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POLITICS: New Bankruptcy Bill Protects Rich: Squeezes Troops, Everyone Else

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posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 07:56 AM
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The new bankrutpcy law protects the rich, but prevents most people from starting over. The new law stipulates that bankruptcy will no longer apply to credit card debt. Wealthy people can protect their money by putting it in "asset protection trusts" and in traditional "spendthrift trusts" before declaring bankrupcy. Wherever the owner lives, the courts can't touch asset protection trusts in Alaska, Delaware, Nevada, Rhode Island and Utah banks, or in foreign banks. Spendthrift trusts in any state are off-limits. Also, millionaire homes are protected in Florida and Texas; many rich people buy such homes before going bankrupt. On Tuesday, Senate Republicans killed the amendments that tried to soften the effects of the bankruptcy bill on military personnel. Critics say the bill mainly benefits credit card companies, whose record level profits will be protected and soon climb even higher. The bill is expected to pass the Senate this coming week.

 



www.iht.com
Bankruptcy legislation being debated by the U.S. Senate is designed to make it harder for people to walk away from their credit card and other debts. But legal experts say the proposed law leaves open an increasingly popular loophole that lets wealthy people protect substantial assets from creditors even after filing for bankruptcy.

The loophole involves the use of so-called asset protection trusts.

For years, wealthy people looking to keep their money out of the reach of domestic creditors have set up these trusts offshore. But since 1997, lawmakers in five states - Alaska, Delaware, Nevada, Rhode Island and Utah - have passed legislation exempting assets held domestically in such trusts from the federal bankruptcy code. People who want to establish one of these trusts do not have to reside in any of the five states; they need only set it up through an institution located there.


........

But if it passes - and only long-shot players are betting against it now - the real winners will be the credit-card companies, which will not have to charge off as many losses as they do now. And their profits, which are at already at record levels, will climb even higher.

www.prospect.org...

.........

Stung by two days of defeat for their bids to revise a bill overhauling the bankruptcy laws, Senate Democrats are portraying the measure as making it harder for low-income, elderly and sick people to dissolve their debts while allowing the wealthy to shelter assets.

www.sddt.com...





Please visit the link provided for the complete story.


US jobs are disappearing. Americans are sick and getting sicker. As Kerry pointed out in October, 100 million Americans are chronically disabled. Infectious epidemics and pollution-caused diseases are rampant in the USA - and they're affecting Americans' ability to work and pay debts.

46% of US personal bankruptcies involve health problems, and Americans are becoming disabled and dysfunctional at younger ages. The soon-to-come bird flu epidemic will add to the already substantial economic toll. Those who die will be lucky. Those who live to become chronically ill will be SOL.





The new H5N1 virus has spread to 10 countries since cropping up in Hong Kong eight years ago. More than 70 percent of the known human cases have been fatal. And though most of the victims have had direct contact with birds, researchers have recently described several instances of person-to-person transmission.

New Fears of a Bird-Flu Pandemic

Also see: Flu cases rise in U.S.; Peak may be Ahead

WHO warns of bird flu pandemic





This new bankruptcy bill insulates the rich against the economic impacts of the "restructured" American economy and widespread epidemics. It ensures that creditors can go after everyone else, and take vulnerable Americans' homes and all of their personal assets.

Americans who are foolish enough to think they might have something to leave their children just got cut off at the pass.

So much for the American dream. It only applies to the already stinking rich. Ditto for Social Security - the planned revisions are a just different nail in the same coffin.

Our forefathers knew how the rich operate. They fought hard to win us protections against their tricks. Now, the Bush government is dismantling all our safety nets and civil liberties. Who knows what it will take to get them back, and rebuild America for Americans.




Mad Cow Madness
Poison DUst: Depleted Uranium Kills
The Final Solution
Bush Pushes to Limit Class-Action Suits


Latest news: Reuters
NYTimes



Related News Links:
www.pbs.org
www.mercurynews.com
www.longmontfyi.com
www.boston.com

[edit on 5-3-2005 by soficrow]

[edit on 5-3-2005 by soficrow]

[edit on 5-3-2005 by Banshee]




posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 09:04 AM
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Doesn't that ring any alarmbells with some of our Republican boardmembers, surely they are not all millionaires and must have creditcards as well ?

