07:34 AM
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originally posted by: Turkenstein

originally posted by: pexx421

originally posted by: Turkenstein
a reply to: dfnj2015

I have a friend from Venezuela. You can ask her how awesome socialism is. There country went from top of the world to a #hole country in no time after moving to socialism. The lack of readily available common resources lead to many deaths. It lead to many more when the people of Venezuela realized they had made a mistake and wanted things to go back to the way they were before socialism.
Please leave fantasy land, aka- college campus safe space.


Right. It was socialism that did that. If you ignore the fact that during Chavez’s early reign they eradicated illiteracy, raised wages, provided free healthcare and education, had greater freedom and citizen participation and govt. Their current situation has nothing to do with the fact that we attempted multiple coups and assassination attempts, cut them off from global trade, embargoed their nation, stole billions of their dollars, engaged their business owners to not sell their products in venezuela, engaged in economic espionage, sabotaged their electric programs, etc. Let’s not ignore facts when presenting our own skewed prejudices shall we? Myopia hurts.
I'll take the word of someone who lived it over a pretensious, self important, America hating, communist regurgitating what his leftist college professor shared with him over pillow talk.. All the things you mentioned are derived from leadership greed made possible by the distributive power of a socialist government. The coups didn't start until his greed took over. They have to start the process on a good note to create the dependency required to operate unchallenged until they are in a position to turn toward personal gain and power.


Really? In my foreign relations class the teacher was a right wing Warhawk mass murder apologist, who denied Israel had nuclear weapons at all much less one of the worlds largest arsenals. Every class was literally her and I arguing the whole time. And she’s the ONLY professor who pushed any partisan agenda in my whole college career.

And you’re right. The us doesn’t initiate coups until leftist governments try to use their resources to benefit their people. The Venezuelans didn’t embargo their nation, initiate coups, cut themselves from the world market, or bribe their businessmen not to sell goods locally themselves. Nor did they voluntarily donate 30 billion to the us. I give statistical and historical facts about chavez early rule, and about specific us activities that No one even contests, and you respond with anecdote and flawed ideology. Maybe you should have spent some time in school, or paid attention while you were there.




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