Originally posted by andersonr
I have heard that American troops would NOT shoot American people
if a Civil war was to occur in America...

American troops have shot at Americans in the past. It happened more than a few times during protests against the Vietnam war.

I have also heard that America has some 2 million + FOREIGN troops on herr soil who wouldn't think twice about shooting American people in the event of a civil war.

Heard that as well. Employed by FEMA or the UN. Hopefully others can confirm or deny.

Also Titor said 2005 Civil war would start but not become obvious until 2008

Titor stated that events would begin in 2004/2005, but we would not totally realize we were in a Civil war until 2008.

yeah your right, it was totally ungracious of me to speak up when you said the people who voted for Bush were dumb. Do you not remember saying that. It doesn't matter if you directly said it to me, because it was directed at me, and many other people. I wouldn't have even gotten into your conversation with that other person had you not said that those of us who voted Bush are dumb. However, i do know what the statistics say, but i will address that in a later post so i can get some sources for you. And if you dont believe that America doesn't already have a plan in place than you are sorely mistaken.

Originally posted by sosuemetoo
If everyone would start reading what he has to say, instead of wondering if timetravel is possible or looking at the cheesy photographs, I believe the disbelievers would come to a different conclusion.

JT is nothing more than political commentary meeting science fiction. It's been done before in the past, it will continue in the future.

JT's fax to Art Bell in 1998 where he mentions a missing skyscraper.

Could you post that. I think we'd all like to see it. (On every John Titor site it says he started posting in 2000, I haven't seen anything anywhere prior to that date. Where did this '98 fax come from?)

Cern's recent announcement.

What does that have to do with time travel?

Hawking's changing his mind and agreeing with JT

Hawing has said time travel is possible but not neccessarily practicle. Noe exactly agreeing with JT

No WMD found in Iraq

"The Arab countries appear to have weapons of mass destruction. Do they use them against America?"
JT - Not against America but they are used against each other.

100,000+ people dying

Titor never mentions or even references the tsunami. And he doesn't mention 100,000 people dying, he mentions 3 billion dying.


Back to the issue of time travel -
1. Energy.
The amount of energy needed to a) creat a black hole and/or b) travel faster than light and/or c) create negative energy is just not available.

2. Stability.
Even if you do manage to create that much energy, how do you keep stable? This basically amounts to creating the amount of energy needed to power the sun here on earth. I'm not sure that's a good idea.

3. Control.
Ok say you were able to harness that energy and keep it stable and say you jump into the black hole/worm hole. How are you going to control where you go? It's simply not possible.

4. Survival.
Since we have no way of knowing how such a trip can and will affect your boday, how do you know you will survive? How do you test this?

5. Where are they?
If time travel were possible, people from the future would know this thread exsists and will come to confirm. I'm looking around now....nope no time travellers

Originally posted by greenturtle
The measure of a man is their decency in victory - not defeat

Not to discredit your statement earlier. I actually agree with a large portion of it. However, I think you got your quote backwards. It should read.

'The measure of a man is not in their victory, but in their defeat' - MLK

"A police state is a state with police powers"
hmmm....ok. Name one country without a police force. Name one country with 300 million people without a police foce. Name one country that doesn't need a police force. I can't think of one.
By your definition every country on the planet is a police state.

Read: A POLICE STATE is a STATE with POLICE POWERS

Now, a state with a police force is not a state with police powers

If you still don't understand, which I suspect you won't(bush mentality) the difference is between a police force with the powers of prosecution and a police force that has to go through a system of checks and balances through a fair judicial hearing.

POLICE FORCE - CHECKS And BALANCES = POLICE STATE POWERS

A state where the power is centralized with the state, has absolute power, and thus has police state powers.

Now, a democracy is where the power dynamics are shared between the state, there are civilian third parities involved and a system of checks and balance to minimize possibility of abuse.

This is why the Patriot act was devised. Your King Bush said it himself in the presidential debate. In the old system, they had to go through many procedures to arrest and prosecute a suspected terrorist. Now, to circumvent that process, the patriot act has given the police absolute power to do what they want.

That is a police state. Nazi Germany was a police state. Sure enough, the behavior of the police towards people, is that of a police state. As wisdom tells you "absolute power corrupts" The police are perpetrating these brutalities against people, only because they can - Bush supporters think they are our "friends" there is quite a dreamy - pie-in-the-sky topic by a Bush supporter on this forum. Check it out.

As for which constitutional rights are taken away.

