The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor

Exactly Glyph!

TJW, if you think a civil war can't happen in the US, go debate your point on this thread maybe you'll learn something..

Titor defined a civil war by armed group entering in conflict, of course, that's the definition most people would give of it. Some people think the US is in a form of cold civil war, with militias preparing themselves more and more. Militias are not stupids, they see what the government is doing, just like Hezbollah prepared themselves for all those years to resist Israël. I'm pretty sure militias right now since they woke up, that they are making more concrete plans, more training, more arms...

Also, Titor said that the armed conflict would be nation-wide by 2012.

And I suggest that Russia attacked the US because they though that they could win because of the desorganisation due to the civil war, that they could wipe out most of the nuclear sites before being crushed... if they thought that, they were wrong.

[edit on 31-5-2007 by Vitchilo]

Originally posted by Glyph_D
revealing a civil war is to take place is not specific. he did not state how the civil conflict would begin. there are a hundred reasons why he would have refused to reveal 911, the most important is to "not" give us the opportunity to remove it from our timeline.

BS. Why would you not remove it? Titor stated we could stop the Civil War (which is 1000000x worse) so why not stop 9/11?

911 is the only(openly admitted) reason all the BS across the globe is taking place.

Exactly, all the more reason to warn us about it.

im wondering if you meant to say "timecop"?? MR was about psychics.

I'm talking about the concept of knowing something before hand and doing something about it.

this is wrong according to titor. titor states the "nature of time" removes the effectiveness of corruption. so policing is not that big an issue due to that fact that if a change was to take place it would be of another timeline and not of the original.

Problem is...Titor is fiction.
Also crime is crime, no matter where it occurs. More in a sec.

titor states(thru context) that a 1-2% divergence is the maximum allowance for a successful return, anything more would create an entirely different timeline(ie very risky).

He never states anything like this.
He states that he can never go back to his original timeline (which is more realistic as you just can't get rid of the paradoxes)

Let's say 9/11 occurs on timeline A. 50 years later time travel is discovered. Person goes back (still on A) and prevents 9/11. That person's A is now forever changed (as he went back on A and prevented something on A) and is now B.

If this person on timeline A goes back and when he does, ends up on say timeline C, then there's no need to do anything as there's no evidence to suggest 9/11 will occur on C. He can warn people all he wants, but it's likely 9/11 wasn't going to happen on C in the first place. If each timeline is unique and there are infinite timelines, the chances of you hitting one just like yours is beyond slim.

and im sure that if this is the case, this thought experiment would be provided in a manual to discourage any rogue attempts at time altercations.

lol
Like just having something in a manual is going to stop people

Vit:

TJW, if you think a civil war can't happen in the US, go debate your point on this thread maybe you'll learn something..

Oh please!
The OP suggest that because according to his links the middle class is declining that a civil war will start up. There are soooo many things wrong with that line of thought I don't know where to begin.
Probably the most glaring thing about that is that......it's not based on ANYTHING is history. The poster assumes Americans are just going to start killing each other over nothing. The first civil war and the years leading up to it showed us that is hardly the case. During the depression we were in a MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH worse situation than we are now. Did we just start killing each other then? NO.
The whole middle class, that is another thread by itself. Middle class is so loosely defined and has so many categories, getting hard core facts take time.

Also, Titor said that the armed conflict would be nation-wide by 2012.

Nah, he said by 2008. Which is just 6 months from now.
I can guarentee you that's not going to happen.

I will say one thing about Titor.
If he was a hoax, he knew the future... His 2008 date is on the money.

Why do you say that Fowl Play?

I do not know wether Titor is genuine or not, but if he wasnt he had the powers of Nostradamus, that is all i will say. If i were a betting man, i would say Titor was genuine, i just dont think he told the whole truth.

Originally posted by Fowl Play
I do not know wether Titor is genuine or not, but if he wasnt he had the powers of Nostradamus, that is all i will say. If i were a betting man, i would say Titor was genuine, i just dont think he told the whole truth.

You're still not explaining what you're talking about.
So far NONE of his predictions have come true. We're supposed to be 3 years deep into a civil war right now.

