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Epstein autopsy "inconclusive"

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posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 06:51 PM
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originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity
a reply to: KKLOCO

Weird that they dont even wanna come out and say there is a delay. They seem to feel that appearing out of control is better than the alternative right now.


Maybe the coroner and the 3rd party (celebrity) pathologist, disagree on the cause of death...




posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 06:51 PM
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a reply to: Vroomfondel

funny .... i would believe the alien autopsy being real over this bovine excrement



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 06:53 PM
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a reply to: Thecakeisalie

I read that he hung himself with a bed sheet tied to the top rail of a bunk bed. He had to lean into the make-shift noose to strangle himself. He was not completely suspended as his feet or lower legs were touching the floor. His body weight would still most likely be enough to cause ischemia if he had the will to remain in that position and denied the reflex action of trying to save himself.

My question is if he was in a single occupant cell why was there a bunk bed?



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 06:57 PM
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a reply to: Rhombus101

The flight logs were not properly maintained from what I could see. You are correct that they should have the names of everyone who was on board when the plane was airborne. These logs, however, had many instances of initials rather than names, what appeared to be code names or nicknames, and in regards to the underage girls some of them were only vague descriptions such as "thin blonde girl". Its like they didn't even rate high enough to have names in his book. They were just property that happened to be on board at the time. But the clintons were mentioned no less than 26 times.

Sickening.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 06:58 PM
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originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Vroomfondel

funny .... i would believe the alien autopsy being real over this bovine excrement



Well there was a video of that one, so yeah...

Funny, but even if there was a video of this one, I doubt I would believe it.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 07:06 PM
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a reply to: Vroomfondel

ha ha yeah, i doubt anything we hear about this case will be believable.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 07:15 PM
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a reply to: F4guy

Thank you for an informative response from a position of experience and education.

My work was also forensic in nature in Engineering. I performed failure analysis.

I believe there are several significant variations in the way we would perform our respective duties, but I believe the end result of mode and method would remain somewhat constant. In my world it would be something like a pressure vessel that leaked. The mode of failure, for purpose of discussion, would be a pin-hole leak. The method might be puncture, abrasion, corrosion, material defect, etc.

Unless the evidence was destroyed as a result of the catastrophic failure, I was nearly always able to determine the root cause of the failure and document the progression from beginning to end. Only in the most severe cases where whole sections were blown apart or burned away was it not possible to pinpoint the exact cause. Even then, it was possible to provide a very detailed and presumably accurate scenario based on the known facts, surroundings, and remaining evidence. I have to believe with a body intact, and allegedly the means of suicide still in place that a reasonably confident conclusion can be met.

I find it unfathomable that random prisoners or personnel would have access to such a high profile prisoner. I can't imagine he was in anything that even remotely resembled an open cell block general population area.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 07:19 PM
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originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: F4guy


A Coroner or Medical Examiner makes two findings. One is the cause of death. The other is the manner of death.


Thank you! This has been bugging me


Do you think it's safe to assume that the need for "further information" for a final conclusion regards manner of death as opposed to cause of death?

I'm assuming so, because the DOJ has stated it is an "apparent suicide," so there must be something obvious for them to state this. So I'm figuring the know what killed him, but not who killed him.

And I really don't know if the MCC would be required to give the ME any/all such evidence.


I think it's very likely that the remaining question is as to manner. The DOJ statement is whatever Barr wants it to be. It is not the ME's job to figure out the who, just the how, sometimes the when, and the underlying manner. It was my experience that the how was the easiest, the when somewhat more complicated, and the manner he result of more art than science. I mean, I can, on a good day, pull DNA from a fart, but I can't tell who farted or why. A coroner can call for a formal inquest and issue subpoenas but how do you know if the testimony is true or the evidence fabricated. That's one reason I went back to flying big airplanes and investigating crashes. Fewer liars.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 07:29 PM
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Two person cell

a reply to: Vroomfondel


Epstein, who was found dead in his cell on Saturday, had no cellmate. The man assigned to his cell was abruptly transferred to another cell on Friday and another cellmate was not assigned, The Washington Post reported.

