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Is it guns or something else...

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posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 10:30 AM
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originally posted by: Notoneofyou
a reply to: DictionaryOfExcuses
Just be careful with your ammunition choices. A lot of cheap shot has lead in it. Bad for you, and nature


I hadn't even considered it. I currently target practice with common "daisy" brand shot that is labelled "stainless steel". They're rather inexpensive and wouldn't be surprised to find a CA Prop 65 label if I inspected a package.

Now I know. Thanks.




posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 11:16 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Vroomfondel



Yet no one is trying to ban cars.

Who is trying to ban gunz?


There are several candidates who openly call for bans and you know it. Stop hiding behind semantics. Whether it is one gun or all guns there are more than enough examples to satisfactorily answer your question. Banning any gun is by definition a gun ban. Surely this concept does not escape you?



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 11:26 AM
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originally posted by: Phage

What is the greatest number of people killed by a single car in the US?


Unfair question since we can use a gun now, but humans tend to find a way in whatever they want to do. The question is how many people could you kill with a car if you planned it right, and I would say more than 50 easily. A person could walk into an old folks home with a big knife and kill 50 too...many many ways a human can go if that is their goal.

The other question is whether mass killings is actually the biggest issue here or is it fueled by political agendas and the media "if it bleeds it reads" mentality. We have gang related murders that is about 9000 out of the 11,000 total gun murders per year, and all that is out of a population of 340 million, so what is the bigger problem?

The other question is how many mass killings would have been stopped with extreme back ground checks or thought police type actions? I bet close to zero since most go from zero to mass killing in one instance.

Add in thought police and we are talking 1984 type crap. Ban all guns and you will not have fixed the root cause of why a person wants to kill in the first place. They can also go under ground and kill 1 or two people over and over and over for years if that is their desire.

What is the root cause in all this Phage? Just the desire to kill anyone for no reason is really the main factor here that we need to look at as to why. I mean who the hell decides to to shoot up a group of people on a whim including your sister, or go get lunch at a Walmart then go to your car and come back and kill people?

At the end of the day what is still the bigger problem to solve..gang related killings or single incidences of mass killings? Remember the weekend after these two mass killings there were 3 within hours of each other in Chicago alone, but no real news on them though.

Murder of any kind is not even close to being in the top 100 leading causes of death each year. Suicide by gun is 95th out of the top 100.



edit on 19-8-2019 by Xtrozero because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 11:55 AM
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a reply to: Phage

Hand guns are responsible for the overwhelming majority of gun homicides.

Rifle of all kinds, including “assault rifles” account for less than 500 homicides per year, according to published FBI stats.

It’s not even close, so why do politicians and the media focus almost exclusively on banning “assault rifles”?



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 12:47 PM
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a reply to: Notoneofyou

You missed my point. I simply imply that comparing cars with guns is not appropriate.

Very few people get into their car with the thought that they may use it to kill someone. Most who use them are using them for transport and deaths from them are usually accidental. Despite this there are lots of things that have to be in place before you can use one because without these things there is a greater chance of you killing yourself or someone else, and there is a way of tracking you should you do something wrong. I understand the comparison from sports car to crap car, however imagine the young driver with no driving lessons and no test, or imagine what would happen if they did wrap the car around someone and they fled with no registration or insurance. Yet people carry firearms with no other purpose than in case they have to do harm to someone in self defence or otherwise and have none of this in place.

There are restrictions as to the type of vehicle you can legally drive without appropriate licenses. Insurance costs go up with high risk groups. You can be banned from driving if deemed dangerous on the road. Different licenses have different medical requirements. The differences go on.

Judging by the responses so far in this thread, this is not going to be a popular opinion, but here goes.

As you have stated in previous posts, guns have been available for a long time yet mass shootings seem to have have gone up greatly in recent years. There are likely many reasons for this, however the fact is that they HAVE gone up. Something in society has changed. It may be media glamorising criminals/popular culture/limited access to mental health care/access to extreme material through the internet/blue smarties/whatever. I don't know and neither do you.

That being the case then it is logical that, until those reasons and causes have been identified, reducing access to items which are purposely designed to easily kill large numbers of people rapidly and at range makes sense. I find the argument that they will find another way to kill lots of people questionable. It simply hasn't been evident elsewhere in the world. I refuse to accept that Americans are more prone to violence than the rest of the civilised world, yet the murder rate is so much higher.

As a responsible shooter I dislike the idea of limiting access to guns, but I am also a realist. The other option is to leave it as it is in the hope we can figure out what is causing it soon, and accept that people will die until this happens however long it takes.

Standing by for incoming.
edit on 19 8 2019 by PaddyInf because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 01:16 PM
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a reply to: Phage

So are ramming vehicles, alcohol and kitchen knives...ban them all...



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 01:32 PM
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You have a culture obsessed over a tool designed to do one and only one thing.

Its no surprise that nutbags use the tools as they are intended to be.

Also, please stop comparing auto accidents to gun deaths, auto accidents lack intent, hence the word "accident". Unless someone has a source for an accidental mass shooting. ( Oh wait, that never happened)

Its literally easier to buy a firearm than it is to pay cash for car.

Clown fiesta.



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 01:34 PM
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originally posted by: Deny Arrogance
a reply to: Phage

Hand guns are responsible for the overwhelming majority of gun homicides.

Rifle of all kinds, including “assault rifles” account for less than 500 homicides per year, according to published FBI stats.

It’s not even close, so why do politicians and the media focus almost exclusively on banning “assault rifles”?



Do you not find it odd for someone to decree the media is full of bs, yet continues to consume said media and express outrage?



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 02:14 PM
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a reply to: DictionaryOfExcuses

No laughing here. Slingshots are no joke. A truly skilled user can put a lot of meat on the table with one.

