The American Civil War of 2005 as predicted by John Titor

You can probably find a tool that will turn html into pdf. The John Titor story starts on this page if you're interested in doing this.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Civil war in 2006/2007 with the immigration bill? Likely.

Let us know when you finally decide to join the real world vit.


Becareful though, if you stay in your fantasy world to long you may actually start to believe it's real.

So the USA won't nuke Iran? LOL

Source
www.news.com.au...
www.inthenews.co.uk...$378534.htm
www.rawstory.com...

Mod Edit to shorten link

[edit on 9-4-2006 by Benevolent Heretic]

I can guarentee it.
If you're up for it, I'm willing to place a monetary bet.

(only for preemptive - if Iran somehow really does have a nuke and uses it, then of course we'd probably bomb the **** out of them. Even then it's not guarenteed we'd nuke them though)

Maybe not in a pre-emptive strike, but everything is possible with that crazy guy at the white house... But if as Iran said, retaliate with 5000 Shahab-3 on Israël if attacked, Israël will nuke Iran! So in the end Iran will be nuked.

[edit on 9-4-2006 by Vitchilo]

What do you think about “peak oil theory” and a possible connection with Titor ‘s “predictions?
I was very fascinated when I first read about titor some years ago, watching for signs which never came up, and I was also reading this thread regularly. As 2006 came close I started to believe it was a Hoax, until I came across a site about peak oil. Nothing extremely new for me, but the following text looked familiar…

“As the US economy begins to disintegrate, civil unrest may become increasingly violent and widespread. Each faction of the American body-politic will likely rally around reactionary political demagogues/movements who promise to bring back the good days by eliminating whatever domestic or foreign group(s) they have decided are at fault for the economic and geopolitical unraveling. Liberals will blame "Bush, Big-Oil and the Hard Right Neocons" while conservatives will blame "Bin-Laden, Big-Government, and the Extreme Left Environmentalists." The anticipation of massive unrest may be the real reason why the Department of Homeland Security has contracted with a Halliburton subsidiary to build massive new domestic detenetion camps. In 1985, the authors of Beyond Oil: The Threat to Fuel and Food in the Coming Decades, warned us of such possiblities:

A stagnant or shrinking economy will have a major effect on
society’s expectations. With few exceptions, each generation
in the United States has become materially better off than
the preceding one. This pattern of increasing wealth has
become an indelible part of the American Dream; a higher
standard of living than our parents is practically a birthright.
These expectations are the standard against which actual
performance is judged. During times of failed expectations, a
society is especially vulnerable to a person or philosophy
promising to restore it to its former glory. The fall of the
Weimar Germany is probably the best example.

As commentator Robert Freeman pointed out in 2004, the end of oil may result in the end of America as we know it."

Source:
www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net..." target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow"> www.lifeaftertheoilcrash.net...

Suddenly a lot of previously impossible predictions became clear. Titor described a post oil society as it is described by many pages about peak oil. Small communities, with localized production, enormous problems at product distribution, I am sure you remember about the importance of bicycle tyres! The current improbability of civil war – unrest in USA is easy to overcome, not through a metaphysical prophesy or through a Mayan scripture lost in the jungle, but with a rational analysis of the modern economy and the unavoidable fact of oil depletion. A probable future unrest of the west would not have a politic origin e.g. revolution, racial hate but it would be a result of “economic disintegration”. I can’t confirm about how solid is peak oil theory, I am not expert in this field, but is seems quite possible, it is supported with many statistical data, and also as a phenomenon it has partially happened before with the depletion of USA and Germany oil. For more information about peak oil check the above source link or any you like.
We can also understand the repulsion Titor showed to current generation, it is not just a broad moral - ethical judgement but an straight accusation for the results of our actions as individuals and nations (at least democratic ones), which actions are the over consumption and the support of the current irrational economy system, which will lead to the problematic post oil world described by Titor, through a troubled and bloody period.