You can get shot by the police on suspicion
You can be detained indefinitely
You can be relocated in camps outside of US
You can get arrested without a warrant
You can be prosecuted without a judicial hearing
You can be searched without a warrant
You can be imprisoned as a terrorist for dissenting against state
You are are liable to death penality for any federal crime punishable by 1 year+

You're a smart one aren't you. Read our constitution then get back to me. Read the PA then get back to me.

These are from your PA. Are you telling me this is false, because if you are, please say so. It will give me another opportunity to show you up for the nth time.

Real information. Unfiltered and not propagandadized.

From CNN? Please tell me some of this information.

You're a complete moron if you think that type of stuff goes on everyday. Man, one of my pet peeves is stupidity and you're really pushing that button. If you have something like that happen more than once a decade it's a shocker.
Get real man.
It's ok for the US not to be as evil as you're trying to make it.

Do you know what is very telling about how apathetic(and pathetic), irresponsible and sheep-minded you Americans are. Even, when something like WACO happens, you don't do a thing. You just turn an uncaring blind eye. You should be ashamed of yourself. What a pathetic excuse for a human.

And when I show you real stories of 9 years olds getting tasered, armoured tanks and special ops attaking neighorhoods, accountants being kept in chains and filthy conditions at airports, family dogs getting shot for no apparent reasons(and the owner still getting a ticket for leaving her dog of the leash) and children getting shot - You are not going to condemn your state, that such events should even happen and happen so frequently. You're going to make excuses about how they are not common events or how the police were justified.

You know what, if you had any courage, any intelligence and any compassion for your people, the first time something like WACO happened, you should have been out there in arms. You don't do this, because you're mindless sheep, and Titor is right, half of you should be dead.

You can be herded anywhere, made to think anything, that the state wants you too. You have no individuality and no soul. You a part of a herd of sheep. To put very simply, you are pathetic excuses for humans, and you quite simply suck.

And then for a herd of sheep minds, who let such atrocities happen to their people, to critize "liberals" for ending the atrocities, and then ask me "How do you which side is better" I know, because I'm not brain dead like you.
I know, that if I put my hand in the fire, it will hurt, so I don't do it.

No, I am getting all this information from reliable media sources and US media sources itself.

"reliable" like prisonplanet?

Yes, prisonplanet is very reliable, as it is a collection of independent and state media sources. I actually don't read the perspectives by Alex Jones, because they are biased. I just use this site to link me to other news sources, which include: Washington Times, Los Angeles Times, The Telegraph, London Times and other established media sources. Prison planet has nothing to with them.

LMAO!!!
Good one!

I pity you if you actually believe that. I hope you never find the truth, it may be too much for you to handle.

So, do you think Moore is telling lies or all the people who were interviewed and all the footage was hoaxed? If that was the case, he would have been indited for fraud, and not be winning film festivals.

wow, just wow.

This is something you Bush supporters say, when you can't deal with the reality of things, a bit like your own very baeeaa.

Have you even been to the United States? I honestly doubt it. Until you've been here for a substatial period of time you views on how the US populace is , means NOTHING.

I would not come to your country, even if I won a free trip to it.

The typical show of mentality I have seen by a Bush supporter in this forum.

Again, I'm hoping this is a joke, no?

What type of menality am I showing btw? I asked a question (which, again, you failed to answer).

I said the typical mentality of a Bush supporter on this forum. Then you said "what mentality am I showing" should I take this to mean you are a Bush supporter. It would make a lot of sense.



[edit on 15-3-2005 by Indigo_Child]

Originally posted by Ryanp5555

-America is the most powerful nation on Earth
-Bush is the leader
-Bush was re-elected by the majority
-The people who didn't vote Bush were typically the lower class/impoverished/college students.
-You claim that people who vote Bush are dumb
and to restate my first point and 3rd point
-Bush WAS re-elected
-America IS the most powerful Nation on the Planet.

I am surprised you did not have "America is god's chosen country" in that list. What is more stupid than a Bush supporter, is a Bush supporter who is a Christian fundamentalist.

Next order of business..... Indigo_child, you rock. If I knew how to rate you for the way above award, I'd do it.

Thanks, to vote a member for above topsecret award, underneath their name, near the bottom, you will see the words "ignore" in red and below that "Wayabove" in blue. Just click on the blue link to cast your vote.
I am not saying this to get a vote by the way

I was not aware that Hawking had commented on Titor. Do you have some more information, links on this?

[edit on 15-3-2005 by Indigo_Child]

At the risk of being warned...

