"Islam is incompatible with the Western World" - discuss

originally posted by: Grenade
I think you could apply the statement that all traditional religions when taken literally are incompatible with western society.

Have a read at the Christian Bible to see how wonderful and inclusive that particular book is toward polygamy or homosexuality.

Yes, that whole part about loving the sinner and avoiding the sin is super harsh.

It's about interpretation and common sense.

I live in London, my particular area is predominantly Muslim, they haven't ever caused me any harm and couldn't be more friendly.

In other words, they are modern moderate muslims who do not follow the Quran literally. Be thankful

a reply to: Justoneman

Yes.. Israel has to defend themselves by shooting protestors.

Keep drinking israel's lobbyists koolaid.

originally posted by: Secretrooster
Remember when Catholics came to America and forcefully converted Natives? History repeats itself. Christianity is just as dangerous.

Yeah, hundreds of years ago. This is about as good a point as when Obama tried to defend Islam by bringing up the Crusades. First of all, Islam started that conflict. Secondly, so you're defending them by explaining that, as a society, they're where we were 1000 years ago? Or, in your case, a few hundred years ago?

Good job

a reply to: face23785


Sectarian violence is still ongoing today in the UK

if you have ever been to northern Ireland , they have a huge wall dividing people of protestant and catholic faith
surrounded by armed soldiers , 40ft high fence with barb wire

they make it higher every year so they cant fling fire bombs over the wall .


in fact if we don't sort out brexit and the hard border with Ireland because of the back stop , some seriously bad things could happen in Northern Ireland as a result .

sectarianism : police warn of rise of sectarianism in scottish football

sectarianism : still scotlands shame


here are the figures collected by Scottish government on the sectarian violence

religiously aggravated violence


Now , Scotland isnt near as bad as Northern Ireland , so look at the figures there , you will see another story all together .


Another thing to consider which is probably closer to home , is the "good Friday agreement" and how the Brexit , no deal , can affect a hard border with Northern Ireland and Ireland .

This could potentially create both a political and religious divide over Ireland / N. Ireland and the rest of the UK

I mean it was only in 1998 that the last bomb was set off

Northern Ireland - fast facts

However there have been more recent events , carried out by the "new ira"

whether they have links to the IRA themselves is another matter

but bombs have been set off again , amid the tension of brexit and what happens with Northern Ireland
Analysis : Norther Ireland

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Secretrooster
Remember when Catholics came to America and forcefully converted Natives? History repeats itself. Christianity is just as dangerous.

Yeah, hundreds of years ago. This is about as good a point as when Obama tried to defend Islam by bringing up the Crusades. First of all, Islam started that conflict. Secondly, so you're defending them by explaining that, as a society, they're where we were 1000 years ago? Or, in your case, a few hundred years ago?

Good job

I once heard an analogy for comparing religious ages to male human ages, by diving by 100.

You do that, and Judaism is a 40-60 year old, based on your criteria for when it started. He's been around the block, seasoned. He's pretty laid back and doesn't make ripples unless really needed.

Christianity is 20. Old enough to avoid glaring stupidity but still prone to some petty and immature outbursts.

Islam is 13-14. Almost about to hit puberty, still really immature, lashing out when he thinks he is being treated unfairly by the adults.

Queue the "how dare you assume religion's gender" sub-topic.

originally posted by: sapien82

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed
Islam is also incompatible within it's own world not just the west. Random suicide bombings "over there" and war, and abuse run rampant and run amok.
Islam is a cult of death for anyone caught within it.

religion is the cult of death

No, only Islam is, and it isn't a religion, it's only a cult.

Religions do not encourage or condone killing people plain and simple. Cults do that.

Back a ways in history the Catholic religion had within it elements that "turned" cult, went rogue and became zealots who then made their own rules and killed people. But the religion did not do that.

i think all religion is incompatible with any hope of a world at peace.

originally posted by: RoScoLaz5
i think all religion is incompatible with any hope of a world at peace.

The truth is that "People" are incompatible with any hope of world peace.

Blaming religion for the actions of those given free will to choose good or evil is irresponsible.

Those whose actions are contrary to peace are to blame.

originally posted by: solve
a reply to: Scapegrace

Many religions also mutilate manly parts.



No excuses.

Are you saying male circumcision is as bad as FGM? I’ve never heard of any health or sexual performance problems caused by male circumcision, at least the kind done in the First World. I’ve seen horrific documentaries on African boys getting circumcised with a razor blade as a rite of passage into manhood. If that’s what you’re offering as an equivalent to FGM, I agree with you. But as far as I know that’s not done in the USA and is illegal; so is FGM. Just to be clear, you aren’t defending FGM, are you? If you had a daughter, would you subject her to that? Here’s an excerpt from the Wikipedia article on FGM that explains why it’s an abhorrent and unnecessary practice:

“Typically carried out by a traditional circumciser using a blade, FGM is conducted from days after birth to puberty and beyond. In half the countries for which national figures are available, most girls are cut before the age of five. Procedures differ according to the country or ethnic group. They include removal of the clitoral hood and clitoral glans; removal of the inner labia; and removal of the inner and outer labia and closure of the vulva. In this last procedure, known as infibulation, a small hole is left for the passage of urine and menstrual fluid; the vagina is opened for intercourse and opened further for childbirth.