So to play the role of Calchas, based on Titor and peak oil theory texts: USA knows the peak oil is imminent, no other reliable energy source is currently available, she makes the strategic choice to control military and/or politically the last vast sources of oil -> Arabia peninsula -> Iraq -> Iran -> other states Venezuela, Libya, Syria ->strong presence in central Asia through Afghanistan to keep an eye in the minor (compared to the previous) Caspian sea oil reserves. She succeeds BUT, there are two complications.
1. The “peak oil” takes place (2006-2010 which is not my prediction but the peak oil expectation) and The Great depression erupts, that makes old ones appear like exam problems for undergraduate students of economics. Read peak oil sites, to see why it is inevitable, because of the structure of modern economy (debts, eternal growth belief etc). Huge unemployment, poverty, famine, strikes the once super rich West countries, and it leads to civil unrest. But remember the oil isn’t extinct, there “are” still huge amounts available which are controlled by mainly the USA government and the West thus the elite and their guards (there is not enough oil for the masses anymore) which elite usually throughout history used to reside and find refuge, during troubled times, in the major cities. The rest are obvious, police state, crime, and sweep operations against militia gangs who try to loot cities provisions…
2. The hold of the last important resources of oil by USA and west leads to major international conflicts. Apart from the economic strangle of countries like China Russia India perhaps Germany France and Japan, imagine the extreme military power that such a condition gives to the US. To put it simple, you are the last one to possess the oil of the world during an extreme Global depression. The lack of oil for an army is like turning the time back to 1900 for this side, while you still can fight with F16, stealth etc. I think the gap of dynamic between the above two armies is greater than when Indians met the first Europeans in America. Well, unfortunately one thing still works without oil, I think you must have already guessed right: Nuclear weapons. So we can now interpret the mysterious nuclear attack against USA as the last resort to level – equalize the unprecedented unbalance of powers between the super powers of the future which was caused by the “USA foreign policy” of the last years. That’s why Titor never mentions anything about occupation of parts of USA because in a post oil world such thing would be impossible since large scale transportation would be extremely difficult. I cant recall any other similarities within Titor’s story it has been long ago since I have read it.

To anticipate those who will claim that I am a Titor fanatic, my impression is that the above Titor – peak oil connection has a contradiction. On one side it makes the predictions of Titor more realistic and possible but on the other makes the probability that he “was” a time traveller less possible. I don’t know when peak oil theory became widely available, for somebody to create a possible future outcome from it. It may be a good indication. So it is highly possible that a clever individual based on post oil era prediction based on peak oil theorists has created this mess That makes most of his predictions quite depended as a logical consequence on each other and not so genuine. For example if peak oil did happen, (it was predicted to happen 2005-2006) and depression erupted it is normal that Olympic games 2006 or 2008 want happen either. The same goes to civil unrest, stricter police measures and so on. Perhaps the only pure genuine evidence is the USA foreign policy about oil and the world war… I hope someone else can make a better connection. Another problem is that I cant think of another probable timeline where oil does not end, so as peak oil sites claim probability of peak oil 100%, and that is the most frightening…

Sorry for the long post it is a long thread anyway. I don’t know if anybody has already made this connection, Titorology isn’t my job and I have lost track of this thread 30-50 pages ago. Also sorry for my strange english and I am happy to be with you in ATS forum since it is my first post.

[edit on 13-4-2006 by Dorian_gr]

And with the war in Iran that is coming, the barrel will hit at least 100$ and maybe 250$, depending on how Iran will strike back. And according to many theories, there's only 2-3 years of oil left... so in 2008, there would be no more oil and we wouldn't have alternative energies... so HUGE MESS!!

And there is also talking of militias taking over the government to stop the nuclear war with Iran. There's also a high probability of a new 9/11 on US... and that people will come out with the truth that government did it.. There's the immigration law... There's the comet fragment that could hit earth and lead to a massive panic and unrest, with all those who believe it's a sign of the end of times...

So there is a lot of thing that will happen this year and hope it doesn't come true.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

possible connection to further show the demolition of the WTC

lol
Now that you spammed your post, tell us what this has to do with Titor?

lol not much actually i just figured it was worth a read. i dont usually do that but i was extremely bored yesterday as in refreshing the page.(i was sick so i couldnt go anywhere, leaving me to the computer...what a drag) thats why i was doing that, by half way through the day i was going practically insane. sorry for the spamming of threads.