I know they adhere the philosophy that creating favourable circumstances for companies creates better economy and hence more prosperity for the average man than drainign liberal things such as solial security waterhead (and there are some things to say for that), but SURELY , where you guys draw the line with support for giving the big players nearly unlimited power?


[edit on 5-3-2005 by Countermeasures]



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 09:04 AM
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Make the rich richer.. the motto of capitalism!

So passing new protectionist legislation is not really news imo it's how things "work" .

The biggest giveaway to the real agenda of captalism is surely the title "war on poverty".

Come on we all know the real name fo the concept of eradicating poverty is called "the RE-DISTRUBUTION of wealth"! But of course that is just not on the agenda.. come on actually start sharing wealth? Might as well make filesharing legal then and cancel the 3rd world debt.. oh and while were at it scrap this idea of capitalism alltogether!


NAAAAHH! Well just have another WAR thank you very much.. this time on poverty for a change.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 09:05 AM
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"The Rich get richer and the poor get F***** over and out"

Good post Soficrow, where will it all end? (Actually dont answer that..)



[edit on 5-3-2005 by MERC]



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 09:12 AM
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A friend of mine says that laws are created to protect the rich from the middle class.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 10:32 AM
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Hundreds of thousands of republicans are in the reaches of bankruptcies, as well as democrat--you'd better start paying attention to what this bunch of Nazi's are doing to the future of this country. Yes Isaid Nazis--bu#es.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 10:40 AM
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It's interesting that they are going to pass this bill as interest rates are rising. They know that record bankrupcies are on their way due to most people getting a floating interest rate on their new house or equity mortgage.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 10:45 AM
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If we should be so lucky to survive until 2008, i hope the heck whoever takes over reverses all of this crap. This is just incredible. No wonder big corporations love the Bushman.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 10:51 AM
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Everyone should cancel their credit cards from banks that are huge
supporters of Bush.
Like citibank and bank of america who are just a couple that have
contributed huge amounts of money to the Bush administration.

And when you cancel tell them the reason why.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 11:12 AM
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Incredible find Sofi. Great background info too. Well done as always. Is it my imagination or is the Bush administration getting more blatant with each passing day?

When are people going to stand up and say enough!?? I'm mad as hell and not going to take it anymore!

Every time I see him on t.v. now I have to hit mute to keep from barfing. I can't listen to him and everytime I see his name in print I shudder.

Every word out of his mouth is a lie and I can't believe he still has so much support out there. Freaking scary if you ask me. Wonder if that will change as time goes on. For the sake of the U.S. and the wider world, I sure as hell hope so.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 11:19 AM
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I may be dead wrong here, but does this look to you like Bush is setting a huge powerbase with these huge corporations so they will back him when he refuses to step down by next elections? DICTATORSHIP.

I cant shake that notion. Its not even that bizarre or far fetched, people.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 11:44 AM
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You're right Merc, you REALLY don't want to know where this is going. I found out anyway though. Read at your own risk.

It took some looking (10 or 15 minutes, which is 3 times longer than something this simple should take) to track down this bill. Part of the problem is that it's not on Senator Grassley's web page; if I didn't know better I'd say he doesn't want constituents reading it. His web page only contains info on older attempts he has made to ammend chapter 12 of the bankruptcy code in the interest of farmers; it looks like he's trying to create confusion by omitting the new one and posting the old one.

www.govtrack.us...
Unfortunately this website stopped responding right after an error of some kind killed my first attempt to post this, so I wont be able to quote the summaries of the bill which can be found at that link if it will work for you.
The senate bill is S. 256 by the way, so you can find it elsewhere if needbe.
The bill is going to change the laws for chapter 7, essentially putting the debtor on an allowance and giving everything else to payment, if I understand correctly. Of course this allowance ensures no Cost Of Living Adjustment for the ever increasing cost of gasoline, not to mention rent which I have personally seen go up 20% in some areas virtually overnight a couple years ago.