Titor said most would feel they had a civil war on their doorstep by 2008. Titors dating is pretty accurate. And his predictions....well, the significance will be shown by the end of this year, definitely by next.. this thread will be up and running still then, we will see. Also, i said i dont think he told us the total truth, i dont believe he could. Through study, i believe Titor already changed history, that means the percentage divergence in the timelines would have increased.. we are nolonger in the same timeline.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
BS. Why would you not remove it? Titor stated we could stop the Civil War (which is 1000000x worse) so why not stop 9/11?

titor stated it was "possible" for us to change/prevent the coming future. however he also stated that he believed the comin events are very important and should not be tampered with. which is way he concealed as much as possible, by stating "youll know when it happens".

911 is the only(openly admitted) reason all the BS across the globe is taking place.

Exactly, all the more reason to warn us about it.

he did warn us, but he did not give us the data to prevent.

Problem is...Titor is fiction.

i highly opinionated statement:/

titor states(thru context) that a 1-2% divergence is the maximum allowance for a successful return, anything more would create an entirely different timeline(ie very risky).

He never states anything like this.
He states that he can never go back to his original timeline (which is more realistic as you just can't get rid of the paradoxes)

you do realize you just reiterated what i had stated right? yes.. you can not go back to your timeline, but you can go back to a timeline that is 1-99% divergence. choosing the 1% is the closest thing to returning to your timeline.

Let's say 9/11 occurs on timeline A. 50 years later time travel is discovered. Person goes back (still on A) and prevents 9/11. That person's A is now forever changed (as he went back on A and prevented something on A) and is now B.

wrong (but its a small error) if the said traveller went back through time he would then and there create timeline B. if he prevent 911 he would do so on B, timeline A still exists however it is no longer possible to return to it. while on B one could travel back to before the 911 prevention took place, creating C. timeline C will have a 911, becuase the intervention from your previous jump has been stricken from the timeline, from here it is possible to jump forward to your original date/hour to have a low divergence % (C), the only event that is diffent from timeline A to timeline C is the low divergence of your presence from your jumps. all the things you did in timeline B still exists but it is now lost to the ether of time, and can not be found again (through timetravel).

If each timeline is unique and there are infinite timelines, the chances of you hitting one just like yours is beyond slim.

all timelines are connect though timetravel. every jump you make is connected to the previous timeline in some fashion(direction of travel dictates this connection). the chances you hitting a timeline of 1-2% divergence is very basic and not trivial. NOTE: it appears you see timetravel as dimensional portalling? if this is the case you must change your way of thinking. timelines should not be seen as alternate dimension, they can be categorized as such but they have a few things that omit it from that genre.

lol
Like just having something in a manual is going to stop people

have you been in the military? manuals run the show in that world. if you dont go by the book you will be chastised, and to further this it is common procedure to test subjects who have good scholastic skill to ensure the book is up held. they would not allow someone of poor credentials to timetravel in the first place.

vitchiloAlso, Titor said that the armed conflict would be nation-wide by 2012.

Nah, he said by 2008. Which is just 6 months from now.
I can guarentee you that's not going to happen.

actually he stated by 2011(by 2012 for sure) open conflict would be prominent, remember thats when he was a part of a shotgun militia. 2008 is not a date of open conflict, its the date everyone realizes this world is a lie.



[edit on 31/5/07 by Glyph_D]

Originally posted by Glyph_D
titor stated it was "possible" for us to change/prevent the coming future. however he also stated that he believed the comin events are very important and should not be tampered with. which is way he concealed as much as possible, by stating "youll know when it happens".

So we should go along with everything becasue HE thinks it's ok?
Doesn't work like that buddy, lol

he did warn us, but he did not give us the data to prevent.

Got a quote?

i highly opinionated statement:/

Based on facts

you do realize you just reiterated what i had stated right? yes.. you can not go back to your timeline, but you can go back to a timeline that is 1-99% divergence. choosing the 1% is the closest thing to returning to your timeline.

Misread your statement....

You assume you can choose or control the divergence. Why?
And when there are an infinite amount of choices, do you realize how huge just 1% is???

Let's say 9/11 occurs on timeline A. 50 years later time travel is discovered. Person goes back (still on A) and prevents 9/11. That person's A is now forever changed (as he went back on A and prevented something on A) and is now B.

wrong (but its a small error) if the said traveller went back through time he would then and there create timeline B, any change made would exist in timeline B.