They can be scarily powerful, too. Quick. Silent. Deadly. Oh, no...no laughter, at all.

Oh, and squirrel is good eating.



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 04:23 PM
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a reply to: Phage
I remember when swords and spear and bows and arrows were hard to get (from a historical perspective, not because I lived 500 years ago). And then only the oppressive governments and criminal bandits had them. Either way, it was always the unarmed civilians who ended up suffering when either a Monarch's Knights, or roaming bandits would come to pillage and loot a small village.

Heck, a dozen trained knights/soldiers routinely and easily killed scores or more with bladed and club weapons because the population did not have sufficient weapons to counter them. Thankfully the age of gunpowder put an end to those days, unless you live in a liberal district where your right to life is restricted because you are discouraged from defending yourself properly.

It seems like the gun control advocates want to return to the days when neighborhoods and small towns could be easily plundered by criminals or fascists due to a disarmed population.

Today's guns are yesterday's swords. Restrict them today, and we get the same wanton disregard of liberty and the slaughter that follows as the past when blades were the rule of law.

Everything in context people.



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 04:37 PM
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originally posted by: underwerks
If it's really about mental health like all the right wingers constantly say, then stop making it damn near impossible for most people to afford healthcare.

Y'alls excuses aren't lining up. You can't in one breath send thoughts and prayers and lament how it's a mental health problem, then the next second do everything you can to make mental healthcare inaccessible.


Joe Nutjob isn't about money, its about being able to identify potential problems early on. Teachers used to have more freedom identifying possible problem children but now its no child left behind, some cant handle being in the mainstream but get shuffled through the system with warning flags everywhere.

Not oversimplify but it's like on Mindhunter, where they are exploring the causes motives and triggers. What's making Joe freak and not the rest of the 99.9% of the population.



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 05:03 PM
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My guess is Big Pharma doesn't want uncomfortable questions asked and politicians dont want to lose the payoffs from Big Pharma, welp that's all I got rip it up, attack me or what have you I am so tired of seeing the same argument and everyone defaults to Congress do something... yet Congress also was going to fix health care and save us 2500 a year instead we got a 400% increase in cost in many places.


Yes, same here in The Netherlands. The government started to privatise social services like postal services, healtcare insurance, public transportation and what not. This was all for the benifit of the people... the competition among the providers would reduce cost for the consumer. Okay, that makes sense and sounds like progress...everybody wins. In every aspect of these services the quality has demisnished and the cost increased. The weird thing is that changing everything back the way it was is out of the question. What is going on here.

Now why...? The people in government who made these decisions are in most cases highly educated and expected to be able to think at a certain logical level. Why is it that they (in power at the time) all failed to make the right call and be an asset to the people.

I can tell you what is going on here... global corruption. People who make some 10.000 dollars a month are not interested and have no idea what is going on among the ordinairy people. If they can be pampered by voting for the interests of the multinationals and have no problem with paying a few dollars more each year...for each of all those services they do not care or think how it will be for the lesser incomes.

And that is how it is with everything...everywhere.






posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 06:32 PM
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a reply to: PaddyInf

As you stated, it is a cultural and character of person flaw.

I agree with that.

People should go back to being responsible parents/family units.

With all these over emotional, quick to temper humans running around-the problem is still the humans.

If you can't be responsible, and aren't capable of being told no, which is large part of maturing- you have no damn buisness with anything that could be a weapon. Be it a vehicle or firearm, or fork.

Stupid and childish is unacceptable. People can grow the hell up, and quit acting like babies.

I'm not giving my or anyone else's constitutional rights away because some ego-sensitive crybaby looks like a bitch and can't deal with it.

That's that persons problem, not mine.



posted on Aug, 19 2019 @ 07:15 PM
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The gun doesn't pull its own trigger. The knife doesn't leap up and stab anyone while in a box. The hands do punch or choke someone to death since they are controlled by the unit they are attached to.



posted on Aug, 20 2019 @ 08:16 AM
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a reply to: Irishhaf

The global elites don't like the public armed. It is quite simple. Why would all democrat candidates be so "anti-gun" except for the fact that some of their biggest donors, like Soros, want the people disarmed? It's easier that way to implement draconian laws that no one in their right mind would accept.



posted on Aug, 20 2019 @ 09:16 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Irishhaf




Why are we so obsessed with focusing on the tool used for the killings and not the why behind it?

Name a tool which makes it so easy to kill so many. That's the basic idea.

Gas?
Bombs?
Chemicals?



posted on Aug, 20 2019 @ 11:06 AM
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a reply to: Phage

A car
Fertilizer
Matches
edit on 20-8-2019 by Dfairlite because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 20 2019 @ 11:08 AM
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a reply to: Phage




Name a tool which makes it so easy to kill so many.


The US congress.



posted on Aug, 20 2019 @ 11:10 AM
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Is it guns or something else...

Stupidity.

Blaming an object for something that's been made illegal. Then creating more laws violating every single person in this country's civil liberty.

Is the epitome of stupidity.



posted on Aug, 20 2019 @ 07:36 PM
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originally posted by: underwerks
If it's really about mental health like all the right wingers constantly say, then stop making it damn near impossible for most people to afford healthcare.

Y'alls excuses aren't lining up. You can't in one breath send thoughts and prayers and lament how it's a mental health problem, then the next second do everything you can to make mental healthcare inaccessible.


Sure can. Every shooter had a history of taking some sort of drug which the side effect is suicidal thoughts. Suicidal thoughts can lead to harm to others. Not just ones self.

And why does someone have to be a right winger when they mention mental issues? That's basically equivalent to being a racist. Because I agree mental health is the issue I'm somehow a right winger? What if I like watermelon and fried chicken?




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