Investigators “are still exploring” why the cellmate was suddenly transferred, the Post said.

Link



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 07:30 PM
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a reply to: LSU2018

and left him alone...



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 07:42 PM
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a reply to: Vroomfondel

1. Cause of death isn't always readily apparent. Toxicology probably isn't back yet.

2. I have worked extreme overtime. It is a killer via stress levels. People in my profession are often ordered for an additional shift if there is a shortage of staff. It is not uncommon to work 16 hour days, four or five days in a row.

Try it sometime. It isn't easy, especially in a high-stress environment.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 08:12 PM
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a reply to: roadgravel

Thank you. I suppose it makes sense to have the capacity whether they intend to use it every time or not.

Still, two person bunk is six feet tall, as is Epstein. Add in some length to hang from and his head was four or five feet from the floor at most. He could almost reach down and hold himself up with his hands at that point, not to mention grabbing the lower bunk for support.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 08:16 PM
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originally posted by: Vroomfondel
a reply to: Thecakeisalie

I read that he hung himself with a bed sheet tied to the top rail of a bunk bed. He had to lean into the make-shift noose to strangle himself. He was not completely suspended as his feet or lower legs were touching the floor. His body weight would still most likely be enough to cause ischemia if he had the will to remain in that position and denied the reflex action of trying to save himself.

My question is if he was in a single occupant cell why was there a bunk bed?

He had a bunk mate up till a few hrs before his death..what an interesting coincidence. I also am guessing all the cells are dual bunks..just a guess though.

I see Roadgravel covered it
edit on 13-8-2019 by vonclod because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 08:18 PM
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a reply to: Creep Thumper

I have worked double shifts before, granted that was a long time ago. But even then, there were state and federal regulations on how many hours in a row a person could work, how many hours without a break, how many hours without a rest period, etc. Different types of work take a toll on a person in different ways. Being physically exhausted is different from being mentally exhausted, but both can be debilitating.

I cant say what it is like working doubles as a prison guard. I imagine its not pleasant. Were these guards able to perform their duties correctly?



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 08:20 PM
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a reply to: F4guy

Correct me if I’m wrong.

If they have concluded the cause of death. (asphyxiation)

But if they haven’t concluded the manner of his death. (the only reason I can think of is defense of wounds)

Is there a possibility they won’t release the autopsy because of an ongoing criminal investigation ?



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 09:47 PM
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originally posted by: Vroomfondel
a reply to: Creep Thumper

I have worked double shifts before, granted that was a long time ago. But even then, there were state and federal regulations on how many hours in a row a person could work, how many hours without a break, how many hours without a rest period, etc. Different types of work take a toll on a person in different ways. Being physically exhausted is different from being mentally exhausted, but both can be debilitating.

I cant say what it is like working doubles as a prison guard. I imagine its not pleasant. Were these guards able to perform their duties correctly?


I'm guessing not. When you're that tired you are constantly making mistakes. I did. I even told my supervisor, when ordered for yet another double shift, that I was not in the condition to protect anyone, even myself.

He told me to talk to my union or get another job.



posted on Aug, 13 2019 @ 11:17 PM
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originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: Vroomfondel

funny .... i would believe the alien autopsy being real over this bovine excrement



Now THAT made me laugh out loud.



posted on Aug, 14 2019 @ 04:34 AM
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a reply to: F4guy

Thank you. That all makes sense.


A coroner can call for a formal inquest and issue subpoenas but how do you know if the testimony is true or the evidence fabricated.


I'm embarrassed to say that an inquest hearing never even occurred to me!


That's one reason I went back to flying big airplanes and investigating crashes. Fewer liars.


That makes the most sense of all!



posted on Aug, 14 2019 @ 06:33 AM
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a reply to: Vroomfondel




Exactly what part of 'death by hanging' leaves two professional Medical Examiners with a final analysis of "inconclusive"?


When and where was this statement made?



posted on Aug, 14 2019 @ 09:16 AM
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originally posted by: InfiniteTrinity
a reply to: Vroomfondel




Exactly what part of 'death by hanging' leaves two professional Medical Examiners with a final analysis of "inconclusive"?


When and where was this statement made?


To which statement are you referring?




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