Originally posted by Vitchilo
And with the war in Iran that is coming, the barrel will hit at least 100$ and maybe 250$, depending on how Iran will strike back. And according to many theories, there's only 2-3 years of oil left... so in 2008, there would be no more oil and we wouldn't have alternative energies... so HUGE MESS!!

And there is also talking of militias taking over the government to stop the nuclear war with Iran. There's also a high probability of a new 9/11 on US... and that people will come out with the truth that government did it.. There's the immigration law... There's the comet fragment that could hit earth and lead to a massive panic and unrest, with all those who believe it's a sign of the end of times...

So there is a lot of thing that will happen this year and hope it doesn't come true.

Although it is not the right place to analyze it, peak oil -> depression doesn’t need an extreme theory of complete oil depletion in just 2-3 years in order to happen. a steady drop in production will do the work. Also a war in Iran might increase the prices but temporarily, like 1973. it has to be more global and cataclysmic, only peak oil theory can "offer" that.
About the militia my bet is that Americans will not make a civil war for just pacifist ideology, and of course it is impossible for militia to win the US military. Even Titor never claimed that they have won by themselves, and what he described seemed more like outlaws trying to survive and perhaps loot the rich when they had a good chance. Of course people (even when they are telling tales) tend to idealize and create ideology for the winners and history is written by the winners.

You are right about this year being hot, let’s hope that sanity will prevail.


[edit on 15-4-2006 by Dorian_gr]

I was bored too and I decided to look precisely quotas of Titor describing post oil society, and other indications mainly about the oil generated crisis. I searched my files and found a collection of Titor’s posts, I am not sure if it is complete or accurate. If something is wrong please tell me.

There is no large industrial complex creating masses of useless food and recreational items. Food and livestock is grown and sold locally

Life is much more rural in the future but "high" technology is used to communicate and travel. People raise a great deal of their own food and do more "farm" work. Yes, compared to now, we do work long hours.

People spend more time talking because life is more centered on the community. I've noticed the same type of effect here when the power goes off. People tend to come out of their homes and actually spend time with their neighbors.

Banking is based mostly around the community structure. There are no multinational banking or computerized economic systems. There are also no income taxes.

There is no real organized health care.

Most power generation is localized. It amazes me how much power is wasted now. Yes, solar is big.

Like everything else, music is much less centralized. The general trend is away from "computer generated" music and more toward real people playing real instruments.

Water is produced on a community level and we do eat meat that we raise ourselves.

(The society described above, is very similar with post oil societies described by peak oil sites about post oil future)

1. Do not eat or use products from any animal that is fed and eats parts of its own dead.
2. Do not kiss or have intimate relations with anyone you do not know.
3. Learn basic sanitation and water purification.
4. Be comfortable around firearms. Learn to shoot and clean a gun.
5. Get a good first aid kit and learn to use it.
6. Find 5 people within 100 miles that you trust with your life and stay in contact with them.
7. Get a copy of the US Constitution and read it.
8. Eat less.
9. Get a bicycle and two sets of spare tires. Ride it 10 miles a week.
10. Consider what you would bring with you if you had to leave your home in 10 min. and never return.

(Almost identical advices can be found in survivalist’s peak oil sites)

Hydrogen fuel cells and more efficient solar cells are big deals.

One school may emphasis farming while another teaches woodworking.

No, the ice caps are not melting any faster than they are now. There is also far less smog and industrial waste in 2036. (no more burning of fossil fuels at large scale)

5. Does anyone know what industry is the largest US political contributor? (oil companies??)
6. Does anyone know who owns the majority of the solar power research and development companies? (oil companies again??)

8. What is the longest distance you ever ran and/or walked at one time without stopping? ( OK there is a civil war, does it mean that rebel forces can not have cars?)

The family work we did was picking, sorting and shipping oranges by sailboat up and down the coast of Florida. ( Again why a simple machine for the boat , especially before the nuclear war would be so strange?)

