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Traitors will attempt to bring down UK government next week

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posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:23 PM
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originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Irishhaf
This isn't really a fight for and aganist democracy.



That's exactly what it is.
Whilst a referendum is non binding, the country was told - unequivocally - that the result would be implemented by their govt. No ifs, buts, or maybe's.
We voted in one of the largest democratic exercises this country has ever seen, and now representatives in parliament are hell bent on NOT honouring that vote. They are no longer representing the people, and thus our entire democracy is failing.




posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:24 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Arnie123




Boris wants out by the 31st, deal or no deal, I say, let y'all leave on the 31st.



Legally we cannot leave on the 31st unless there is a deal that parliament agree too.


Not correct.
As it stands now, we leave on the 31st October - legally.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:27 PM
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a reply to: UKTruth
I do want Boris to get this through, but the awkward fact remains that an elected House of Commons is also an expression of democracy. Both sides can claim democracy on their side. We may as well accept this in discussion.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:27 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Obviously I am looking at it from afar and have fewer resources immediately available in the states, (especially the state I am in now... bleh they cant see beyond weekend football) But it appears anti democratic moves is whats being parroted as a reason to not let it proceed.


IE BJ is destroying democracy by trying to get Parliament out of the way so he can do the will of the people, I guess that's what has me confused if they want to use democracy as a reason to block this you should eventually come around to what the will of the people is and for better or worse they voted to leave.

Either way I wish the UK the best, but I think yall need to be very careful or parliament may decide the will of the people is totally irrelevant and then it will really suck.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:29 PM
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originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Arnie123




Boris wants out by the 31st, deal or no deal, I say, let y'all leave on the 31st.



Legally we cannot leave on the 31st unless there is a deal that parliament agree too.


Not correct.
As it stands now, we leave on the 31st October - legally.


Sorry let me amend my above statement.

Legally we cannot leave on the 31st unless there is a deal that parliament agree too or the EU refuse to grant an extension that the PM is legally bound to apply for should there be no deal put before parliament by October 14.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:30 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to: ScepticScot

You do realise that those MP's who support Brexit are also receiving death threats ?




Tell that to the poster condoning the threats.

And only one side seems to be routinely using terms like traitor and surrender.
edit on 28-9-2019 by ScepticScot because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:33 PM
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So many inaccuracies in the opening post, it's laughable.
brexit voters hate it when farage says everyone thinks they're stupid then, always say something stupid and get upset for getting called out on it.

The illegal closing down of parliament was anti-democratic.
Having a final democratic vote on project fear versus remain isn't anti-democratic.

The brexit bunch know theyre lies have been exposed, maybe a few like the opening poster who were gaslit for the last couple of months and we know it's easy to manipulate the gullible but, they know deep down they've been conned hence, they don't want a second democratic vote.

Its weird how easily a good chunk of the population were engineered to accept lies and defend them but, looking at America and seeing the same process happen their makes me shudder.
If goebbels had the interwebz how different would the world look? 2019 and anti-fascists are considered the bad guys by many on places like this, so maybe it's not far off...



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:34 PM
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originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Irishhaf
This isn't really a fight for and aganist democracy.
It's a conflict between two different forms of expression of democracy- viz. the elected legislature and the referendum. When the referendum was introduced, nobody thought of giving it over-riding powers, so we have this rhetorical stalemate between the two sides. A third form of expression is the General Election, which could have given a casting vote- but at least one side of the argument doesn't want one.



This is exactly the problem we are traditionally a parliamentary democracy who stupidly thought that using direct democracy would fix a problem. Truth is nobody expected Leave to win and now we have this absurd problem where via direct democracy we have said leave yet through our traditional parliament democracy the sovereign will of parliament is to remain.

Its quite a interesting political problem, I find its most interesting when you take the "B" word out of it and just look at the technicalities of it.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:37 PM
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originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: UKTruth

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: Arnie123




Boris wants out by the 31st, deal or no deal, I say, let y'all leave on the 31st.



Legally we cannot leave on the 31st unless there is a deal that parliament agree too.


Not correct.
As it stands now, we leave on the 31st October - legally.


Sorry let me amend my above statement.