?? This is basically what I said.
Yeah, he creates B when he gets there. He travels back on A though. He has too, as B doesn't exsist until he travels back.

the point im makeing is it is possible to exit timeline B and enter a new timeline(C) that is a 1-2% divergence of A.

Huge difference between possible and likely.
What do you think the chances are of you somehow ending up on a timeline just 1-2% different given there is no limit in the amount of choices? And again 1-2% is still HUGE.

all timelines are connect though timetravel. every jump you make is connected to the previous timeline in some fashion(direction of travel dictates this connection). the chances you hitting a timeline of 1-2% divergence is very basic and not trivial. NOTE: it appears you see timetravel as dimensional portalling? if this is the case you must change your way of thinking. timelines should not be seen as alternate dimension, they can be categorized as such but they have a few things that omit it from that genre.

What?

have you been in the military? manuals run the show in that world. if you dont go by the book you will be chastised

Chastised by who? If you're not returning to your timeline you can do whatever you want.

and to further this it is common procedure to test subjects who have good scholastic skill to ensure the book is up held. they would not allow someone of poor credentials to timetravel in the first place.

You know good and well this isn't foolproof.
They do this just about everywhere but bad seeds have always and will always slip through the cracks.

actually he stated by 2011(by 2012 for sure) open conflict would be prominent, remember thats when he was a part of a shotgun militia. 2008 is not a date of open conflict, its the date everyone realizes this world is a lie.

lol
Read Titor again buddy.
He clearly states the war (and he described what he meant by war) would be on EVERYONE'S doorstep by 2008.

And what? You think a shotgun infantry is just going to spring up overnight? And since they have a shotgun infantry it's obvious they have real infantries as well. That takes organization and time buddy.
The reason he didn't join before was because he was a LITTLE KID! (he joined at 13 - which is BS. Who would do that to a kid that age? Who's parents would allow that?)

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird

So we should go along with everything becasue HE thinks it's ok?
Doesn't work like that buddy, lol

do i agree with his decision to withhold information? im not sure, but what is sure is "he" felt it was for the greater good. and seeing is hes the one with the info, it does work that way.

i highly opinionated statement:/

Based on facts

what facts? you have yet to show any:/

You assume you can choose or control the divergence. Why?
And when there are an infinite amount of choices, do you realize how huge just 1% is???

yes.. you can dictate the divergence(through discretion). there are not infinite choices of timelines, there are infinite possibles of timelines. the percentage is not a ratio of the total possibilities, the ratio is based on the previous timeline you came from.

example>

A--->B can equal 1-99%
B--->C can equal 1-99%
A--->C can equal 1-99%

rationally you should not stack the divergences through your travels. becuase the method is based on (general)difference not absolute difference. if you wanted to record time through your method(im assuming) youd have to determine when/what timeline is the original(becuase this one might not be the original), and chronicle all divergences there after(certainly an impossible task). to save brain power our time would be accepted as the control in all calculations.

?? This is basically what I said.
Yeah, he creates B when he gets there. He travels back on A though. He has too, as B doesn't exsist until he travels back.

ok, i got a wiff of alarmism from your wording, my apologies

Huge difference between possible and likely.
What do you think the chances are of you somehow ending up on a timeline just 1-2% different given there is no limit in the amount of choices? And again 1-2% is still HUGE.

i answered this above but ill illustrate even further what im getting at.

when you travel back through time your create a minimum of .0000...001% divergence. every action that you perform creates an increase in that divergence, some action create larger yields than others this value can not exceed 99.9999999...999% becuase it is connected indefinitely to the previous time. for instance breathing will create a low divergence, however blowing up a building full of people will create a large divergence.

if the traveller wishes to return to his timeline, he will have to create the lowest divergence possible(by preventing his involvement with the current timeline); to a point where all the changes that did/will take place do not alter his accepted timeline. he will be forever denied access to his original time, but he can create a timeline that has no noticeable differences from hiw timeline.