The bill also has an interesting feature in Section 201 you might want to check out. It looks good, but it's not. If a creditor rejects a reasonable arrangement offered by you or a debt management company, the debt is reduced by 20%. Sounds good? What that means is that if a company acts in bad faith and nets a profit of more than 20% of the total debt, they are allowed to profit from their wrongdoing.
Example: You have two DVDs from a local video store and they go missing. You contact the store immediately and they want 25 bucks each for replacement. You say OK, i'll pay you 10 bucks a week and we'll be square next month. They say "we're going to charge you the late fee of a dollar a day for each DVD until they are replaced, as the rental agreement allows- the minimum payment is therefore 15 dollars a week, and at that rate you will be able to pay us back in full after 50 weeks of payments for a total cost of 750 dollars. You tell them to go soddomize themselves- a month later you pay the 50 bucks for the DVDs and tell them you consider the issue resolved. A year later you declare bankruptcy, and the video store comes calling. They are entitled to 80% of the total debt, even though most of it was accumulated due to their action in bad faith. You pay a grand total of 600 dollars for two DVDs.
Ridiculous, probably impossible? Yes. Illegal? No.

Economics will be the key to removing our freedoms. Economics is always the fallback point for tyrants when direct tyranny is abolished. Look at indentured servitude for example.
NAFTA serves as one arm of this- defining most aspects of life as one form of trade or another and bringing them under trans-border corporatism. To govern those freedoms which can not by any contrivance come under the definition of trade however, it will be necessary to place "persons" (the days of being considered citizens under the law are just about over) in economic bondage so that they can be ruled over by coercive agreements with their employers and creditors such as those enforced by employers which have been gaining attention recently. These developments will make us serfs- bound by debt to our jobs and mandatory consumption of certain goods and services.

Where is this going Merc? I warned you that you read at your own risk. It's going to a future where everyone is bankrupt and will work for their room and board while they pay into debts that they can never hope to settle. Your creditors will own your home and will be able to relocate you and retask you to best pay down your debt. You'll be able to go out and have a good time still, see a movie and have a soda and all those nice things, and your kids will have a play station in the bedroom. But you can't move where you like. You can't necessarily choose which brands of products you consume. You may not be allowed to have kids if your creditors don't feel it would be viable. Whatever you want to do will have to be within the framework of what is profitable for others.

By the by...
This bill would have passed in 2002, but Senator Wellstone stood against it alone and delayed it with proceedure until the end of the session. Apparently the democrats couldn't thumb their nose at the big money, so they picked one man to do the right thing for all of them.
Senator Wellstone died in a plane crash later that year- 11 days before the election.
The quote below is from another board (I haven't linked to it because I'm not sure about the rules). I bring it up because I'm curious about its validity.

All the explanations given thus far do not hold water. It wasn't inclementweather; it wasn't pilot error; it wasn't machine malfunction. There were gunshots heard by several witnesses in the area (this has disappeared from press reports).


ATS Links on Wellstone's death.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.abovetopsecret.com...
www.ntsb.gov...



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 11:44 AM
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excellent post...


and btw...there IS NO MIDDLE CLASS anymore...it's gone, trust me...we are on the fast track to "them that has, and them that don't"....as the old saying goes.

As each day passes, yes, Das Bushmeister is getting more and more blatent...and he and his cronies will continue...there is no end to what they have planned...years of "work" and "planning" are being brought to fruition right under our noses...and NO ONE will be safe, unless you were part of the origional "plan" to begin with...or you are a corporation.

Thing is, time is running out with each day...wake up and smell the coffee, people...don't let the door slam shut without at least trying to keep it open...'cause once it is shut, that's all she wrote.

~oracle



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 12:33 PM
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as posted by Oracle
...and btw...there IS NO MIDDLE CLASS anymore...it's gone, trust me...we are on the fast track to "them that has, and them that don't"....as the old saying goes.


Perhaps a good read of Marx's Material Determinism and the 'History of Man' (dialectic process: the Hegaelian Dialectic) would be fruitful? Exploiters and exploited.
These might help?
define: Marxism
The above link has some insightful and informative links and are quite Historical when applied to social class 'warfare'.