Indigo Child, you were just being a fool, now you're being an a - hole.
We're talking about Titor so why are you wasting everyone's time with your anti american bullsh*t?
You're starting to really get pathetic now.

1. Get off that Bush supporter crap. I never said that. I never even alluded to it. So just stop. You're making yourself look stupid.

2. America is not a police state. Never has been. Get over it. It's not designed to be one.
"Police Powers, Police Powers".
lol, what an idiot. You have no idea what our police are and aren't allowed to do. For a country of this size, name one country that has better police?

Please tell me some of this information.

lol, why should I tell you anything?
1. It wouldn't concern you, as you aren't American.
2. You wouldn't believe me anyway.
3. CNN is liberal leaning. Why do you keep mentioning it?

Even, when something like WACO happens, you don't do a thing. You just turn an uncaring blind eye. You should be ashamed of yourself. What a pathetic excuse for a human.

You're a fool. How the **** do you know what we're thinking? You don't. You can't even pretend like you do. So don't even start with this crap. You should be ashamed for posting something as idiotic as this.

half of you should be dead.

Wow, wishing for the deaths of over 150 million people. You're a bright one. And you're supposed to be better than us? HA!
What about the stuff that goes on in your country. Worst stuff that happens here. Why aren't you all up in arms? What about around the globe? America can't even compare to some of the stuff that goes on. Yet YOU turn a blind eye to that, to bash America?
Why?
You've never been here, so why the hostility for something you don't know about?

who let such atrocities happen to their people, to critize "liberals" for ending the atrocities, and then ask me "How do you which side is better" I know, because I'm not brain dead like you.

Just a note: Waco and all that crap. Happened under Clinton. A liberal.
You may not be brain dead, but you're not very smart.

So, do you think Moore is telling lies or all the people who were interviewed and all the footage was hoaxed? If that was the case, he would have been indited for fraud, and not be winning film festivals.

You don't understand hollywood then.
And yes, there is alot of stuff that Moore tells you that is false.

I said the typical mentality of a Bush supporter on this forum. Then you said "what mentality am I showing" should I take this to mean you are a Bush supporter.

Which is what exactly?

Anyway.

-----

I was not aware that Hawking had commented on Titor. Do you have some more information, links on this?

Hawking would never waste his time even commenting on Titor. He just changed his views on time travel. He went from not possible to just not practical.

Wow, I never thought to read such a small minded, completely bigoted post on this site. Read through your post with the slight editing that I have made and then take the moral high ground.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child

If you still don't understand, which I suspect you won't(BLACK mentality) the difference is between a police force with the powers of prosecution and a police force that has to go through a system of checks and balances through a fair judicial hearing.

POLICE FORCE - CHECKS And BALANCES = POLICE STATE POWERS

This is why the Patriot act was devised. Your King Bush said it himself in the presidential debate. In the old system, they had to go through many procedures to arrest and prosecute a suspected terrorist. Now, to circumvent that process, the patriot act has given the police absolute power to do what they want.

That is a police state. Nazi Germany was a police state. Sure enough, the behavior of the police towards people, is that of a police state. As wisdom tells you "absolute power corrupts" The police are perpetrating these brutalities against people, only because they can - BLACK PEOPLE think they are our "friends" there is quite a dreamy - pie-in-the-sky topic by a BLACK PERSON on this forum. Check it out.



These are from your PA. Are you telling me this is false, because if you are, please say so. It will give me another opportunity to show you up for the nth time.

Do you know what is very telling about how apathetic(and pathetic), irresponsible and sheep-minded you BLACK PEOPLE are. Even, when something like WACO happens, you don't do a thing. You just turn an uncaring blind eye. You should be ashamed of yourself. What a pathetic excuse for a human.

And when I show you real stories of 9 years olds getting tasered, armoured tanks and special ops attaking neighorhoods, accountants being kept in chains and filthy conditions at airports, family dogs getting shot for no apparent reasons(and the owner still getting a ticket for leaving her dog of the leash) and children getting shot.

You are not going to condemn your state, that such events should even happen and happen so frequently. You're going make excuses about how they are not common events.

You know what, if you [BLACK PEOPLE] had any courage, any intelligence and any compassion for your people, the first time something like WACO happened, you should been out there in arms. You don't do this, because you're mindless sheep, and Titor is right, half of you [BLACK PEOPLE] should be dead.

You can be herded anywhere, made to think anything, that the state wants you too. You have no individuality and no soul. You a part of a herd of sheep. To put very simply, you [BLACK PEOPLE] are pathetic excuses for humans, and you quite simply suck.