Chastised by who? If you're not returning to your timeline you can do whatever you want.

thats right. if you choose not to return you are free and clear. that why i said policing would not be that big of an issue.

if i had one question to ask titor it would be something that addresses this very point. i would ask him could teamB join teamA on timeline B? my logic says no... due to the tearing of timelines. if they could then policing time can be done, if a traveler doesnt return when specified a snatch team would be dispatched to retrieve lost property. if this could be done(again i dont think it could be) much of titors claims are bunk after that:/

... they would not allow someone of poor credentials to timetravel in the first place.

You know good and well this isn't foolproof.
They do this just about everywhere but bad seeds have always and will always slip through the cracks.

this is true but it can be maintained to lower any collateral damage. i would assume they would only choose people who have no desire to leave their current timeline. someone who is very family oriented would refuse to stay away from their loved ones. these types of people would play by the rules becuase they want to come back. but yes bad seeds would slip through eventually.

And what? You think a shotgun infantry is just going to spring up overnight? And since they have a shotgun infantry it's obvious they have real infantries as well. That takes organization and time buddy.
The reason he didn't join before was because he was a LITTLE KID! (he joined at 13 - which is BS. Who would do that to a kid that age? Who's parents would allow that?)

2008 is when the conflict is at everyone doorstep, not open fighting. i did not say 2011 is when open fighting starts, i said its already begun "by" that date. you do know what militias are right? they are designed to spring at a moments notice(ie. very little time). if a war broke out, i would want my child to know how to survive(through fighting if necessary).


soon is the final cut off point for titors family to witness an unjustified search and seizure of their neighbors house, which leads then out of urban life.




[edit on 31/5/07 by Glyph_D]

Hmm... thinking about Terri Schiavo and the Constitution...

www.iht.com...
Man wakes up after 19 years in coma in politically altered Poland
The Associated Press - Published: June 3, 2007
WARSAW, Poland: A Polish railway worker who woke up after 19 years in a coma is learning to live and to understand a politically altered Poland, Polish media reported.

"I'm much better," Jan Grzewski, 65, was seen saying on TVN24 Television. "I could not talk or do anything, now it's much better," he said in a weak but clear voice, lying in bed at his home in the northern city of Dzialdowo.

"I wake up at 7 a.m. and I watch TV," he said, with a slight smile on his face. Despite doctors' advice that he would not live, his wife Gertruda never gave up hope and took care of him at home....

a few 'events' for your perusal...


Source: www.lewrockwell.com...

...

Police then lied to a judge, claiming they had actually purchased drugs at the Johnston house, acquired one of those once-rare "no-knock" warrants, and violently battered down the reinforced metal door of a private home where there were no drugs.

Miss Johnston fired a warning shot at the unknown people busting down her door. That bullet lodged in the roof of her porch, injuring no one. Police replied by firing 39 rounds at her, hitting her five times, and wounding each other with another five rounds – though they lied and said they’d been shot by Miss Johnston.

They then handcuffed the old woman as she bled to death on the floor, and searched her house. Finding no drugs, they planted three bags of marijuana.

Next day, the cops picked up one Alex White, an informant, advising him that they needed him to lie, saying that he had purchased coc aine at Johnston’s house. White refused, managed to escape, and went to the media with the story.

Last month, two of those officers pleaded guilty to manslaughter – in deals which helped them escape murder charges – and now face more than 10 years in prison, after authorities demonstrated they lied to get their warrant.

Greg Jones of the Atlanta FBI office said at a news conference that the FBI is investigating "additional allegations of corruption that Atlanta police officers may have engaged in similar conduct."
...

isolated incidents again?

Meantime, a black man named Cory Maye was still sitting on death row in Mississippi, the last I heard, because he heard men trying to break into his Prentiss, Miss. home late at night in December of 2001, where he was alone with his 18-month-old baby daughter.

Mr. Maye, who had no criminal record, got the child down onto the floor and lay down beside her to protect her. When one of the men finally broke into the bedroom, Cory Maye shot and killed him.

The man was hit in the abdomen, just below his bulletproof vest, and died a short time later. It turns out the man who had failed to knock and identify himself before breaking in was a cop, who was really after suspects in the other half of the duplex where Cory Maye lived. Turns out the cop was the white son of the white chief of police.

could any (or all) of these 'events' considered a threat to freedom and peace in the US? can you see now that arguing whether JT was honest or just an insider or psychic just plain misses the point?! these attacks have all the potential to instigate a civil war, imho, sooner than you think and more violent that we can imagine.

