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The Flores Agreement is Going Bye-Bye Democrats Furious

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posted on Aug, 27 2019 @ 06:13 PM
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originally posted by: pavil

originally posted by: Breakthestreak

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Breakthestreak

In that case, why would the threat of detention be a deterrent.



It’s not. Who claimed the threat of detention to be a deterrent?

The deterrent is the refusal to be granted citizenship


Or to get 2 or 3 years to live unmonitored in the US while trying to get asylum. Surely if conditions are so terrifying in their home countries, they would welcome being in secure facilities. Small price to pay to live here legally.


Don't forget that most in the caravans refused Mexico's offer of temporary asylum, which included IDs, medical care, schooling for children, and housing. The plan was called Estás en Tu Casa ( you're in your home). Only 1,700 accepted.
edit on 27-8-2019 by Wardaddy454 because: (no reason given)




posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 07:46 AM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
I think it would be better if they could be free to locate family or friends as sponsors, put the kids in school and find jobs, instead of sitting in detention for years waiting for their court date, paid for by tax payer dollars.

Years? Yeah, I think you meant 45-60 days.

The lies are getting old, sookie-sookie.



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 07:53 AM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
If they're applying for asylum, they still get a court date.

Exactly, so, hold them for the 45-60 days needed to finish the process and get their court date.

Precisely what this new policy does.

Thanks you President Trump for actually working to fulfill your promises to the American people.



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 08:03 AM
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originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
I think it would be better if they could be free to locate family or friends as sponsors, put the kids in school and find jobs, instead of sitting in detention for years waiting for their court date, paid for by tax payer dollars.

Years? Yeah, I think you meant 45-60 days.

The lies are getting old, sookie-sookie.



Now, in order to be granted a work permit, you have to either
win your asylum case (which may take several years), or
be left waiting 180 days or more with no initial decision on your application from the asylum office or from the immigration court. After 150 days, you can apply for a work permit and you are eligible to receive it after you have been waiting 180 days.

www.nolo.com...


How long does the asylum process take?
The length of the asylum process varies, but it typically takes between 6 months and several years.

immigrationforum.org...


edit on 28-8-2019 by Sookiechacha because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 08:22 AM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
But, we know that's not true.

Ah, but it is. Just because you don't want to believe it doesn't change the fact that it is true.


Where do you think they're going after 39.8 days,

Many/most will be sent back to where they came from because they don't qualify for asylum. That is the point. Those who truly do qualify will be processed.


and why do you think Trump is asking for indefinite detention of families and their children?

I don't think indefinite means what you seem to think it means:

"The new policy means that migrant families who are detained after crossing the border can be kept indefinitely, until their cases are decided. Today's policy doesn't specify a limit but sets an expectation that cases be resolved comparatively quickly — within about two months."


"To obtain asylum through the affirmative asylum process you must be physically present in the United States. You may apply for asylum status regardless of how you arrived in the United States or your current immigration status.
You must apply for asylum within one year of the date of their last arrival in the United States,"
www.uscis.gov...

Yes, and this is one of the problems that must be fixed by Congress.

They need to require that asylum requests can only be made by those entering through a port of entry. Anyone caught who entered illegally should automatically lose eligibility to claim asylum - permanently.


So, asylum seekers have recourse to enter the US between border check points and find family, maybe get a lawyer, before turning themselves in, but many turn themselves in immediately, sitting on the side of road waiting for border patrol to come along, so that they can present themselves.

Exactly, and this is precisely what must be changed by Congress.



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 08:25 AM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
"The lies are getting old, sookie-sookie."

I snipped your supposed supporting evidence because it is pure BS.

They aren't detained until their Asylum process is completed. They are merely detained until their determination hearing to determine if they have a valid claim.

That part takes 45-60 days.

If their claim has merit, they are released and the process continues.

If their claim is without merit, they are returned to whence they came.
edit on 28-8-2019 by tanstaafl because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-8-2019 by tanstaafl because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 08:47 AM
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a reply to: tanstaafl




"The new policy means that migrant families who are detained after crossing the border can be kept indefinitely, until their cases are decided. Today's policy doesn't specify a limit but sets an expectation that cases be resolved comparatively quickly — within about two months."


Except we know that that's not true. The asylum process often takes years to decide, as sourced above.





edit on 28-8-2019 by Sookiechacha because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 11:14 AM
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a reply to: tanstaafl

I would add one caveat, if they enter outside a port of entry they must immediately head to one. Failure to do so, or any attempt to flee border patrol should invalidate asylum claims.



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 12:20 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
The asylum process often takes years to decide, as sourced above.

Since you apparently cannot read with comprehension, I'll repeat myself:

"They aren't detained until their Asylum process is completed. They are merely detained until their determination hearing to determine if they have a valid claim.

