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Something that has bothered me for a long time

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posted on Sep, 23 2019 @ 05:18 AM
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a reply to: Hunkadinka

You know what! I do not think you have studied this case at all, but let me ask you this!

Out of all the workers, the only ones who were close was Travis and Rodgers. Now, if they all done this to make money, or get out of the contract, then why is it onlyTravis in the limelight making money?

Why have the others got on with their lives, and pretty much left it alone? Why is it that not one of the co workers has come forward to say it was a hoax? They were not close, and they are not making money from it, so why the silence?




posted on Sep, 23 2019 @ 03:32 PM
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a reply to: Hunkadinka


What's wrong "the shrike " you cannot answer that? But you have done do much research in this case! lol



posted on Sep, 24 2019 @ 10:24 PM
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originally posted by: dfnj2015
I get it why people are skeptical within regards to UFO sightings and extraterrestrial visitations. It seems no matter what "evidence" is presented it's always discounted as anything BUT extraterrestrials. The thing is if these sightings are all hoaxes, and there are now thousands of sightings per year, people are spending HUGE amounts of time and money making the hoax with really hardly anything to show for it.

It just seems to me why would anyone go through so much trouble to hoax.

Here's a great example. Remember years ago the sightings over Phoenix. Practically the entire city witnessed it. Nobody knew what it was. The public was really getting stirred up about it. And then the Arizona governor came on TV and in a big news conference did this:



"The Associated Press/Scott Troyanos --- Arizona Gov. Fife Symington pulls a mask off of aide Jay Heiler, dressed up as an alien, during a late afternoon news conference at the state capitol in downtown Phoenix Thursday June 19, 1997. Symington, earlier in the day, said he would order the Arizona Department of Public Safety to look into the mysterious lights seen over Phoenix, but later insisted he was joking."

Then he joked about everyone is taking this too serious. Now most people who lean on the side extraterrestrials are for real were thinking this is made up BS. There are two angles here. What was floating over the city was some kind of craft but not extraterrestrials. Or, it really was extraterrestrials flying over the city.

Let's think about the costume Jay Heiler is wearing. It's a pretty nice costume. Maybe you can buy something like this online. So I looked. Here's some extraterrestrial costumes you can buy online:

Extraterrestrial constumes you can buy online

None of the ones I found looked anything as cool as the one Jay was wearing. The one Jay was wearing even has anatomically correct four fingers. The face on the one Jay was wearing was amazingly realistic.

So if they did not buy it online or from a local store maybe they made from scratch. Or, it was given to them by the US government to make the joke more effective to calm the people down. Or it was given to Jay by the government to deflate any real pressure for disclosure of extraterrestrials.



Again, looking at this costume, a HUGE amount of time and money went into it's production if it were homemade. It's such a good costume you could argue this is evidence of a government cover-up to prevent disclosure!

I'm sure this was talked about here but I did NOT know this about Governor Symington and I was shocked when trying to get pictures for this post. Check this story out:

Symington confirms he saw UFO 10 years ago

"PHOENIX — Former Arizona Gov. Fife Symington, who trotted out an aide dressed as an alien 10 years ago to spoof the frenzy surrounding mysterious lights in the Phoenix sky, now says the lights were actually an alien spacecraft."

WHAT??????? Now he's change his tune.

Again, if all these sightings are hoaxes I find it amazing the amount of time and money is spent on it. If they are all fake its like millions of dollars in R/C drones and planes etc... I would hate to spend $300 on a receiver and servos, fly it up to 500 feet, and then loss the effing thing in high winds. IDK, maybe it's all fake. But maybe it isn't!!



I think what keeps ufology alive is that many people do experience real ufo’s etc.

And once you have, then u know it’s real. No question.

“Maybe it’s all fake” just shows that u haven’t personally seen something genuine yet, to clear up that yes, they are real, and yes they’re on Earth for whatever reasons.

I saw a non-human entity in my room when I was like five years old, so I’ve always known that it’s real, just from seeing it.

Also the entity seemed loving towards me so I always had a positive feeling about aliens, etc.

OTOH I can imagine that for people who haven’t seen it clearly, then sure it would be a huge question for you guys, if it’s real or not...



posted on Sep, 25 2019 @ 10:01 PM
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originally posted by: Jay-morris
a reply to: Hunkadinka

You know what! I do not think you have studied this case at all, but let me ask you this!

Out of all the workers, the only ones who were close was Travis and Rodgers. Now, if they all done this to make money, or get out of the contract, then why is it onlyTravis in the limelight making money?

Why have the others got on with their lives, and pretty much left it alone? Why is it that not one of the co workers has come forward to say it was a hoax? They were not close, and they are not making money from it, so why the silence?



