Thoughts and questions arising from the Book of Enoch

Kind of a casual thread, can't spend too long on it, but just wanted to share some thoughts & ask some questions, as the title says..

Firstly, note how the text begins with observations on the constant & seasonal appearance of signs in the natural world which attest to the constant & loving nature of God, with the natural world's abundance & dependability representing the heart of God towards mankind. This covers chapters 2-5, as a preamble of sorts.

[Chapter 2]

1 Observe ye everything that takes place in the heaven, how they do not change their orbits, and the luminaries which are in the heaven, how they all rise and set in order each in its season, and 2 transgress not against their appointed order. Behold ye the earth, and give heed to the things which take place upon it from first to last, how steadfast they are, how none of the things upon earth 3 change, but all the works of God appear to you. Behold the summer and the winter, how the whole earth is filled with water, and clouds and dew and rain lie upon it.

[Chapter 3]

Observe and see how (in the winter) all the trees seem as though they had withered and shed all their leaves, except fourteen trees, which do not lose their foliage but retain the old foliage from two to three years till the new comes.

[Chapter 4]

And again, observe ye the days of summer how the sun is above the earth over against it. And you seek shade and shelter by reason of the heat of the sun, and the earth also burns with growing heat, and so you cannot tread on the earth, or on a rock by reason of its heat.

[Chapter 5]

1 Observe ye how the trees cover themselves with green leaves and bear fruit: wherefore give ye heed and know with regard to all His works, and recognize how He that liveth for ever hath made them so. 2 And all His works go on thus from year to year for ever, and all the tasks which they accomplish for Him, and their tasks change not, but according as God hath ordained so is it done. 3 And behold how the sea and the rivers in like manner accomplish and change not their tasks from His commandments'.

RH Charles - Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament

We then move into some rebuking of the Watcher angels who rebelled & sought a life on Earth, when they had in fact a duty to which they swore an oath, namely that they would not interfere with the Earth, but would merely watch, observe the comings & goings of men, and ensure that various tasks were accomplished in due season. There is a general theme throughout the document which shows the dichotomy between what should have been for mankind, versus what actually is, on account of the actions of the rebel angels & the damage that their interference has caused to the orderly progression of the ages of the Earth. Below is an excerpt showing the imprecation of the author towards the goodness which God had intended from the beginning, yet was now requiring of a plan of salvation, to recover what had been lost, damaged by interference from beings who should have known better, whose influence had a catastrophic chaotic effect.

7a But for the elect there shall be light and joy and peace,

b And they shall inherit the earth.

8 And then there shall be bestowed upon the elect wisdom,

And they shall all live and never again sin,

Either through ungodliness or through pride:

But they who are wise shall be humble.

9 And they shall not again transgress,

Nor shall they sin all the days of their life,

Nor shall they die of (the divine) anger or wrath,

But they shall complete the number of the days of their life.

And their lives shall be increased in peace,

And the years of their joy shall be multiplied,

In eternal gladness and peace,

All the days of their life

The angels are recognised in the text as culture-bearers, who taught many arts & sciences to the human society which received them. This had the effect of artificially increasing the speed of development of the human society well beyond the level to which our psychology had evolved to handle, to cope with. Why did Sumerian civilisation suddenly arise in full force, developed well enough to rule over the world, with the seeds of many arts & sciences firmly in place? And why did they attribute their successes & the legacy of their culture to visitors from the stars (by implication)..?

Although some of the arts taught by these rebel angels are reasonable pathways to knowledge, we must realise the central tenet which Michael the archangel drives home in this next excerpt from the Book of Enoch:

'Lord of lords, God of gods, King of kings, and God of the ages... Thy name holy and glorious and blessed unto all the ages! Thou hast made all things, and power over all things hast Thou: and all things are naked and open in Thy sight, and Thou seest all 6 things, and nothing can hide itself from Thee. Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

When I think about why the archangels were up in arms, complaining to God about the actions of the rebels, it would seem that beyond simply 'breaking the rules', the issue arises in the betrayal of an oath between brothers (& sisters) in the angelic hierarchy. The text reveals that yes, there were eternal secrets which were disclosed errantly to the sons & daughters of mankind by the rebels, secrets which mankind's children were supposed to discover ON THEIR OWN in the course of the fullness of time, as the ages wheeled around in their steady progression. By interfering in the human knowledge tree, we were artificially accelerated to a hyper-advanced starting point, with rudimentary city-building & administration being fully fledged in the Sumerian culture, and in places such as Egypt.