So whats the general consensus on this? HOAX or REAL?

So whats the general consensus on this? HOAX or REAL?

Great post Long Lance.

It get's even worse. Titor's world rapidly unfolding itself indeed..

www.bloomberg.com...
Russia Will Target Missiles at Europe, Putin Says

June 4 (Bloomberg) -- Russia will target missiles at Europe if the U.S. goes ahead with a planned deployment of anti-missile installations near Russia's borders, President Vladimir Putin said, warning of a new arms race.

"If the U.S. nuclear potential extends across the European territory and threatens Russia, we will be obliged to take countermeasures,'' Putin told journalists from Group of Eight countries, according to a transcript posted on the Kremlin's Web site today. "Of course, we'll have to select new targets in Europe.''

Putin said Russia could use conventional missiles or "completely new systems'' to counter the U.S. shield. This would trigger an arms race, he said, though Russia wouldn't be responsible for starting it. Russia hasn't targeted Europe with missiles since agreements in the 1990s formalized the end of the Cold War, said Pavel Felgenhauer, an independent defense analyst based in Moscow.

english.chosun.com...
Putin: Russia Will Retaliate if the U.S. Puts Rocket Base in Europe

Updated Jun.4,2007 21:06 KST - Russian President Vladimir Putin says his country will aim its rockets at European targets if the U.S. goes ahead with plans to build a missile defense system in Poland and the Czech Republic.

In an interview before his trip to the Group of Eight summit this week in Germany, Mr. Putin says Russia is not responsible for what he calls the "new arms race [that] is undoubtedly brewing in Europe." He brushed aside assurances that U.S. interceptor missiles will not be aimed at or intended to threaten Russia.

The Kremlin leader says the planned missile shield in Poland and the Czech Republic will put "an integral part of the U.S. nuclear arsenal" on Russia's doorstep and upset the world strategic balance. In response, Mr. Putin says, Russia "naturally" will point its own nuclear weapons at U.S. military sites and other locations in Europe.

Whoa!?
I thought I replied to you Glyph, but I don't see my post...


man, it was a lot too....

I'll try to remember what I wrote, and post it in a bit. But for now I'll just say I see what you're trying to say, there's still issues though (which I'll address later)

Originally posted by Glyph_D
2008 is when the conflict is at everyone doorstep, not open fighting. i did not say 2011 is when open fighting starts, i said its already begun "by" that date. you do know what militias are right? they are designed to spring at a moments notice(ie. very little time). if a war broke out, i would want my child to know how to survive(through fighting if necessary).

We're obviously not talking about petty militias here. He says he's in a shotgun infantry which means they're an organized army. How else would they be able to fight off the most powerful military in the world?
And have you ever seen a conflict with no fighting???? Titor clearly states what he meant by war.


Roth:

Titor's world rapidly unfolding itself indeed..

This is clearly not Titor's world buddy. Even Titor stated so



(but more importantly, Titor is a work of fiction)

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
Roth:

Titor's world rapidly unfolding itself indeed..

This is clearly not Titor's world buddy. Even Titor stated so
(but more importantly, Titor is a work of fiction)

Yeah, you are the expert of denial, but even you cannot deny this anymore. Russia is indeed strengthening its muscles and its NOT looking good. Yes, Titor's world is coming into our reality.. rapidly.. whether we like it or not..

Edit: All the more reasons to keep an eye on Israel and its self-destructive Prime Minister Ehud Olmert (hint)

[edit on 4-6-2007 by Roth Joint]

sorry I'm late, had a bachelor party this weekend

update;

the calendar has turned again.

Can the titorettes kindly submit their evidence for May 2007;

organized troops engaged in combat on US soil, urban americans versus rural americans.

A Waco type event that got mainstream media coverage like elian gonzalez did, and how it was an escalation ("getting steadily worse") from the string of 40 other monthly events you have already cleary documented. Boy, that event must be pretty signifucant by now, maybe Bush ordering a million muslims burned at the stake ? ;-)

an example of the press comparing Abraham Lincoln to George W Bush in a positive comparison, pointing out that W is trying to unite the country

Originally posted by Roth Joint
Yeah, you are the expert of denial, but even you cannot deny this anymore.