“The practice is rooted in gender inequality, attempts to control women's sexuality, and ideas about purity, modesty and beauty. It is usually initiated and carried out by women, who see it as a source of honour and fear that failing to have their daughters and granddaughters cut will expose the girls to social exclusion. Adverse health effects depend on the type of procedure; they can include recurrent infections, difficulty urinating and passing menstrual flow, chronic pain, the development of cysts, an inability to get pregnant, complications during childbirth, and fatal bleeding. There are no known health benefits.

“There have been international efforts since the 1970s to persuade practitioners to abandon FGM, and it has been outlawed or restricted in most of the countries in which it occurs, although the laws are poorly enforced. Since 2010 the United Nations has called upon healthcare providers to stop performing all forms of the procedure, including reinfibulation after childbirth and symbolic "nicking" of the clitoral hood.”

There's a lot of ignorance about Female Genital Mutilation (FGM), especially from those who seek to play down its impact by likening it to the relatively benign male circumcision.

Not wanting to get into a debate about the rights, wrongs and pointlessness of male circumcision where the foreskin is removed, but in the vast majority of cases the boy is able to function normally into adulthood, with no impairment to their health or sexual function.

Also, it's important to note that FGM is not an Islamic practice per se, as it is more widespread across West, Central and East Africa - from Guinea through to Somalia, and in to the Middle East. It also occurs in places like Indonesia. This means it occurs in both Islamic and non-Islamic.

This UNICEF report 2013 opens in PDF gives details on the distribution and prevalence of FGM.

Here's some ignorance busting

FGM is generally done without anaesthetic. It ranges from the partial or total removal of the clitoris (clitoridectomy), to the removal of the entire clitoris and the cutting of the labia minora (excision), to its most extreme form, the removal of all external genitalia and the stitching together of the two sides of the vulva (infibulation)

a reply to: Scapegrace

I would have to agree with you that male circumcision is done for the reason that all male babies are born with a condition known as phimosis and that is where the skin of the foreskin and the head of the penis are one and over time they separate and form the foreskin and the head of the penis
in some boys the foreskin doesnt grow properly and can become tight and restrictive and actually can cause problems later in life
I know this is one of the main medical reasons why it is necessary for some male children

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Dont they ?

Im pretty sure god in the bible is all about killing people !

that arent the chosen ones !


in any case , religion only represents division !

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

are you religious ?

just curious

originally posted by: AnakinWayneII
"Islam is incompatible with the Western World" - Discuss.

The thread starter title makes no sense. Islam is and always has been part of the western world. If you want other worldly religions then look to east asia or tribal africa. Your title is misleading as the modern western world is based on Abraham and Islam is part of that family. Maybe you meant the Christian world? I'm not defending Islam or pumping it up it's just impossiible to seperate the Abrahamic world into dision as all the three main sub divisions are so intertwined and feed off each other.

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter

originally posted by: AnakinWayneII
"Islam is incompatible with the Western World" - Discuss.

The thread starter title makes no sense. Islam is and always has been part of the western world. If you want other worldly religions then look to east asia or tribal africa. Your title is misleading as the modern western world is based on Abraham and Islam is part of that family. Maybe you meant the Christian world? I'm not defending Islam or pumping it up it's just impossiible to seperate the Abrahamic world into dision as all the three main sub divisions are so intertwined and feed off each other.

Key word there Ben

DIVISION!


If religious people are meant to be tolerant and intelligent , then surely they can see that religion all points to the one , the all ,
then they should realise that no matter what their god is the same so it doesnt matter about the specifics
but they would never admit that !

a reply to: sapien82

There shpuld be no division as all three are part of the book

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

No, only Islam is, and it isn't a religion, it's only a cult.

Religions do not encourage or condone killing people plain and simple. Cults do that.

Back a ways in history the Catholic religion had within it elements that "turned" cult, went rogue and became zealots who then made their own rules and killed people. But the religion did not do that.

Star for a concise answer, simple, to the point, true, real

Zealots are the cancer cells... in the 'as above so below' explanation

* the Catholics one time had the Inquisition where the Vatican itself was Zealot/radical... until the Enlightenment came to be and the reformation ensued...

originally posted by: ufoorbhunter
a reply to: sapien82

There shpuld be no division as all three are part of the book

human minds insert the 'Division'.. because humans cannot decipher the 'Book'; which is basically a 5 dimensional roadmap which humans have not deciphered correctly as Yet

the 'Book' eschatology centers on the repeating Catastrophism cycle with regard to the Sun or 'Sol' and the human remnant that escapes the ELE

a reply to: St Udio

so that book is more real or the only answer as compared to the other holy books from other religious and pantheons of gods which came before monotheism ?

, or have I just misunderstood and that religion is about what it says on the tin , but really just a complex code for us to figure out about cyclical catclysms

right so , if its about saving us , why do we need to decipher it ?

seems a bit counter intuitive , or was it only to save those who are "chosen" or "worthy"