Legally we cannot leave on the 31st unless there is a deal that parliament agree too or the EU refuse to grant an extension that the PM is legally bound to apply for should there be no deal put before parliament by October 14.


The UK has to ask The EU for a further extension beyond the 31st October. Boris said he will not. Therefore we are out on 1st November.

My guess is Boris will do this:-




According to Sir John Major, the Prime Minister could try to use a mechanism called "Order of Council" to get around the Benn Act, which would otherwise force Boris Johnson to ask for a Brexit extension if he fails to procure a deal in the next three weeks.


inews.co.uk...

That is why the Opposition Parties are now panicking to try and put a coalition together next week.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:40 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI




I do want Boris to get this through, but the awkward fact remains that an elected House of Commons is also an expression of democracy.

Is it still Democracy if the MPs involved in this Remainer Coup represent constituencies that voted leave ?
As I understand it there are quite a few MPs in that position , not only ignoring the voice of the country but also their electorate , it's no wonder they don't want an election.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:40 PM
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a reply to: Irishhaf
In America, a democratically elected Congress can try to block the moves of a democratically elected President. but in Britain this is an abnormal situation, because we don't normally have that schism between legislature and executive. Each side is accusing the other of contemplating abuse of power and using the Brexit issue as an excuse, but I believe the crisis will pass if the issue is settled at the end of next month and becomes a fait accompli.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:41 PM
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a reply to: alldaylong

Pretty much Boris is doing everything he can to circumvent the law passed by parliament.

Again, take the "B" word out of it, let even pretend its a different issue.

What happened is parliament, our sovereign parliament that represents the people of the UK, have passed a law that our PM doesn't like so he is trying to figure out a way to break that law. Imagine this was a fox hunting ban, whats basically happening here is parliament have banned fox hunting but Boris wants to go shot some foxes with his mates so he's trying everything he can to find a loop hole so he can go kill some foxes.

Its crazy.

What other choice do parliament have, if the PM is not going to uphold the law of the land what else can they do



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:42 PM
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a reply to: gortex

Stop calling this a coup, is not a coup, is fair use of the Fixed terms parliament act and it is a legal mechanism for removing a inept government.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:44 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI


Fair enough, wish yall the best of luck just figured I would ask since our press is about as useful as teats on a boar when it comes to pretty much anything.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:45 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
My guess is Boris will do this:-

According to Sir John Major, the Prime Minister could try to use a mechanism called "Order of Council" to get around the Benn Act, which would otherwise force Boris Johnson to ask for a Brexit extension if he fails to procure a deal in the next three weeks.


I saw a news story this morning in which the Cabinet spokesman described that suggestion as "a load of cobblers".
(Do you think ATS will allow me to explain this technical term to Americans?)


edit on 28-9-2019 by DISRAELI because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin




Stop calling this a coup, is not a coup

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck I'll call it a duck.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to:




the UK, have passed a law that our PM doesn't like so he is trying to figure out a way to break that law


No he is not.

He is finding ways to get around " The Benn Act " by legal methods.

Using " The Order of Council Mechanism " is one way of legally circumventing The Benn Act.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI

Apparently there are already legal cases being prepared for a range of eventualities that Boris might try including him trying to invoke the Civil Contingencies Act.

I think it will be interesting to see how he tries to get around the law just from the point of view of finding these political games rather fascinating.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:49 PM
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originally posted by: alldaylong
a reply to:




the UK, have passed a law that our PM doesn't like so he is trying to figure out a way to break that law


No he is not.

He is finding ways to get around " The Benn Act " by legal methods.

Using " The Order of Council Mechanism " is one way of legally circumventing The Benn Act.


A way that would probably be legally challenged.

The problem is this, our government is not sovereign, parliament is, parliament has passed an act that says, you need to request a extension.

Now Boris is going to do whatever he can to get around that, its probably going to lead to him being removed from office in some way all because we have a PM who can't follow the law of the land.



posted on Sep, 28 2019 @ 12:50 PM
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a reply to: DISRAELI




I saw a news story this morning in which the Cabinet spokesman described that suggestion as "a load of cobblers"


That's remark was probably a " Smokescreen " so the Cabinet don't have to show their hand.




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