Deny what?

Russia is indeed strengthening its muscles and its NOT looking good.

Not looking good for who???????
Russia's problems with Chechneya has shown us alot. Them flexing any "muscle" they THINK they have to Europe or anyone else is a JOKE. I suggest you do some real research into Russia and why they're doing what they're doing.

Yes, Titor's world is coming into our reality.. rapidly.. whether we like it or not..

lol
1. According to Titor, that's not possible.
2. What are you basing this on?



Glyph:

do i agree with his decision to withhold information? im not sure, but what is sure is "he" felt it was for the greater good. and seeing is hes the one with the info, it does work that way.

1. Do you even know who "he" is?? Such blind trust is extremely dangerous Glyph.
2. He could be a psychotic serial killer for all we know, and if that's the case of course he's going to withhold info. He WANTS people to die.

As I stated....doesn't work like that. Your gullibility and trust in random people on the internet is very scary.

what facts? you have yet to show any:/

??
You mean like the fact that nothing he said was original? The fact that absolutely nothing he said has come to past? The fact that these type of hoaxes pop up on the internet 24/7 and there's NOT ONE reason to believe him over the millions of others?
Those facts?

there are not infinite choices of timelines, there are infinite possibles of timelines.

What? That's the same thing...
If the multiple timeline theory is correct (likely not) then yes there would be an infinite amount of possibilities which means there are the same number of choices.

the percentage is not a ratio of the total possibilities, the ratio is based on the previous timeline you came from.

example>

A--->B can equal 1-99%
B--->C can equal 1-99%
A--->C can equal 1-99%

Once you go back. ALL possibilities exsist. Trying to go back to a timeline that's .00000....0001% different from yours is like trying to find a neddle in a haystack in the midst of a few trillion haystacks

when you travel back through time your create a minimum of .0000...001% divergence. every action that you perform creates an increase in that divergence, some action create larger yields than others this value can not exceed 99.9999999...999% becuase it is connected indefinitely to the previous time. for instance breathing will create a low divergence, however blowing up a building full of people will create a large divergence.

if the traveller wishes to return to his timeline, he will have to create the lowest divergence possible(by preventing his involvement with the current timeline)

Which is what I'm saying. Just you bringing a time machine into the past, that alone would create a large enough divergence that trying to get back to yours is impossible.

thats right. if you choose not to return you are free and clear. that why i said policing would not be that big of an issue.

No, that's why policing would be NEEDED. That's why you would need an army to try and keep the machines under wraps. Do you know what people would do for the ability to do whatever they want with no consequences??

Edit:
And yeah, SHP is right
Another month gone by!
Still waiting for that list......
Surely after 40 of these events, the secondary and alternative media would have reported on these events by now....

[edit on 4-6-2007 by ThatsJustWeird]

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
sorry I'm late, had a bachelor party this weekend

update;

the calendar has turned again.

Can the titorettes kindly submit their evidence for May 2007;

organized troops engaged in combat on US soil, urban americans versus rural americans.

Titor never said that "organized troops engaged in combat on US soil" would happen in May 2007. lol. However, he did say: "Outright open fighting was common by then and I joined a shotgun infantry unit in 2011."

So yes, within a few years from now the "# hits the fan."

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
A Waco type event that got mainstream media coverage like elian gonzalez did, and how it was an escalation ("getting steadily worse") from the string of 40 other monthly events you have already cleary documented. Boy, that event must be pretty signifucant by now, maybe Bush ordering a million muslims burned at the stake ? ;-)

lol. You keep on failing to see that Titor mentioned "having a Waco type event every month that steadily gets worse" because of ALL measures taken to justify the NWO builders set-up of their "War on Terror"..... (which is destined to end in 2012 with the initiation of the NWO!)
OPEN YOUR EYES!... "having a Waco type event every month that steadily gets worse"-situations EVERYWHERE in the US!......

Originally posted by syrinx high priest
an example of the press comparing Abraham Lincoln to George W Bush in a positive comparison, pointing out that W is trying to unite the country

If you deny that he IS NOT I could have called you a fool.... but ofcourse I will not say that to you...

Edit: saving my butt for another warning....

[edit on 4-6-2007 by Roth Joint]