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A focused discussion of the .416 Cal Barrett weapons platform

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posted on Oct, 3 2019 @ 11:18 PM
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This post is for a discussion about the Barret .416 caliber weapons system. What you will find here is information on the Barrett .416 ammunition and some of the choices for weapons built to work in this caliber. It includes some images, a discussion of the reasons for Barrett in it's development of this round and some of of the offerings as far ammunition types and suppliers as well as some about reloading these rounds. This I feel is important because training with any of the bigger rounds like this can become a very expensive hobby. If you are already trained on this weapons platform I hope you will provide us with some user first hand experiences.

I have fired the .416 Barrett but do not yet own one. I thought I would share some of my research into this subject while I save up the money to invest in this weapons platform.

The reason for Barrett to develop this .416 caliber is 2 fold. It was designed in response to a request for a medium/heavy rifle cartridge combination that was issued from Naval Surface Warfare Center Crane Division in late 2004.

The reason that most are familiar is the California law changes that happened under Governor Schwarzenegger. He was set to require that at first they would all require registration of all 50 caliber BMGs with the state. It ended becoming an outright ban of course.

Sales in California went through the floor as you might imagine. No crimes had ever been committed using the 50 Caliber BMG so this was strictly a move by Arnold out of paranoia in the opinion of many. I am guessing that at some point he thought that owners of these weapons or those who might steel one from its owner might use one to go and thin out the limorat population in the state since the 50 BMG is effective for anti light armor roles. That is my guess anyway. What happened was Chris Barrett, son of Ronnie Barrett, with the help of Pete Forras designed the .416 using some NACA low-supersonic-drag equations to design the shape.

The .416 has proven itself to be a superior sniper and anti-sniper weapon and is widely adopted by law enforcement agencies world wide for this role replacing the .338 Lapua which has outstanding exterior ballistics but is not up for taking those very long shots. The 416 does not have the anti-armor abilities of the 50BMG but as you can see in the video I will place within the OP it certainly still has some use in that role. Next lets compare the basic data on what sets the .416 to the 50 caliber.

.416 Barrett next to the 50 cal.

As you can see the sheer size and weight of the 50 cal is a great deal larger than the .416 round.

This ammunition is offered in both solid copper for training and also in solid brass. Wildcats abound but shooting reloads will void the warranty of many of the rifles built for the .416 so you are stuck paying about $7 for the copper rounds and about $11 per round for the solid brass cersion which has the best exterior ballistics in this caliber right out of the box from the Barrett company and their dealers.


This is the brass offering for this round.

Now lets cover the weapons in this .416 caliber. The round was built for the Barrett M99 A1 which was built specifically for this round. These rifles start out in the $3,850 range and are built by Tombstone Tactical.

From the manufacturer
Barrett 99-416 Single Shot 416 Barrett 32" Black Black Bi-Pod 13303

Action - Single Shot
Barrel Length - 32"
Description - Bi-Pod
Finish/Color - Black
Caliber - 416 Barrett
Grips/Stock - Black
Manufacturer - Barrett
Manufacturer part # - 13303
Model - 99-416

For that kind of money you get a rifle that has about the same kick as a good quality battle rifle chambered in the very popular .300 AAC Blackout. This due to the inclusion of the very large muzzle break you see in the above image as well as a good buffer spring internally and some recoil lessening features in the included stock.

This for me puts purchasing one of these weapons out more than a year for me and so I started looking at the low end of the rifles built for the .416 round. I wanted something with a 32 inch barrel and a decent muzzle break and shock absorbing features to lessen the wear and tear of a long range day. I am not a youngster any more so it takes a little while to recover for me now.

For these reasons price and function I think I am going to go with Noreen ULR .416 which is not too far out of my budget costing about $2,380. I can purchase a lot of ammo and other kit for it with the $1,470 I will save and i can get started training with it a lot sooner.

As you can see from this image the Noreen ULR .416 is simple in design.

This rifle like the M99 A! from Tombstone Tactical was build for this caliber. It is not a bad offering in my view but it fires the .416 Barrett rounds just as sure as the more expensive offerings. The video below shows some of the power of this round while the video authors have fun blowing right through about a 2 inch thick bullet proof glass panel.



Banning the .50 BMG inspired the creation of this BETTER rifle.

some more images of the Noreen ULR .416 rifle.

ULR_Left__416Barret


Noreen-ULR-Rt-2400USD


In a future post to this thread I will discuss reloading the .416 since the OP has run on a bit longer than I anticipated. Happy hunting shooters.



edit on 10/3/2019 by machineintelligence because: added content




posted on Oct, 3 2019 @ 11:22 PM
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So is this development sort of a civilian version of an anti-material rifle? The weapon has that look.

Cheers



posted on Oct, 3 2019 @ 11:33 PM
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Great topic:

Anything Ronnie Barrett makes is worthy of discussion.

In the case of the .41 it is a very accurate and reasonable rifle especially in states that have banned the 50 cal. I'm not sure you could make the case that its better or worse in terms of accuracy or ballistics as there are way to many factors to consider.

Make no mistake its a killer over watch weapon.

I have fired a 50 cal rifle, but not the 41 as there are very few ranges in my area that allow anything above a 338



posted on Oct, 3 2019 @ 11:43 PM
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a reply to: F2d5thCavv2

It does not have the armor penetration of the 50BMG but will punch through thick bullet proof glass or a 3/8" AR500 steel plate target at 300 meters. It will also have shooters making 1 mile head shots under the right conditions and accurately placing rounds on a man sized target out to 1.5 miles. This round will not drop below supersonic out to about 1.6 miles. The very popular sniper weapons in the .388 Lupua starts tumbling and yawing at about 1,600 yards by comparison. It does not have the energy at 1.5 miles to do much damage to hardened targets but at 1,000 - 1,500 meters hiding behind your vehicle is not much cover against the .416 Barrett.


edit on 10/4/2019 by machineintelligence because: entry error



posted on Oct, 4 2019 @ 01:34 AM
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a reply to: machineintelligence

Thanks. So that tracks with what I was thinking. Modern AMRs, if I understand correctly, are very similar to the antitank rifles of the early years of World War II. The antitank role is gone, but they're great for destroying something like a piece of radar gear or a truck packed with electronics. The weapon you're highlighting here should be easily capable of destroying anything without real armor plate.

Cheers



posted on Oct, 4 2019 @ 03:29 AM
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a reply to: machineintelligence

Well done on the OP!

The .416 family of cartridges has an interesting evolution. Barrett was far from the first to experiment with it.

The very first .416 cartridge was the .416 Rigby, originally created in 1911. It fired cordite instead of smokeless powder. Later the cartridge was modified to fire smokeless powder. It was originally created as a dangerous game caliber.

The next generation of .416 cartridges started out as a 'wildcat' round by necking down a .458 Win Mag. This resulted in the .416 Taylor. The idea was to create a dangerous game cartridge which would cycle in a standard Mauser magnum rifle action. Standard rifle actions were much lighter and therefore easier to employ from heavy cover.

Later Austrian Horst Grillmayer created the .416 TYR which had superior ballistics at the time. The .416 TYR is strikingly similar in size and case dimensions to the .416 Barrett. The case diameter of the .416 TYR was a custom whereas the case diameter of the .416 Barret is based off of the .50 BMG. In fact, the .416 Barrett is a wildcat of the .50 BMG, having been shortened and necked down.

All that said, Barrett is onto something with the .416 Barrett. Whether they lucked into it by playing around with the .50 BMG, or whether they planned it from the get go, the .416 has some pretty impressive ballistics. Here's a quick comparison...

The .50 BMG has a muzzle velocity of 2825 fps and a muzzle energy of 12,650 ft lbs.
The .416 Barrett has a muzzle velocity of 3250 fps and a muzzle energy of 9,430 ft lbs.

So the .416 Barret should shoot a little flatter than the .50 BMG.

Interestingly, there's another cartridge being developed off of the .50 BMG and it is also developed by Horst Grillmayer. This is the .460 Steyr. It too is a necked down .50 BMG; it is longer than the .416 Barrett so it will still require a .50 BMG sized action, but technically should comply with the .50 BMG ban. And, this puppy is a real hammer too!

The .460 Steyr has a muzzle velocity of 3,000 fps and a whopping 12,050 ft lbs of muzzle energy, on par with the .50 BMG.

ETA - Another cartridge you might want to look into is the .408 CT (or Cheyenne Tactical). 2900 fps and 10,630 ft lbs. It is currently being used by the Marine Corps. special forces guys overseas.

Size comparison for scale


edit on 10/4/2019 by Flyingclaydisk because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 4 2019 @ 04:17 AM
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a reply to: machineintelligence

Dangerously great thread.
Sako www.sako.fi...

Take your pick. All sighted in right out of the box.

S&F
You crazy bastard.



posted on Oct, 4 2019 @ 04:28 AM
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a reply to: machineintelligence

A wimp's weapon.

The world won't be free until everyone has open carry with running chainsaws and megawatt lasers.



posted on Oct, 4 2019 @ 10:33 AM
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a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

The .460 Steyr Seems to have evolved in much the same manner as the .416 Barrett. I have yet to fire one or even see one at any of the gun shows in Oklahoma or Texas that I go to. I live close to the border of those 2 states out in the boonies. Lots of private ranges around so I get the opportunity to shoot various big calibers and no one cares out here.
i am not sure when we might see weapons and ammo in .460 Steyr around here. The .416 Barretts are just at the top of my budget range at present. It will be the biggest system I have ever owned for certain. For myself I have a Mosin and a Remington 30-06 rifles as my big guns at present. I don't shoot either of them that much because they don't have muzzle breaks and other felt recoil dampening devices like the bigger more modern rifles.

That was a good history briefing on the .416 rounds. I learned a lot of that while I was looking for ammunition and reloading supplies for the .416 Barrett. Reloads are going to be important for me on my budget in the long run. I have been looking a lot at some of the propellants best suited for the rounds for various loads. There is quite a bit of economical brass out there available even clean re-primed brass ready to accept powder loads and have the bullets pressed in to them saving about $3 per round.


edit on 10/4/2019 by machineintelligence because: entry error



posted on Oct, 8 2019 @ 08:56 PM
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store.barrett.net...

What's in stock at the Barrett's store.

One thing the internet has taught me is if you intend to get into anything with irregular availability you buy when it's available and your budget intersects with that availability.

This site is selling a .416 Barrett reloading press.

gamingballistic.com...

This outfit CNCs bullets for reloading in the .416 caliber. Not terribly expensive.

cuttingedgebullets.com...

I'm still looking at powders but it looks like the same high power propellant they use in the 300 Blackout.



posted on Oct, 9 2019 @ 08:32 AM
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I guess I'm a little confused. You've talked about shooting hard targets out beyond 1,000 yards and head-shots out to a mile or more. At one point you even discussed hitting targets out to 1.5 miles. I'm sure you do realize there are only a handful of people in the world who are capable of shooting at these distances (reliably) even when equipped with a firearm capable of doing it. At these distances being able to control things like breathing and heart rate as well as match grade trigger control are critically important. Then there's rifle specific loads, and exquisite understanding of ballistics for the loaded round. It's not the gun at these ranges, it's more about the shooter. Yet you state you only own a .30-06 and 8mm Mosin.

Have you ever shot at these distances? What are you wanting to accomplish? A .30-06 will shoot reliably out to 1,000 yards (albeit with ridiculous hold-over) and so will the 5.56 x 45mm NATO (~.223). I can't speak for an 8mm as I don't own one. My point is, if you're wanting to get into long distance shooting you don't have to invest in something like a .416 Barrett to do it. I've shot High-Power matches with a .223 (and High-Power is out to 700 yards). We do that on a 1,000 yard Olympic range. Just for fun once I shot some 1,000 yard shots. A fella better understand wind (i.e. have wind tables) and the exact performance characteristics of his loadings to accomplish any degree of accuracy and repeatability. AND, you really need a spotter to have any reliability. This is only at 1,000 yards, fully 700-1,000 yards less than the distances you're talking about.

The .416 Barrett is going to be heavy, so it's probably unlikely to ever see any field time, mostly just the range. It's not like you'll be taking it deer or elk hunting, it's just too heavy (the muzzle brake alone probably weighs 2 lbs.). Plus, that big muzzle brake might make the recoil more manageable, but that's a trade-out for muzzle blast. So the muzzle blast will be deafening much like the .50 BMG is. You'll never shoot it without hearing protection.

Just some things to think about. I mean, if your heart is just set on the .416 Barrett just because you want one, then get it. But if you're wanting to get into long range shooting you don't need a Barrett to do it.

Just for the record; I've got some bench guns in .223 and .22-250 and they'll shoot all day long out beyond 500 yards in sub-1" groups (think prairie dog type accuracy). I also have a Weatherby Mk V chambered in .270 WBY Mag (essentially a necked down .300 H&H Belted Magnum case) which will shoot flat out beyond 700 yards, and easily knock down targets beyond 1,000.

On the other hand, if you really want a Barrett then what I would suggest is just going ahead and getting a .50 BMG Barrett, and not screwing around with the .416 chambering. Doesn't sound like you live in Commiefornia, so you shouldn't have to worry...unless of course you plan on taking out up-armored Humvee's around LA from over a mile away! (j/k)



posted on Oct, 9 2019 @ 08:54 AM
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BTW...for those possibly interested, here is a good video of the differences in muzzle blast between a .338 Lapua round and a .50 BMG. The guy with the .50 BMG starts shooting at 1:36 in the video. The first sniper is shooting a .338 Lapua mag. The difference is spectacular. The .338 just goes bang. The .50 BMG blows plaster chunks off the walls and ceiling just from the concussion and muzzle blast!


edit on 10/9/2019 by Flyingclaydisk because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 9 2019 @ 09:30 AM
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While we're on the subject of long range shooting, I'll tell you about the longest shot I ever witnessed.

One time growing up in Wyoming a couple friends and I were driving down a road with a power line along it. At one point one of my buddies hollered to stop. I stopped and he asks if we can see the crow on top of the telephone pole. I'm squinting and can't see a thing so I grabbed my binoculars. Sure enough there was a crow sitting on top of a pole and it was WAY TF out there! By this time he's gotten his .300 WBY Mag out and uncased and is chambering a round. We tell him he's crazy and there's no way he'll ever hit that crow. BANG! **counting one one thousand...two one thousand..three one thous...** POOF!! Black cloud of feathers!! We're all laughing and carrying on.

Then we start driving slowly, counting telephone poles between us and where Stuart hit this bird. Counted (14) poles between us and the bird. The poles were 100 yards apart, so that was a 1,400 yard shot...from a standing position...with no bench rest!! Got to the crow and it was a head-shot right at the top of the body. UN-BELIEVABLE!!

I would have never believed someone could do that if I hadn't witnessed it with my own eyes!



posted on Oct, 9 2019 @ 09:44 AM
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a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

That was a heck of a shot for certain. Head shot on a crow at 1,400 yards unsupported is extremely impressive. Was that with a factory load? Was it a Weatherby load? Just curious as my dad really loved his 300 Weatherby. I grew up shooting that rifle. I also loved shooting the 303 British.



posted on Oct, 9 2019 @ 11:24 AM
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a reply to: machineintelligence

I think the head-shot part was just pure luck (I doubt he could even resolve a head at that distance, even with a 9x scope), but that he hit the crow at all was amazing. How he even saw that bird to begin with was amazing. That's why I say it was the best shot I ever witnessed. No way I could have made that shot, not then and probably not now, and I'm a pretty good shot.

The load was just a Weatherby factory load right out of the box. I don't recall the bullet weight. I was the one who did all the reloading, and I only had dies for my .270 Weatherby mag (among others).


edit on 10/9/2019 by Flyingclaydisk because: (no reason given)



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