In chapter 13, Enoch is called by the rebel Watchers to petition God on their behalf, when they finally realise that their activities have been noted & that a judgment had been issued by supernatural means, such that they were no longer able to connect with God through the means they ordinarily would have been accustomed to. On realising they had been cut off, they call Enoch:

...And they besought me to draw up a petition for them that they might find forgiveness, and to read their petition in the presence 5 of the Lord of heaven. For from thenceforward they could not speak (with Him) nor lift up their 6 eyes to heaven for shame of their sins for which they had been condemned. Then I wrote out their petition, and the prayer in regard to their spirits and their deeds individually and in regard to their 7 requests that they should have forgiveness and length. And I went off and sat down at the waters of Dan, in the land of Dan, to the south of the west of Hermon: I read their petition till I fell 8 asleep. And behold a dream came to me, and visions fell down upon me, and I saw visions of chastisement, and a voice came bidding (me) I to tell it to the sons of heaven, and reprimand them. 9 And when I awaked, I came unto them, and they were all sitting gathered together, weeping in 10 'Abelsjail, which is between Lebanon and Seneser, with their faces covered. And I recounted before them all the visions which I had seen in sleep, and I began to speak the words of righteousness, and to reprimand the heavenly Watchers.

What we can note from the above part of the text is that the activities of these rebels went on for a long time before any punishment was wrought against them. This is despite the obvious cost to mankind which was being desecrated by the actions of these beings. In essence, we must surmise that they viewed us in terms that we might consider to be indicative of a eugenics 'sub-human' argument. They viewed us as expendable slaves to satisfy their lusts & selfish greed. If you've seen the series 'Westworld' on TV, you'll note that what I'm describing is similar to the way that the 'guests' in the world-scale theme park persecute, torture, murder & destroy the occupants of Westworld, the near-human & liminally self-aware androids, constructed at the nano-scale by machines which program the base code of DNA to generate - in essence - facsimile humans. Those facsimile humans are really not much less than human in the grand scheme of things, as is demonstrated throughout the series. However, the 'guests' simply brutalise them, falsely believing that they're not actually causing real harm - or even, not caring at all about whether it is perceived by the 'sub-humans' they are persecuting.

I think the above analogy serves as a perfect approximation of the way humans were persecuted & abused by these so-called 'gods' which came to rule over & dominate the world in ancient times. When the judgment finally comes, it is a hammer-blow of realisation for the Watchers, as the knowledge of the gravity of their crimes sinks in. They have isolated themselves from the Life-giving source of the Universe, by desecrating the holy journey of humanity towards self-knowledge & awareness of the mysteries of the Cosmos. Because of their actions, the world has paid a high price, and continues to do so.

Another fact which I found interesting is how the prophet Enoch receives the answer to the petition of the Watchers - it comes in a dream, after he had spent the evening reading & reflecting upon the petition. It is fascinating to me to think that our humble state of sleep, and the mysteries of dreaming, were used in this manner, to send an answer through a natural & godly channel, the prophet who had been set apart & sanctified as an instrument of divine authority. There was no burning bush, nor fire from the heavens - a man prayed about the situation (a terribly ominous situation) & in his dream he received a vision of how to answer the complex petition which the Watchers had brought to the prophet.

In this instance, it seems that God is demonstrating the fact that His will was always that we would naturally intuit & experiment with means of becoming self-aware & advancing the cause of the arts, sciences, spiritual growth & exploration of all spheres of knowledge. God communicates today, also often through dreams, and no-one should ever under-estimate the power of a simple prayer, from a humble heart.

That's everything I have for now - I haven't really finished my full interpretation, but I'll leave it here for tonight.

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

Do you any example of what an eternal secret might be?

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

Do you any example of what an eternal secret might be?

Astrology.

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

Do you any example of what an eternal secret might be?

Cosmetics?

originally posted by: Sookiechacha

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

Do you any example of what an eternal secret might be?

Astrology.

The Living God created that as well

I think the book of Enoch was well respected by early Christians. I think Jasher was too. Some interesting stuff to say the least. I believe all Angelic beings are aliens. Good ones and bad ones

originally posted by: PhilbertDezineck

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

Do you any example of what an eternal secret might be?

Cosmetics?

Cosmetics were taught by the fallen beings, if I remember right

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Well humans are like cavemen and women, just barely out of a cave. Technically and going by our metal prowess and everything else, we should still just be at the carriage and buggy scene, if barely just.

Barely just out of the tribe and tribe mentality at best for a small minority.

