What's the big deal with Israel?

Mods: didn't know where to put this, so I stuck it here. If it's in the wrong place, please move it to the correct one.

So, like the title asks, what's the big deal with Israel?

A very brief general history of Israel. Around 1,000 BCE the Israelites conquered Canaan. According to their own history books, killing every man, woman, and child in some cities. In others just taking the unmarried girls, killing everyone else, and giving them out to the soldiers as war brides. They held it till around 64 BCE when the Romans moved in and took charge. Around 72 CE the Romans had enough of the riots and destroyed the second temple and political power of the Jews in Israel. Many Jews were killed, many were sold into slavery. Since then, that part of the world has changed hands many times. The Ottomans ruled it from 1517 till 1917 when the British took over. After WWII the British turned it over to the Jews. They then went door to door and kicked out the inhabitants forcing them off the land they had held for generations. After the 67 war, Israel expanded beyond the borders agreed to, kicking out more residents. They continue to expand and build settlements and kick people out/off their lands to this day. Just google Israel expansion map.

What brings up the question I have is that I just don't see Israel as all that important. They take a lot of our money, but don't really give a whole lot back, or bring much to the table. It's nice that the Jewish people have a homeland, but the Israeli gov is doing some pretty messed up stuff.

The other week or so, every time Trump spoke it was "the US and Israel" this or that, like Israel was part of the US or something.

I also don't get a lot of the arguments for Israel. "It's their land!". When, a thousand years ago? The Native Americans have more right to go and kick people out of their houses and take the land than Israelis do. "You take land in a war". Really, so the US now own Iraq and Afghanistan? "They are surrounded by enemies and get bombed everyday". Yes, and Israel kills far more for every Israeli that gets killed in those bombings. Since 29 September 2000 to 31 March 2008, there have been 4,719 dead Palestinians vs 1,044 dead Israelis. 4.5 dead Palestinians for every Israeli. news.bbc.co.uk...

Now, before you go to the Anti-Semite slur, please believe I have no problem with Jews or the Jewish people. I think they should have a homeland. That's not the same as having a problem with a government. See, I'm not a big fan of the way the Israeli gov is handling the situation. The expansion is the biggest issue I see. When the Israelis move in, they force the people already living there out, and that causes bad blood.

Put yourself in the Palestinian situation. (For the sake of the analogy, neither the US or your right to bear arms exist) Say you're in Texas, and a group of Mexicans, backed by Mexico, decides to "take back their land" and force you off your property at gun point and into a refugee camp. You might not have a good opinion of Mexicans after that. You might even be so hot as to think sending in a few mortars is a good idea, especially if one of your family members were hurt or killed in this taking. Now it's 3 generations later, and you still see your people getting kicked off their land, you might teach your grand kids that they need to fight. That they can't trust Mexicans. That the only good Mexican is a dead Mexican. See what I'm getting at here? This is a mess of Israels own making. If they stop expanding, prop up the displaced, then in a few decades, when memory fades, things might be different.

This is my read of the situation. If I have it wrong, please let me know, as I'm sure you will.

TL;DR
Why is Israel special to the US?

Well, to cut down your entire thread
There was never a Palestinian land .
So , all stated is not historically accurate.
As far as Israel ceding land to the Palestinians ?
They were given the boot from the Muslim countries , including Egypt
The UN decided to give part of Israeli land to the Palestinians
Land that used to be held by the Philistines (Philistines are not Palestinian)

reply to: Gothmog

So who lived there that the Israelis kicked out? There was a people and community before the British turned it over to the Jews, so who were they?

Who are the people currently being evicted from their lands for a new Israeli settlement?

What's the big deal with Israel?

a reply to: stormson

You're entering dangerous territory here.

If you want to figure out who's running things in any given society or situation just look at who you can't criticise.

a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM

That sounds like a "Jews run the world" trope. I don't think that's true. I think it's the Evangelical right, the Family, that are pushing this more than anyone.

And here I always thought they bought empty land from the Ottomans starting in the late 1800s 💫

a reply to: stormson

Put yourself in the Palestinian situation.

Palestine has never been a place on any map ever, until recent times.

Your simplistic run-through of historical events isn't very accurate either.

Simple solution, remove Hamas from power in Palestine and there will likely be peace. When you let a terrorist organization run a country/territory, you will inevitably face repercussions.

Simple analogy - You punch a guy in the face, then that guy kicks your ass. Who is at fault? You are.

originally posted by: stormson
reply to: [

post=24586020]Gothmog[/post]

So who lived there that the Israelis kicked out? There was a people and community before the British turned it over to the Jews, so who were they?

Who are the people currently being evicted from their lands for a new Israeli settlement?

What's the big deal with Israel?

Reread my post and it will tell you
History lesson over.

a reply to: stormson

Here in Australia, going back to I think it was 2010 had a change of Prime Minister.

Not but 3 weeks earlier he expelled an Israeli diplomat who was actually a Mossad operative, exposing that fact because Mossad operatives had used falsified Australian passports to carry out an assassination in the UAE.

There is evidence of meetings in those 3 weeks with the head of the Jewish/Zionist whatever lobby and I think even recorded or anecdotal conversation suggesting a change was afoot. I can dig them up if you are interested.

That had nothing to do with the evangelical right (non-existent here in the US sense), nor do I believe it was a coincidence.

I've already said too much and I'm not one of the "Jews run the world" crowd but the Jewish lobby certainly has an inordinate amount of influence in Western democracies.

This is all I will say as it will begin bordering on T's&C's violations.

a reply to: Vector99

Palestine has never been a place on any map ever, until recent times.

It still isn't
1) Gaza
2) West Bank

a reply to: Vector99
So it seems you're stuck on the name we give the people that lived in the region before '48.

Why is Israel so special?

a reply to: IAMALLYETALLIAM
Ah.
However, I hold to my idea as I know both evangelicals and Jews, and the evangelicals hold Israel in higher regard because it heralds the "second coming".

a reply to: stormson

Because a bunch of Jews settled on absolutely unusable swamp lands and desert in the late 1800s and turned it into the most beautiful country in the region in less than a hundred years

a reply to: stormson

Evangelicals hold Israel in higher regard than the Jews? Equal perhaps, but I doubt higher.

originally posted by: Gothmog
Well, to cut down your entire thread
There was never a Palestinian land .
So , all stated is not historically accurate.
As far as Israel ceding land to the Palestinians ?
They were given the boot from the Muslim countries , including Egypt
The UN decided to give part of Israeli land to the Palestinians
Land that used to be held by the Philistines (Philistines are not Palestinian)

As an aside, the Philistines, it appears, were European.

a reply to: dashen
So the Jewish claim only goes to the late 1800's?
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

a reply to: stormson

That was the major resettlement. There have been Jewish settlements living on the land uninterrupted since Roman times at the very least. Jews helped defend the Holy Land alongside mamlouk Muslims against Christian Crusaders during the Dark Ages

a reply to: stormson

In any case it's very clear you have very strong opinions based on very little actual working knowledge of History so this is the end of the conversation until you actually read something substantive before speaking about a subject that you are comically ignorant of

a reply to: stormson

Look into 'dual citizenship' of US congressmen/politicians. Therein lies part of your answer.

Christians are hoodwinked into siding with "God's chosen people" ...another piece of your puzzle.

a reply to: new_here

"Gods Chosen People"

Racially supremacist ideology if I have ever heard it.