That part takes 45-60 days."



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 12:22 PM
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originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: tanstaafl

I would add one caveat, if they enter outside a port of entry they must immediately head to one.

Nope.

They either enter legally, through a formal port of entry, or they forfeit any chance of ever being allowed into the country legally.



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 12:25 PM
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a reply to: network dude

That was a one of the best episodes of Jesse Ventura's show!



posted on Aug, 28 2019 @ 12:31 PM
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a reply to: tanstaafl


From the OP:



Now Families will get to stay together in detention until court hearings.



Critics of the Flores Settlement Agreement, which was based on the more liberal 9th circuit court ruling, have noted that the majority of family units never make it to court once they are released into the United States. Further, the statistics show that the families can stay up to eight years before going to court by using other loopholes in the system as an alternative to detention.

As of 2018, “ICE’s overall Average Length of Stay (ALOS) in detention is 39.8 days, but the average length of time for an alien to remain on a non-detained docket is close to 1300 days.”




They aren't detained until their Asylum process is completed.


From your own post:



"The new policy means that migrant families who are detained after crossing the border can be kept indefinitely, until their cases are decided.



posted on Aug, 29 2019 @ 03:32 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
Critics of the Flores Settlement Agreement, which was based on the more liberal 9th circuit court ruling, have noted that the majority of family units never make it to court once they are released into the United States. Further, the statistics show that the families can stay up to eight years before going to court by using other loopholes in the system as an alternative to detention.

Can... meaning, they can manipulate the system to extend the process up to 8 years.

That isn't how long the actual process takes, that is how long they can game the system.


"They aren't detained until their Asylum process is completed."

From your own post:

""The new policy means that migrant families who are detained after crossing the border can be kept indefinitely, until their cases are decided."

You are correct, I was mistaken... indeed, according to the OP, it only takes 45-60 days for the entire process:

"Basically, detention centers couldn’t hold family units for more than 20 days, even though it takes roughly 45 to 60 days to complete their immigration proceedings."

The reference to things taking years is the comment in the Flores case being taken totally out of context, just like you are doing.

It only takes years if the ones here illegally game the system for as long as possible.



posted on Aug, 29 2019 @ 03:44 PM
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a reply to: tanstaafl

"Game the system" Right. Sigh.



posted on Aug, 29 2019 @ 04:03 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: tanstaafl

"Game the system" Right.

From the OP:

"Further, the statistics show that the families can stay up to eight years before going to court by using other loopholes in the system as an alternative to detention."

I think 'gaming the system' is a fine analogy of "... using other loopholes in the system..." ?



posted on Aug, 29 2019 @ 04:39 PM
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a reply to: tanstaafl

Right. Loopholes. Sigh.

I guarantee you, if your freedom was at stake, you'd try to get a lawyer that knew the system and used everything he had to get you the justice you deserve.

One man's loophole is another man's appeal, or time for a chance to present evidence.



posted on Aug, 29 2019 @ 05:33 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: tanstaafl

Right. Loopholes. Sigh.

I guarantee you, if your freedom was at stake, you'd try to get a lawyer that knew the system and used everything he had to get you the justice you deserve.

One man's loophole is another man's appeal, or time for a chance to present evidence.


Just admit that you want amnesty for all. Because those coming legally seem to have no problems other that waiting.



posted on Aug, 30 2019 @ 02:08 PM
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originally posted by: Sookiechacha
I guarantee you, if your freedom was at stake, you'd try to get a lawyer that knew the system and used everything he had to get you the justice you deserve.

One man's loophole is another man's appeal, or time for a chance to present evidence.

Where did I or anyone else in this thread say that we blamed the ones gaming the system? In fact we said the opposite. We blame Congress, The Presidents, the DOJ and the Courts who have allowed this to happen.

This is why we are very happy that someone - namely Trump - is finally actually doping everything in his power to fix the damn problem.



posted on Aug, 30 2019 @ 05:52 PM
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originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
I guarantee you, if your freedom was at stake, you'd try to get a lawyer that knew the system and used everything he had to get you the justice you deserve.

One man's loophole is another man's appeal, or time for a chance to present evidence.

Where did I or anyone else in this thread say that we blamed the ones gaming the system? In fact we said the opposite. We blame Congress, The Presidents, the DOJ and the Courts who have allowed this to happen.

This is why we are very happy that someone - namely Trump - is finally actually doping everything in his power to fix the damn problem.


I also blame those showing them the loopholes.



posted on Aug, 30 2019 @ 06:04 PM
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a reply to: Wardaddy454





Just admit that you want amnesty for all.


Just admit that you're so blinded by hate and bias, that you can't discuss this issue without going into hyperbolic spasms of extremism.



edit on 30-8-2019 by Sookiechacha because: (no reason given)



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