Your questions open up to what could be one hell of a thread. What keeps you from pursuing the answers by locating the whereabouts of the other 6 co-workers. Here are their names so that you can start finding them:

Mike Rogers
Allen Dalis
John Goulette
Dwayne Smith
Kenneth Peterson
Steve Pierce

Wikipedia

Skeptics consider the case to be a hoax, describing it as "sensationalizing on the part of the media" and "a put-up job to make money". UFO researcher Philip J. Klass considered Walton's story to be a hoax perpetrated for financial gain and discovered many "discrepancies" in the accounts of Walton and his co-workers. After investigating the case, Klass reported that the polygraph tests were "poorly administered", that Walton used "polygraph countermeasures," such as holding his breath, and that Klass uncovered an earlier failed test administered by an examiner who concluded the case involved "gross deception".[9][10][11][2][12]

Science and skepticism writer Michael Shermer criticized Walton's claims, saying, "I think the polygraph is not a reliable determiner of truth. I think Travis Walton was not abducted by aliens. In both cases, the power of deception and self-deception is all we need to understand what really happened in 1975 and after."[7] Cognitive psychologist Susan Clancy argues that alien abduction reports began only after stories of extraterrestrials appeared in films and on TV, and that Walton was likely influenced by the NBC television movie The UFO Incident, which aired two weeks before his own claimed abduction and dramatized the alien abduction claims of Betty and Barney Hill. Clancy noted the rise in alien abduction claims following the movie and cites Klass's conclusions that "after viewing this movie, any person with a little imagination could now become an instant celebrity", concluding that "one of those instant celebrities was Travis Walton."[3]


There are plenty more articles with additional details that come to the conclusion that Walton is a hoaxer and I accept it.



posted on Sep, 26 2019 @ 03:22 AM
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originally posted by: Hunkadinka

originally posted by: Jay-morris
a reply to: Hunkadinka

You know what! I do not think you have studied this case at all, but let me ask you this!

Out of all the workers, the only ones who were close was Travis and Rodgers. Now, if they all done this to make money, or get out of the contract, then why is it onlyTravis in the limelight making money?

Why have the others got on with their lives, and pretty much left it alone? Why is it that not one of the co workers has come forward to say it was a hoax? They were not close, and they are not making money from it, so why the silence?



Your questions open up to what could be one hell of a thread. What keeps you from pursuing the answers by locating the whereabouts of the other 6 co-workers. Here are their names so that you can start finding them:

Mike Rogers
Allen Dalis
John Goulette
Dwayne Smith
Kenneth Peterson
Steve Pierce

Wikipedia

Skeptics consider the case to be a hoax, describing it as "sensationalizing on the part of the media" and "a put-up job to make money". UFO researcher Philip J. Klass considered Walton's story to be a hoax perpetrated for financial gain and discovered many "discrepancies" in the accounts of Walton and his co-workers. After investigating the case, Klass reported that the polygraph tests were "poorly administered", that Walton used "polygraph countermeasures," such as holding his breath, and that Klass uncovered an earlier failed test administered by an examiner who concluded the case involved "gross deception".[9][10][11][2][12]

Science and skepticism writer Michael Shermer criticized Walton's claims, saying, "I think the polygraph is not a reliable determiner of truth. I think Travis Walton was not abducted by aliens. In both cases, the power of deception and self-deception is all we need to understand what really happened in 1975 and after."[7] Cognitive psychologist Susan Clancy argues that alien abduction reports began only after stories of extraterrestrials appeared in films and on TV, and that Walton was likely influenced by the NBC television movie The UFO Incident, which aired two weeks before his own claimed abduction and dramatized the alien abduction claims of Betty and Barney Hill. Clancy noted the rise in alien abduction claims following the movie and cites Klass's conclusions that "after viewing this movie, any person with a little imagination could now become an instant celebrity", concluding that "one of those instant celebrities was Travis Walton."[3]


There are plenty more articles with additional details that come to the conclusion that Walton is a hoaxer and I accept it.


So, with all this so called research you have done regarding the case, all you can do is go on to wiki and copy and paste what two skeptics said about the case!

You did not even answer my question! You dodged it by linking this page, to somehow justify your belief. So now I know 100%, that you know nothing about this case! Thank you for proving my point!


Let me start of with Philip J. Klass. Anything from this guy is invalid. He is possibly the worst ufo debunker in history, who brought nothing to ufology, just stupid explanations. If anyone was running on 100% belief, it was this idiot!

As for the polygraph tests! If a ufo witness passes them, then they are easily manipalated. If they fail, then that proves they are lying! Again, this is fitting your beliefs!

As for shermer. As much as a like the guy, and like alot of his work, when it comes to ufos, his knowledge is limited, and all he has done, is give his opinion on the case. News flash for you! Giving your opinion, is not evidence of a hoax!

He said the hoax was all for money. If that's the case, why have the other not made money from the case? Why have the others distanced themselves from the case and pretty much got on with their lives?

If they wanted to make money, all they would have to do is come out and say it was a hoax. The interviws, book deals, talks etc would make them a lot of money. So why not one of them has come forward to say it was a hoax?

Another thing! They are not close. Only Travis and Mike were close. Do it makes no sense at all!

As for, being interested in ufos. Does that mean if You see a ufo, , then you are lying because you are interested in ufos? Do people who are not interested in ufos only see them?

It's a ridiculous statement!


So instead of linking wiki to justify why it's a hoax, why don't you actually answer my question? Nothing on that wiki page proves this is a hoax.

The only thing you have proved, is you know little about the case, and have to quote people to justify why it's a hoax. Not good!




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