Former Californian Governor Calls Blacks "Monkeys"; President Nixon calls them "bunch of dogs"

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: Liquesence

I'll go ahead and toss out there the simple fact that Reagan is one of a very discrete percentage of Americans who has actually worked with a monkey... somehow I don't think the term carried the same connotations from him as many today view it as.

Elijah cummings.....is that you?

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: lakenheath24
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Didnt hurt India. Same scenario. Whats the diff though?

II don't know *why*, but the British widely educated those who rose to become the ruling class in India. Gandhi, for example, was college educated in a London law school. Britain did not do that where sub-Saharan African subjects were concerned. Truth be told, it probably had a lot to do with the fact that India and North African countries were literate before England entered the picture, with India having a rich history of education via Hindu and Buddhist schools and north Africa being basically the birthplace of writing and civilization. Sub-Saharan Africa had not progressed beyond tribalism and primitive societies prior to Britain and France colonizing it, with a few exceptions being Zanzibar, Mombasa, Axum, and Timbuktu.

Why is that though?

What makes Black Africa (and Black Africans) so different to everyone else and everywhere else in the world?

Some even say that had European companies and empires not even set foot on the continent or made contact centuries ago, the Black African population would probably be way, way more less - probably to the point of being "endangered" like Australian aborigines. Population explosions were seen following repeated contact with pale folks "from the North" (i.e. pesky "Europeans").

Even before that, there was contact with Arabian folks from the east - but not to the point of repeated contact with "European" folks...

Even the Romans had limited contact and there were no population explosions like we saw with the arrival of "Europeans" centuries later...

This is all very sad because SSA will always be several hundreds of years BEHIND - unless...unless of course something drastic is done (like a "GWF" - Great Whiz Forward)...

I think that's what SSA really needs right now - before it's too late. SSA needs a Great Whiz Forward.

originally posted by: Liquesence

originally posted by: burdman30ott6

originally posted by: Liquesence
a reply to: burdman30ott6

Was his underlying point wrong and was the way he said it even considered "racist" in the 70s?

Underlying point aside, referring to blacks as "monkeys" is pretty racist, even in the 70s.

In fairness, we're talking about 1971, so I should have said beginning of the 70s. When you consider that the infamous "Banned Dozen" cartoons from Warner Brothers and Disney weren't withheld from syndication until 1969, and watch one of them today, it's pretty damn obvious that we live in an entirely different world. By today's considerations, what Reagan said would have gotten him in a lot of hot water. I'll accept that, despite personally not finding it racist. In 1971 though, I don't think so... You're talking a bout a time when N-bombs were dropped across the spectrum of speakers with little to no thought towards possible future repercussions. In other words, had he intended to be racist about it, he could have easily picked something a lot more offensive by today's standards and openly said such.

ETA: This is intended for your following post, not the one I quoted. