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What is the dollar $ value of what trump asked for from the Ukraine?

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posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 11:20 AM
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A sitting Vice President broke the law. That is what this is about.
The Dims are trying for a two-for-one deal. To get rid of Trump AND Biden at once. That is the value the Dims are looking at.




posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 11:47 AM
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a reply to: iwanttobelieve70


I would think in a court of law the value is going to have to be determined, right?


Which is precisely why this whole mysterious term, "value", never holds up in court unless money actually changed hands.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 11:52 AM
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originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
So what is the crime. Will he not have to be charged with something? Can they just say the impeachment is just because they don’t like him? Doesn’t there have to be a law broken?


Nope. No law needs to be broken if Congress thinks they can get a 2/3 majority vote in the Senate to remove Trump, but it's going to make them look really petty and bad, which is why they won't do it.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 01:37 PM
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when a prosecutor doesn’t have a case but has brought charges wouldn’t the prudent thing to do be demand a speedy trial. I believe I would be demanding a vote every day and pointing out they have nothing.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 01:47 PM
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originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
I don’t think you can go into court and say trust me this is worth X. Think you have to show a value.


Where a law uses the phrase "something of value" a specific dollar value need not be either alleged or established. It is only when a specific value is set out as an element of an offense that specific values become relevant, such as when the law sets out different amounts as affecting the degree of the offense, such as theft, where in Florida, anything over $300.00 is a felony and anything under $300.00 is a misdemeanor. I accept that you "think you have to show a value." As a retired lawyer and judge, I know you do not have to quantify the value where the law establishing the offense doesn't quantify.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:03 PM
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originally posted by: shooterbrody
a reply to: iwanttobelieve70
There is no crime


abcnews.go.com...



Trump's DOJ clears president of violating campaign finance law in Ukraine-Biden call





Further explaining the DOJ's handling of the referral, the official said the criminal division concluded that the information they had gathered did not amount to a criminal violation of campaign finance law because nothing "of value" was clearly promised or exchange as a result of the call. The official said there was no disagreement among the prosecutors in the criminal division, even among career prosecutors, that the call did not amount to a potential campaign finance violation.


its much ado about nothing





posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:07 PM
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originally posted by: F4guy

originally posted by: iwanttobelieve70
I don’t think you can go into court and say trust me this is worth X. Think you have to show a value.


Where a law uses the phrase "something of value" a specific dollar value need not be either alleged or established. It is only when a specific value is set out as an element of an offense that specific values become relevant, such as when the law sets out different amounts as affecting the degree of the offense, such as theft, where in Florida, anything over $300.00 is a felony and anything under $300.00 is a misdemeanor. I accept that you "think you have to show a value." As a retired lawyer and judge, I know you do not have to quantify the value where the law establishing the offense doesn't quantify.


So you are saying value is completely subjective? Even if true doesn’t it have to have an established value? If you are given something that is given for free to everyone then what is the value?

What could it be sold for?

How do you justify the department of justice saying it has no value?
edit on 1-10-2019 by iwanttobelieve70 because: (no reason given)

edit on 1-10-2019 by iwanttobelieve70 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:08 PM
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a reply to: iwanttobelieve70

Non-zero.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:15 PM
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if I ask the police to look into my neighbors because I believe there maybe drug dealing going on how much will the police charge me? What is that worth? If I was running for city council would I have to report my request as a campaign contribution? If my neighbors were also running am I not allowed to talk to the police?

I’m just not following the logic here, and I’m trying.
edit on 1-10-2019 by iwanttobelieve70 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:23 PM
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The threat of withholding of Congress approved funds to a foreign country unless that country does an action that is intended to help the president's campaign/office.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:23 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme
He must have thought he was going to get something that would win him the presidency if Biden was his opponent.

You ... actually think ... he would have been worried about ... BIDEN? As a political opponent? In a Presidential race???

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:24 PM
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originally posted by: roadgravel

The threat of withholding of Congress approved funds to a foreign country unless that country does an action that is intended to help the president's campaign/office.

Yeah... except he didn't do that. The Ukrainian President didn't find out about the fund being withheld until a month after the phone call.

Try again... I know you can do it... just one more...



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:26 PM
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a reply to: roadgravel

What law is that specifically? What did Biden do different?



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:34 PM
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a reply to: Bluntone22

He insinuated that they wouldn't get the missiles if they didn't dig for dirt on Biden. The only folks confused by this are those who want to keep Trump as President at any cost. And i don't thunk they are really confused.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 02:57 PM
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originally posted by: Sillyolme

He didn't get any dirt. He got nothing.

because there was no dirt to get.

that is why he is lying about it now.



Do you think Biden will be the front runner? I don't and he wasn't back then either...

So if we talk dirt....

So Biden's son was paid 50k per month for about 5 years to do nothing for a company that has major ties to Russia's oligarchy and basically organized crime groups while his dad was VP and is now one of the front runners to be President, and you see this as normal?



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 03:02 PM
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originally posted by: sligtlyskeptical

He insinuated that they wouldn't get the missiles if they didn't dig for dirt on Biden. The only folks confused by this are those who want to keep Trump as President at any cost. And i don't thunk they are really confused.



You are providing pure speculation on this and we can speculate any which way. "He insinuated" which means he suggested he would like support...He did not hold anything back as leverage or even come close to quid pro quo. Looking for dirt is no different than what Obama and Hillary did, paid to have done. Trump asked for help...

REALLY! That is what you want to impeach him on, on speculation that is extremely bias no matter what....lol



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 03:03 PM
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originally posted by: sligtlyskeptical
a reply to: Bluntone22

He insinuated that they wouldn't get the missiles if they didn't dig for dirt on Biden. The only folks confused by this are those who want to keep Trump as President at any cost. And i don't thunk they are really confused.





What missiles? If your talking about anti tank missiles they had recieved those all ready. Trump was willing to sell them weapons which Obama had refused to do.

It was dec 2017 that Trump announced he was sending lethal aid to Ukraine. And they recieved it in may of 2018. The latest batch did not include missiles congress approved grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars and equipment to detect and protect against electronic warfare.

However in future aid packages the Ukrainian govt wants more javelins because since they arrived Russian Tanks dissapeared from the battle field.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 03:33 PM
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There is a legal definition for the word "value." According to Black's Legal Dictionary, "Value means The utility of an object in satisfying, directly or indirectly, the needs or desires of human beings..." Since Trump asked Ukraine to pursue an investigation, we can assume he desired it and that an investigation would help satisfy that desire. Q.E.D., i had value. Value doesn't equal cost. If you take all the donated clothes out of a Salvation Army box, those items were not for sale, and therefore have no cost, they still have value.
If you steal a home-baked apple pie from your neighbor's open kitchen window, that pie has no price or cost since it was a donation for the Baptist church's Sunday dinner, it still has value. And I don't feel the urgent need to "justify" anything that comes out of Trump's Justice Department. Trump is riding Barr like a broken down nag in a $2500 maiden claiming race.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 03:38 PM
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a reply to: tanstaafl

he asked.



posted on Oct, 1 2019 @ 03:56 PM
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originally posted by: sligtlyskeptical
a reply to: Bluntone22

He insinuated that they wouldn't get the missiles if they didn't dig for dirt on Biden. The only folks confused by this are those who want to keep Trump as President at any cost. And i don't thunk they are really confused.





So he said “if you don’t do X which is required by you by signed treaty we will do Y” and that is against the law?

Can you point me to that federal law for reference?




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