This is something you BLACK PEOPLE say, when you can't deal with the reality of things, a bit like your own very baeeaa.

Have you even been to the United States? I honestly doubt it. Until you've been here for a substatial period of time you views on how the US populace is , means NOTHING.

I would not come to your country, even if I won a free trip to it.

The typical show of mentality I have seen by a Bush supporter in this forum.

Again, I'm hoping this is a joke, no?

What type of menality am I showing btw? I asked a question (which, again, you failed to answer).

I said the typical mentality of a BLACK PERSON on this forum. Then you said "what mentality am I showing" should I take this to mean you are a BLACK PERSON. It would make a lot of sense.

Seems obvious to me that you are a rascist pig.

Well its fairly obvious that Titors predictions dont go well with the supporters of the current regime in USA, as well as the local patriots, and its understandable why.

In my opinion USA is already a police state, only it is all done metodically so a common person doesnt see it, becouse its all done in the name of "security" and "anti-terrorism". Good job by the way, it obviously works.

One cannot ignore the civil unrest that is going on in the USA, nor can one ignore the lack of media coverage of it, as US media serves as the propaganda machine for the government. But the opposition that is sick and tired of the current situation is definately getting stronger.

So in my eyes it has already begun...

now is he a time traveller or just a clever hoaxer?

I certanly dont know, but the predictions are clever and at least some of them will most probably come true, the American civil war being one of them in my opinion. Its just a matter of time before people put their foot down and say no more, regardless of John Titor, its not him thats #$%$ things up, its the US corporations milking the world in the name of US citizens

As I have said in my other Titor threads....

if Titor is real then he was from a different dimention/universa, a different time line.

Therefore this time line is different.

Now the question should all ask if you believe in Titor is.... What differs from our universe and the universe Titor was from...

As for the patriot act and the UK's Anti terrorist Laws.... Honestly.... If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to worry about.

Neon Haze.

Change is Inevitable.

Originally posted by Neon Haze

As for the patriot act and the UK's Anti terrorist Laws.... Honestly.... If you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to worry about.

Neon Haze.

Change is Inevitable.

Honestly, i hope you are right, but there are plenty of people being picked on already only becouse of their nationality and race. They are guilty until proven innocent.
I have relatives in Chicago, they are muslims from Bosnia, they are all nice and hardworking people, just bought a house, yet they get house visits once in a while.... questions about how they feel in the USA, hows work, money problems, visitors...and such. I agree its not something horrible (so far), but i wonder how far it will go, especially if another 911 happens

Just be carefull what you say out loud and you should be OK

some freedom.....

Come on, TJW, be honest with me now. Are you a Bush supporter
or not?

2. America is not a police state. Never has been. Get over it. It's not designed to be one.

]

You can only say it, not prove it. Yet, I can actually prove it, logically and with evidence. That's the difference between ignorance and knowledge.

lol, why should I tell you anything?

You said, you get your information from unpropogandised and unbiased sources. When I ask you to give me an example, you refuse to give any.
Again, the difference is between ignorance and knowledge. At least I can "show you the money" so to speak

You're a fool. How the **** do you know what we're thinking? You don't. You can't even pretend like you do. So don't even start with this crap. You should be ashamed for posting something as idiotic as this.

I don't care what you're thinking. I never said I knew what you're thinking. What I care about is your actions, and as far as I know you did nothing about WACO. Those, who did, were labelled as liberals and anarchists and therefore they should not be taken seriously.

In your country anyone who has any courage to speak against wrong is subdued by your society. The sheep become the sheepdog. So, what do you advocate, that people just take it all lying down or just ignore it, like you are doing. I just wonder what you are doing at a web site whose motto is "deny ignorance" everything you say is ignorant.

I am sorry, but those "liberals" are the only people who have worth in your society. At least they actually do something. At least they have the courage to speak. These are the real citizens of your country and it is they who will revolt to get their voices heard. While the rest of you do nothing at all. You are lazy, civically ignorant, arrogant and stupid(to borrow a few terms from Titor)

You know I am not surprised that Titor said in 2036 people hate you. They have every reason too. You don't do anything at all. All you do, is mouth off. Your identity is not based on yourself, but on the identity of your country. You are hopelessly deluded.

Wow, wishing for the deaths of over 150 million people. You're a bright one. And you're supposed to be better than us? HA!

I am simply agreeing with what Titor said. If you are not going to do anything for your country, then what worth do you have?
If, because of you, 9 year old girls are getting tasered and people are being thrown into camps, then what worth do you have?

I don't think you're any different than the Germans in Nazi Germany in the past.

I don't wish you were dead though. I wish you the best of luck. It is the universe that will decide whether it wants to keep you or not. It's natures balancing mechanism.

Just a note: Waco and all that crap. Happened under Clinton. A liberal.
You may not be brain dead, but you're not very smart.

You obviously haven't read my previous posts on the truth of government in US.

Let me illustrate to you: Kerry(Bones) or Bush(Bones) = x(Bones)
It's called a win-win situation.

You have never been a free people. You are just a hopelessly deluded people given an illusion of freedom, which you lap up.

You don't understand hollywood then.
And yes, there is alot of stuff that Moore tells you that is false.

What does Moore's documentary have to do with "Hollywood?

Oh, and can you actually mention the "alot of stuff that Moore tells you that is false" or is this another opinion of yours that you can't and won't substantiate.





Don't kid yourself mate. There are people in your country, the real patriots, who are not going to let their freedom be taken away like this, and let the state bully them. They are going to fight. There's your civil war.

And if you are so ignorant to think that there aren't people in your country who don't have the courage to speak, or the family members of the 9 year old girl who was tasered, won't demand justice, then you are more deluded than I thought.

Everytime the state transgresses against a citizen, it create many enemies. When the state transgresses against you. You will also become the enemy.

It's just that so many of you are self-serving and selfish. It won't matter to you, what happens to others. You lack human empathy. However, when it happens to you, then you will care and believe you me, you will also become a victim of the state and a "liberal"

Yet, why does it have to be like this. Why does it have to happen to you, before you will accept it even exists? Where is your empathy, morals? Don't you know, that you sow is what you reap. The sooner you understand this, the better, because the opposite is going to be a much harder wake up call. You are sowing regrets and that will propogate into something very thorny.



The point of this topic is Titor and his civil war, and I have provided enough evidence to show that his scenorio is indeed possible. I don't draw any pleasure in bashing Bush supporters, so I am willing to cease hostilities. Nothing personal. It's just your idealogies that I oppose.

I am not calling you arrogant, ignorant, stupid, apathetic and pathetic. Just the idealogies that you espouse.

[edit on 15-3-2005 by Indigo_Child]

What does Moore's documentary have to do with "Hollywood?

It wasn't a documentary, it was an editorial and that is why it wasn't eligible for any awards as a documentary. Come to America, stay with me for a week or two (I live in LA). you'll see that even though we don't agree with everything our government or neighbors do, we get along with each other pretty well.

You'll see that while what we have isn't perfect, it is a far cry from a police state.

Edit to put it back on topic (SORRY!)

I think that his whole concept of an urban vs. rural civil war is ridiculous and over simplified. I personally don't see anything that could cause a widespread civil war. I can see some smaller acts of frustration, but I don't see them fanning out in the common ideal of a nation at war with itself.

Heck, if nothing else, the rural people have all the guns so it would be a short one ;-)


[edit on 15-3-2005 by Marid Audran]

maybe this thread should be moved to some sort of political forum!

Cern's recent announcement.

What does that have to do with time travel?

Because Titor said that company are the ones that built it!

johntitor.com at least read something before you post.

LOL, I think just paraphrasing will be enough

"I live near the White House, and I can see it out of my window, therefore if US was a police state, I would be the first to know"

That makes so much sense, that I am still trying to make sense of it!

but that's one unfortunate event.

A 9 year old girl get's tasered:

"Oh, it's just one unfortunate event, poor girl, she will get over it. Let's move on now, nothing to see"

A psychiatric paitent stunned to death:

"Oh, it's just one unfortunate event, poor man, he will get over it. Let's move on now, nothing to see"

Dozens of men, women children get burnt down alive in a military operation:

"Oh, it's just one unfortunate event, poor people, they will get over it - oh wait they're dead. Let's move on now, nothing to see"

A neighborhood attacked by armoured vehicles and special ops

"Oh, it's just an unfortunate event, poor people, they will get over it. Let's move on now, nothing to see"

This is why people in 2036 could hate you. This is why Titor, a supposed time traveller would call you "civically ignorant sheep" This is why he say "half of you should be dead"

You know what, memorise this "but that's one unfortunate event" and use it sparingly everywhere you have to answer to people. It will greatly unburden the thinking load. You know, that chore you Bush supporters call "thinking"

By the way, it's so obvious you're a Bush supporter. You can see that from the very moment you open your mouth to speak(technically, to type) You just have not admitted it, because it's conceding too much to me, considering I found you.

[edit on 15-3-2005 by Indigo_Child]