US$2trillion a year to TERRAFORM the Sahara. Should we do it?

If America owned it then it may be worth it.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
If America owned it then it may be worth it.

It will be worth it for everyone... The question is not if, but when.

Currently humanity has a poor stewardship of fresh water. Just speaking for America, California and the great lakes are very mismanaged. We export a good amount of fresh water, taking it out of the cycle of natural perpetual motion for it's immediate ecosystem.

There is a concern areas that are rich in biodiversity will become desertified if we continue current practices, meaning we'll need to learn how to combat it sooner rather than later.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

It's not worth it for the US to spend $2 trillion a year for another country to own it.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: CriticalStinker

It's not worth it for the US to spend $2 trillion a year for another country to own it.

I think OP said 2 Trillion US dollars just so it was a currency for perspective.

That said, I don't think the US or any country would take on the full weight and scale of such a venture, nor do I think anyone would team up with the price point at that level.

Someone would have to have proof of concept on a small scale, figure out more efficient and fiscally responsible ways to do such a task.

But as I said, I think something like this, but not specifically this will have to be explored if we don't fix our fresh water consumption habits as they stand.

if we had normal people running things, i would be down for this.

hell, i would rather do this, spend 2 trillion on this, than warz.

but socciopaths not only are all running politiks, but they gravitate towards ALL positions of power.

so there are too many people on top, in prime positions of executives, that even if they came up with an awesome way to turn desert into oasis, they would ruin it, like with plastic palm trees that shoot out g6 phone waves.

The Sahara Desert has been slowly growing for many hundreds of years. Perhaps if we tried to reverse that trend more naturally and gave it a thousand years or so to work it would be far cheaper. There must be a process of natural secession from desert to grassland to savanna and finally to forests.

I would study the ecology first to determine what plants do best in the desert and how it transitions into green belts. Then encourage these areas to spread back out into the desert. This should be done where there is the best chance of producing rain clouds after it is Terra formed. I wouldn't suggest using any exotic species that may work faster then what is naturally already there. Try making the transition as natural as possible without the need of costly measures like diverting water, or if you did need such measures, only use them sparingly.

Here on the western side of Michigan we have dune lands that transition from pure blowing sand, to dune grass, to low growing shrubs and then to mature oak and pine forest. Yeah, the lake dunes aren't a desert by any means, but it is the type of secession I'm thinking of.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

I just meant I would not want the US to get involved if we did not own it. If we did own it, it may be a worthwhile investment. They did not say how long it would take.

People are already slowing doing this:

www.independent.com...

I remember a while back I found a story like this that actually had satellite images to back up the story. Sadly I could not find it. But you could really see a difference in many areas.

I also remember a story about a guy that went to Jordan (I am pretty sure) that turned several acres of previously un usable desert into fig and olive groves simply by digging ditches (or using existing ditches) and filling them with left over and dead scrub vegetation. That somehow made the dew collect in those areas making them have just enough water to grow those trees. The trees in turn provided shade that also kept moisture and allowed other plants to grow. It was really amazing.

I have also read that the great grain fields of Carthage were destroyed by ignorance of the muslim invaders. Since they were herding animals for food they had no concern for the farms of that area and allowed their animals to graze until there was no plant life left to graze.

So many weird ways we can be stewards of or destroy our environment. I think conservation education in the area of farming and wildlife are of the utmost importance.

More farmers please - and LESS LAWYERS....

And less gonad study majors please.

a reply to: MichiganSwampBuck

I don't think any plan that expects people to follow through for 1 thousand years is going to work.

I mean if you want it to stop raining in the Amazon go for it...the majority of clouds are "seeded" with sand grains from dust storms in the Sahara... those same sand granules are responsible the majority of the Potash in the soil as well.

so go ahead and terraform it and turn the amazon rain forest into a desert instead.

www.nasa.gov...

originally posted by: smkymcnugget420
I mean if you want it to stop raining in the Amazon go for it...the majority of clouds are "seeded" with sand grains from dust storms in the Sahara... those same sand granules are responsible the majority of the Potash in the soil as well.

so go ahead and terraform it and turn the amazon rain forest into a desert instead.

www.nasa.gov...