But this house of cards has been so stacked, it can only just topple over in time. No need for the lord of hosts to get involved. Such issues eventually just solve themselves. Or if not, and things really go bad, can always just glass this place and start all over.

originally posted by: visitedbythem

originally posted by: PhilbertDezineck

originally posted by: dfnj2015

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which men were striving to learn

Do you any example of what an eternal secret might be?

Cosmetics?

Cosmetics were taught by the fallen beings, if I remember right

along with all other forms of enchantments.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Great thread - more quality work that we come to "expect" from you. ( haha )

I think it was Sitchin who posited that man was "an animal without consciousness" until they stole the secrets of the Tree of Knowledge. Just mining for Gold for the Gods.


www.annunaki.org...

Enki himself creates human beings out of a mixture of clay and the blood of the slain god Kingu.

The Pyramids were possibly used as gateways to the afterlife? Possibly to Orion ( Bauval/Hancock ) or Sirius ( Dogon Tribe ).

Onto Enoch. Was Enoch also Hermes Trismegistus?

www.jasoncolavito.com...

That leaves us to look at another odd bit of influence, presumably from Annianus, that argues for an early identification. According to the Book of Enoch, Annianus’s source, Enoch lived among the Watchers at the ends of the earth. According to the Book of Giants, this land was beyond the reaches of civilization, at the edge of a great desert. This description could conceivable accord with upper Egypt, located at the fringes of what was then the civilized Mediterranean world, and on the edge of the Egyptian and Saharan deserts. But did Annianus consider the first Egyptians to be evil Nephilim?

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

I love this thread.

To me, part of what the book is saying is there is a season for everything (literally and figuratively) and we should not try to be out of season. This could be so many things.

Old people should not try to act like a teenager, but should use their age and wisdom proudly
Women should not try to have babies too late in life because it can add complications...

The young should not try to be grown up and make grown up decisions that could affect their lives later.

I think this goes so much deeper then it might seem from the surface. For example.
There was a story recently that people were decorating their Christmas trees with sunflowers. There were tons of comments an opinions on how it was wrong and ugly etc... Just a small example.

I also believe this goes back to how humans should eat seasonally. You should not have a XL milkshake in the middle of winter.

When we think of people that are very successful I think of the two opposite types of people, the super organized (Business people like Bill Gates, Warren Buffet), and the super unorganized (entertainers - Kardashians, musicians etc.)
Maybe very similar to rebels and good angels.

Here is a good website on the Book of Enoch.

Forbidden Book Of Enoch

Quote from the Book of Enoch.

And Azâzêl taught men to make swords, and knives, and shields, and breastplates, and made known to them the metals of the earth and the art of working them, and bracelets, and ornaments, and the use of antimony, and the beautifying of the eyelids, and all kinds of costly stones, and all coloring tinctures. And there arose much godlessness, and they committed fornication, and they were led astray, and became corrupt in all their ways.

From the Bible.

Genesis 6:1-4 says: When men began to multiply on the face of the Earth, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and took them wives of all which they chose.

From the article.

In books like Enoch, Jubilee and the Testimonies of the Twelve Patriarchs, the angel orders are arranged in hierarchies. The Watchers seem to be part of the superior classes of angels (e.g. in 1 Enoch, there are 1. Seraphim, 2. Cherubim, 3. Opannim (‘the Wheels of Ezekiel personified) and 4. the Watchers).

But the Watchers (or some of them) are also those identified as:

falling from heaven, led astray by the first 2 of 5 Satans – Similitudes of Enoch 69:4; 54:6 – Esp. Satanail entices the Watchers in the 5th heaven to revolt against God. This Satan will also later condemn and torture these same Watchers (54:3, 5).

some of the Watchers who fall are imprisoned in the 2nd heaven and others are cast to earth where they take human women (Enoch 7:3, 18:4) who bear giant offspring (the Nephalim of Genesis 6) – Jubilee 13:17-35; Testament of Reuben 5:6

Thanks for all the thoughtful replies - as for the slightly more cynical responses, I would say that the point to be gleaned from the OP regarding the fate of the Watchers, is that they taught us the art of war, medicinal techniques (cutting of roots, etc), and various other categories of knowledge which weren't inherently bad, but were in fact intended for humans to discover on their own. By teaching us before time, they screwed with the grand plan for the evolution of the human race, with terrible outcomes. We should take care to spot the plot points between the screens of information which roll throughout. Hope that makes sense - the pivot points on which the larger narrative depends.