THE HEGELIAN DIALECTIC

And there is a 'middle class': petti-bourgeoisie, etc.



seekerof

[edit on 5-3-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 01:27 PM
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Originally posted by Seekerof

And there is a 'middle class': petti-bourgeoisie, etc.





It's rapidly disappearing. ...Many economists have noted the disappearance of the middle class, and the concentration of wealth in the already rich upper classes.

...The so-called "professional class" might think they're middle class but most are about 2 paychecks away from homelessness and could be wiped out by a burp in the stock market.



BTW - Don't even ask for references. I won't risk another "excessive quoting" penalty from you. And no, it's not the points. It's the principle.


.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 01:44 PM
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Originally posted by elaine
Everyone should cancel their credit cards from banks that are huge
supporters of Bush.
Like citibank and bank of america who are just a couple that have
contributed huge amounts of money to the Bush administration.

And when you cancel tell them the reason why.



you'd cancel your credit card and tell them that the reason for cancelling it is because a new law is being passed that says you can't file bankruptcy and walk away from the credit card debt? That's like saying you won't shop at the local grocery store anymore because they don't allow you to steal.


Incidentally, you don't have to be rich to set up a trust. The attornies I deal with usually charge $750 to $1500 for the average trust.

Now, there are some things I find deplorable with regards to the bankruptcy laws we have. Donald Trump filing for bankruptcy is a joke. The laws should be changed to ensure that guys like Trump don't get to keep their yachts, planes, cars etc. One or two cars at most is all a family needs. file for bankruptcy and learn to take the train, bus or fly coach.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 02:00 PM
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Originally posted by Crakeur

Originally posted by elaine
Everyone should cancel their credit cards from banks that are huge
supporters of Bush.
Like citibank and bank of america who are just a couple that have
contributed huge amounts of money to the Bush administration.

And when you cancel tell them the reason why.



you'd cancel your credit card and tell them that the reason for cancelling it is because a new law is being passed that says you can't file bankruptcy and walk away from the credit card debt? That's like saying you won't shop at the local grocery store anymore because they don't allow you to steal.







Good point. Funny.


Elaine - you do have a good idea - just don't quote Crakeur.







Donald Trump filing for bankruptcy is a joke. The laws should be changed to ensure that guys like Trump don't get to keep their yachts, planes, cars etc. One or two cars at most is all a family needs. file for bankruptcy and learn to take the train, bus or fly coach.



That's the point Crakeur - the laws are set up to protect the rich - and leave folks who are seriously in trouble out to hang.



.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 02:17 PM
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This doesn't surprise me one bit.

I wonder how many Republican voters feel betrayed right now - well, there'll be a lot more of you soon enough. And you brought it all on yourselves.

I do feel sorry for the poor buggers who didn't vote for Bush but still have to deal with his greed and warmongering.



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 02:25 PM
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Originally posted by Countermeasures
Doesn't that ring any alarmbells with some of our Republican boardmembers, surely they are not all millionaires and must have creditcards as well ?


NO I am not rich, and I prefer the term middle middle class. However, given the revolving bankrupcy door and given the total lack of personal repsonsability that seems to be the norm these days, the bankrupcy protections have simply gotten out of hand.

It has moved from a good intended law that was supposed to be used as a last resort method to a legal/business strategy. SO who really is going to lose here? Not the businesses that have to take a hit when someone shrugs and said, I'm bankrupt I do not have to pay you, to the consumers of that companies product who shake thier heads and mutter "I remember when this used to cost ........, " So who really loses out here? Ah yes, the trial lawyers who are truly the only winners when somebody goies bankrupt.

Having a credit card is not nor has it ever been a ticket to live beyond your means. You chose to do so and therefore assume responsability for your actions. PERIOD



posted on Mar, 5 2005 @ 02:31 PM
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Originally posted by FredT

given the revolving bankrupcy door and given the total lack of personal repsonsability that seems to be the norm these days, the bankrupcy protections have simply gotten out of hand.





Because of spreading epidemics, rising costs for health care AND insurance, and a "restructured" economy. PLUS a great big expensive war in Iraq, LOTS of pork and more coming. FYI - the guys who "restructured" our economy new exactly what the effects would be.

But you want ordinary people to take personal responsibility for this mess? I don't think so.



.



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