So here is a question for you. Is there any evidence that when the Sahara was green that the Amazon basin was not?

originally posted by: CriticalStinker

originally posted by: contextual
Egypt and the like are water poor, major cities struggle to cope as it is, terraforming deserts because, reasons, doesn't make much sense.
Maybe do Nevada and move homeless people there?

Part of the transforming efforts would require you use energy to desalinize water and flood the area. If you can do that with clean abundant energy, it wouldn't be too much of a problem.

The benefit would be after some years of success, the area would yield more fresh water because rain would be able to exist in the region without evaporating or running off quickly. One could even say the transpiration of vibrant vegetation might yield more rain for the region.

Then again, this is all theory... But once it meets a point of being economical, I'd love to give it a try some where.

This problem could easily be remedied cheaply by introducing large colonies of the fungus Eurotium Rubrum and perhaps suitable colonies of salt/mineral eating mushrooms.

a reply to: solve

Or doing rotating algae farms with sea water. Then skim and clean the salt for consumption. We could even use the algae for biofuel.

a reply to: TheRepublicOfCanada

Why would you do that? It'll just go back to being a desert as soon as you stop. 2 Trillion indefinitely? That's just insane.

No.

Fred..

US$2trillion a year to TERRAFORM the Sahara. Should we do it?

Why don't you spend it on the homeless or feces and needles in the streets of 'Murican cities?

ware does the Water come FROM!
rivers, under ground?
then what happens to the people and land they did use it on?
people are using to much water now.

IF! you take sea water and filter it, then its ok.
you will even lower the sea level! YAY!

hmm? so taking all the water from the land and under it??
no wounder the Sea is rising........

I watch a video from a post on ATS.
it was about the ground sinking!
because they are taking to much water from it.
and they just keep taking more.
any one know of it?

Found it! sinking 2 feet a year!! see the NASA one.

Sinkholes Revealed ATS
www.abovetopsecret.com...
Beijing's Consuming So Much Water The City's Sinking, youtube

Pumped Dry: Dry wells, sinking ground in Calf.
www.youtube.com...
California Community Slowly Sinking Into Ground
www.youtube.com...
NASA Study Shows Ground Sinking In California
www.youtube.com...

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Grimpachi

Nope, the material science and required tolerances is pretty much there with carbon nano thread, diamond nano thread to be specific.

What we don't have are production facilities and techniques to produce the stuff in mass quantities.

Plenty of things we could do, nevermind should do.

I think it was one of the NASA Shuttle experiments that showed the carbon fiber tether they drug threw the atmosphere about 20 years ago was burning up and may have sent an electrical pulse that damaged equipment. I recall it was a tether that was pretty long and when it was released was having a reaction that was dangerous to the Shuttle.

a reply to: Justoneman

Earth's ionosphere capacitance could be a valid component where power generation requirements of the lifting body that climbs the tether are concerned.

As to dangerous, space flight, nevermind extreme construction work exposes us to some of the most dangerous environments nature has to offer.

Just because something is dangerous doesn't mean we should not do it.

The shuttle was a darn death trap, as to its payloads, well those were rather admirable and then some.

a reply to: Justoneman

I think it was one of the NASA Shuttle experiments that showed the carbon fiber tether they drug threw the atmosphere about 20 years ago was burning up and may have sent an electrical pulse that damaged equipment.

The tether was not "drug threw the atmosphere." It was deployed "upwards" from the shuttle.

Because it was a long electrical conductor, an induced current was created as it moved through Earth's magnetic field. That was the purpose for the experiments. To see if it could be used as a power source. It could, but the Sun works just as well.

www-spof.gsfc.nasa.gov...