How do you think the rest of the world would react to the U.S. having a time machine and they didn't? (replace time machine with oil)

As for the printing technology in 2036, you may be surprised at how many people use typewriters

I have noticed more people in California are installing wood burning stoves.

Computer printers just didn't work very well on 12 volts and many people just got used to doing things the old way. After the war, the main problem was distribution. Can anyone tell me how many companies in the United States still manufacture bicycle tires today? Anyone who still has a bike in 2008 will find out.
(Major contradiction, Why after the war 2015, distribution is the problem while you need bike tires as soon as 2008? Only if oil was available before the war just for the rich and the government, so most people used to do things the old pre oil way)

From the age of 8 to 12, we lived away from the cities and spent most of our time in a farm community with other families avoiding conflict with the federal police and National Guard. By that time, it was pretty clear that we were not going back to what we had and the division between the "cities" and the "country" was well defined. My father made a living by putting together 12-volt electrical systems and sailing "commodities" up and down the coast of Florida. I spent most of my time helping him.
(It doesn’t seem much of a civil war but middle to lower class people trying to organize a new life style according to the new situation of a world without cheap oil.)

What's wrong with typewriters? At least you don't have to plug them in.

Being a superpower only makes you a target

In my opinion, people "now" take clean water, electricity and their feeling of safety for granted.

"Most" publicly generated power is through very efficient solar cells. On a local or household level, there is steam, hydro and inversion generation.

I can't help but think about that experiment every time I see someone stranded on the highway or walking on the side of the road carrying an empty gas can

However, I already know you won't pay any attention or believe me because we've already been through it on this worldline. Besides, I think the walk to the gas station will do you some good. (second time mentioned)


A while ago, I related an experience I had with my parents while we were driving down a highway. Every now and then, we would pass someone who was in obvious distress with their vehicle. I was amazed that so many people could pass them by without stopping to help. Their explanation was fear. The risk of helping someone was too great and with today's technology, they probably had a cell phone anyway. If they didn't, the walk to a gas station would be good for them and teach them a lesson for running out of gas.(third time mentioned, after all that was the reason of the war civil and world, running out of gas)


Bring a gas can with you when the car dies on the side of the road.
Farewell.
John

(Logically it is Titor’s last post, no need to highlight anything, I think it is obvious)

Common sense points to Titor based on peak oil predictions (during 2001 it was claimed to happen 2004-2006) mixed with survivalist ideology, already known modern physics theories and accepting the hypothesis of USA going after the world oil, created this nevertheless great tale. Even if some sort of civil war – unrest takes place in the following years because of peak oil generated depression, that doesn’t prove that he was a time traveller because he could easily have copied those predictions, already made by “peakoilists”. I am not sure who made this, chronologically first, Titor or peak oil theorists, it seems the second to be more possible. Also the fact that he didn’t mention straightforward the peak oil and depression (despite this being the core of the problems), is rather suspicious, because people could read related texts and find the overwhelming similarities. (although I don’t know if such texts existed at large at that time, he could have read a few or perhaps he was a “peakoilist” too).
Instead he concentrated on a vague post war ideology of the winning class. This can be seen in two ways. A) He wanted to avoid getting into details and instead he was trying to promote his political ideology whatever it was. B) He was truly from that timeline. Such behaviour is expected from people having been through such a conflict and hardness. They tend to explain with ideological terms the conflicts even when the conflicts have pure materialistic origins (oil, economic depression in this case). Many examples can be found throughout history. He appears not like a distance future historian analyzing a past clash, but like someone who has actively took part in what he narrates, so his descriptions are biased, and highly ideologically emotional. And that is the strongest evidence in my opinion that he could have been a time traveller, or he role-played genuinely and extremely well.

After all those contradicting thoughts, I can’t think of The ultimate test for Titor being a time traveller or not, except perhaps the nuclear world war in the next decade, although under the prism of peak oil explanation it doesn’t seem so mysterious anymore as I have described it, in a previous post. If all or most of the events (peak oil – depression – civil unrest – nuke war) take place, even not close to the dates he stated that would make him a great foreseer but not necessarily a time traveller. Of course a possible discovery of time travel after a few decades will make this clear but it would be insignificant at that point.

