Police chiefs ask US to waive immunity for envoy's wife in crash.

Anna Sacoolas has finally been charged with causing Harry Dunn's death by dangerous driving.

Snippet from the Times.

An extradition battle between Britain and America has begun after the wife of a US diplomat was charged over the death of a teenage motorcyclist.


Seven weeks after receiving a file on the case, the Crown Prosecution Service said that she had been charged with the most serious driving offence, which carries a maximum sentence of 14 years in prison.

The times article about the charge.


Link to the article in the Sun newspaper.

....but let's see if she get's extradited! It carries a term of 14 years I believe

Rainbows
Jane

a reply to: EvilAxis

I have heard her husband works for the NSA.

originally posted by: Jason79
a reply to: micpsi
a reply to: alldaylong

It's up to the prosecution to prove a crime took place, and left hand vs right hand driving likely caused the accident.

Well, the police has now charged her with dangerous driving
www.bbc.co.uk...
and the Crown Prosecution Service has asked the American authorities to extradite her. It is highly unlikely that this will happen as it was the American embassy that advised/ordered her to return to the USA immediately, declaring diplomatic immunity despite being only the wife of an American intelligence official.

originally posted by: micpsi
It is highly unlikely that this will happen

It's an extradition process, so legal. Doubtlessly questions of her diplomatic status will be explored and exposed.

Here's the Treaty

1. An offense shall be an extraditable offense if the conduct on which the offense is based is punishable under the laws in both States by deprivation of liberty for a period of one year or more or by a more severe penalty.

Basically, in the US is driving dangerously an offence?

a reply to: paraphi

Basically, in the US is driving dangerously an offence?

Yes, it is.
If you kill someone while doing so, or cause them to be killed because of your negligence, you are charged with manslaughter at least.
The US needs to turn her over pronto.

originally posted by: butcherguy

The US needs to turn her over pronto.

Boris Johnson has done the British family no favour by declaring on TV that he thinks this is very unlikely to happen.

Yesterday evening another diplomatic vehicle from RAF Croughton was filmed being driven on the wrong side, causing the oncoming driver (with dash cam) to brake.



Chief Constable Nick Adderley said he was, "aware of another incident in Northampton in which a police vehicle was struck in early October by a vehicle also driving on the wrong side of the road." Again it was a diplomatic vehicle from RAF Croughton.

a reply to: EvilAxis

This is going to happen when you have thousands of Americans who learned to drive on the other side if the road.

No training will stop people from making a mistake. Maybe its time for the UK to move to driving on the right like most of Europe. Short of that i dont think they will find a solution. Also would make vehicles cheaper in the UK as well since they would be able to buy vehicles sold in Europe

a reply to: dragonridr

Not a realistic suggestion, unfortunately.

The Brits just voted to come out of the EU. Are they going to say, "these foreigners don't know how to drive safely on our roads so our taxes should be used to redesign all the motorway and other intersections, reverse all the traffic lights, change the road signs, repaint the lines on the road, modify the buses, move the bus stops... and then the steering on all our vehicles will be on the wrong side!"

There is no simple solution.

Clearly there are risks associated with driving on the side to which you're not accustomed, especially as you age and your brain becomes less adaptable. You have to take extra pains, especially at the start of a journey.

I wonder how many accidents are caused in this way by Brits driving in Europe and vice versa.

Allowing those who cause such accidents to escape prosecution doesn't help.

a reply to: dragonridr

Why should the millions of drivers in the UK change just because some American muppets can't adjust? The World doesn't have to adjust to what America does.

The easier solution is for visitors to a country to learn to abide by the laws of the host nation like everyone else does.

a reply to: dragonridr
That point should have been something to be taken into consideration in a court of law.
The real issue is that the woman was acting dishonourably in escaping scrutiny, and the American authorities are acting dishonourably to the extent that they collude with the evasion.

a reply to: Jason79
Jason, I'm British but I know a few americans I wouldn't mind running over on the wrong side of the road, claiming it was just an accident, I simply made a mistake I'm used to the left hand side of the road you see. I mean in your world, we can all do that yeah? Want someone dead? Get em on the wrong side of the road guys!

originally posted by: dragonridr

No training will stop people from making a mistake.

That's why we have driving tests and licences. If someone is unable to remember what side of the road they're meant to be driving on, they shouldn't be driving at all.

We're not going to spend billions re-doing the road system and all vehicles in the UK because of very rare tragedies like this that are purely the fault of a person not driving with a complete lack of due care and attention.

a reply to: Kurokage

I agree very much with your thoughts, but hasn't anybody told you that we Americans are above the law?

We are a nation led by war criminals, and the consumers of this nation see themselves as special in the world, as instructed by their leaders.

We don't "do" the International Criminal Court, and we don't prosecute the criminals in government.

Utterly immoral, no doubt, but that's where Donald and his predecessors have taken us.

The US have refused extradition providing no evidence for the denial of justice.

Pompeo has made the false claim it would 'rendered diplomatic immunity null and void', the US State Department have made the false claim that she was immune from all criminal jurisdiction while in the UK.

The UK have labelled it a disappointing decision and denial of justice. The family are putting pressure on Boris Johnson to take drastic action for the US 'lawless administration taking wrecking all approach to one of the greatest alliances in the world'.

Time for Boris to play hardball and threaten to close all US spy bases in the UK until she's extradited and the US stops considering non-diplomats above the law, otherwise more innocents will be murdered if the US get away with this.

a reply to: bastion
Two options I would consider are
Appeal to the Supreme Court (extradition is supposed to be a legal matter)
Begin the squeeze more slowly by expelling families of embassy staff, "in the interests of the safety of British citizens". Then the heads of the State Department might come under some internal pressure.

The trouble is that Boris will be in the middle of negotiating trade agreements, and will be reluctant to press the Americans too hard.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Agreed, in reality I think the government will kowtow to the US admin and they'll be allowed to abuse the 'special relationship' as usual. It's such a fragrant abuse of the law and insult to the family and the UK with the US offering no evidence or grounds for the refusal that it can't be allowed to happen uncontested.

Legally speaking now we're out the EU all families of US personell can now be expelled on national security concerns given the US's refusal and claims families of US personnel are above the law as US personal can no longer claim EU 'right to a family life' human rights.

I think the family are waiting until the current US admin is replaced before going to both the Supreme Court to seek her trial in the US and seeking extradition to the UK again.

ETA: It's the first time in history the US has refused extradition to the UK, first time no evidence, reason or legal basis for the refusal to extradite has taken place.

UK have announced it's urgently considering it's options and numerous videos of US personel driving on the wrong side oof the road around bases have been released.

The local Chief Constable is visiting the base to have an urgent chat with the head of RAF Houghton.

I wonder if the UK will now refuse thee US extradition request for Assange as the US refuses to follow extradition law?

originally posted by: bastion
ETA: It's the first time in history the US has refused extradition to the UK, first time no evidence, reason or legal basis for the refusal to extradite has taken place.

They were notoriously unwilling to extradite IRA people. Of course that was in the days before 911, when they still thought of terrorists as freedom fighters.

originally posted by: DISRAELI

originally posted by: bastion
ETA: It's the first time in history the US has refused extradition to the UK, first time no evidence, reason or legal basis for the refusal to extradite has taken place.

They were notoriously unwilling to extradite IRA people. Of course that was in the days before 911, when they still thought of terrorists as freedom fighters.

Good point. In most cases of IRA bombs it was the US supplying the explosives.

The comment was made by the family lawyer - did a bit of sleuthing and turns out its under a 1995 treaty granted all US staff and their families immunity from prosecution and diplomatic status despite not being diplomats, however that immunity only applies in the UK and now she's in the US she is no longer protected by the diplomatic immunity clause.

Raab has spoken to the US ambassador emphasizing the need to remove diplomatic immunity from family members and re balance the US-UK treaties and extradition process and the FCO have said she has no diplomatic immunity which is a good start.



Trump's response to the US decision is 'it's common for Americans in Britain to have difficulty driving on the left side of the road' - TWAT.

Maybe the Brits should just "drone" her.