So I think the whole “problem” of Titor and the frightening future he described can be transformed into “is peak oil theory and its consequences, an imminent reality or not?” The exact date doesn’t matter it can be tomorrow or after a few years, modern economy and oil prospect is chaotic enough in one worldline, they don’t need a bunch of them. And that’s a whole “new” story.


[edit on 16-4-2006 by Dorian_gr]

Originally posted by Dorian_gr
I was bored too and I decided to look precisely quotas of Titor describing post oil society....

Dear Dorian,

I am a "Titor researcher" as well and I think it is fascinating to observe the Bush Administration becoming so overly aggressive nowadays...threatening Iran with a Nuclear attack....
www.newyorker.com...
THE IRAN PLANS

and Israel's participation in this game...
www.israpundit.com...
Iran Will Destroy Israel, Unless We Act

Hamas... Hezbollah... getting more and more support from their sympathizers…
www.news24.com...
Qatar gives $50m to Hamas
www.upi.com...
Iran pledges $50 million to Hamas
www.frontpagemag.com...
And back in February, 2006, Ahmadinejad showed just what he really thought of his “partners” at the United Nations when he told a gathering of Hezbollah, Hamas and other radical Arab leaders in Tehran that the UN “can pass resolutions until they are blue in the face", according to a report in the Wall Street Journal.

Interesting, just as you, I can see we are heading for “Titor’s world” and rapidly indeed…

There’s another interesting read which has slipped my attention for a while. It’s another alledged ‘timetravelling’ guy/girl? with the name “Upharsin” claiming to be from 2023. However, this person is/was using Titor as a reference and came up with some very interesting predictions. I am still not sure what to think of it, but reading your message I had to think about it.

www.paranormalis.com...

UnExpecte

Originally posted by dbates
You can probably find a tool that will turn html into pdf. The John Titor story starts on this page if you're interested in doing this.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

all you have to do is show file extensions and change the extension from .html to .pdf

Check out this You Tube Video. Shows you how much of a police state we are.

www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by srev2004
Check out this You Tube Video. Shows you how much of a police state we are.

www.youtube.com...

What an incredible video! Great job!

Here are a few very important words from that video, to never forget:

Whoever controls the world’s oil, controls the worlds market....

....It was on the 11th of September 1990… that George Bush senior (then President of the US) made a speech to a joint session of Congress announcing his Government’s decision to go to war against Iraq… the US Government said that Saddam Hussein is a war criminal….a cruel and military despot….. who has committed genocide against his own people….. that’s a fairly accurate description of the man…

In 1988…. Saddam Hussein raised hundreds of villages in Northern Iraq… and used chemical weapons and machine guns to kill thousands of Kurdish people…

Today we know that that same year…. the US Government provided him with five hundred million dollars in subsidies…. to buy American fund products…

The next year… after he had successfully completed his genocidal campaign…. the US Government…. doubled his subsidy… to one billion dollars….

It also provided him with high quality germ seed for anthrax and helicopters and new used material that could be used to manufacture chemical and biological weapons….

So it turns out that while Saddam Hussein was carrying out his worst atrocities…. the US and the UK Governments were his close allies…..

So what changed?….

In 1990… Saddam Hussein invaded Kuwait….. his sin was not so much that he had committed an act of war…. but that he had acted independently…. without orders from his Master…..

This display of independence was enough to upset the power equation in the Gulf…..

So it was decided that Saddam Hussein…. be exterminated….like a pet… that has outlived his Owner’s affection…..

UnExpecte

*yawn*
Where's Roth?

He may have been wrong, but at least he tied Titor into his posts (this is a Titor thread after all)

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
*yawn*
Where's Roth?

He may have been wrong, but at least he tied Titor into his posts (this is a Titor thread after all)

I knew you love him. He missed you isn't he? So if nothing happen this year or till 2008 for hardcore titorists, well, Titor was off the track...

Originally posted by Vitchilo
I knew you love him. He missed you isn't he?

Wow. Please have mercy on the English language, it's been tortured enough!

I miss Roth because, despite them being horribly wrong, his rants and arguments were organized and centered around Titor. You all are just ranting random stuff.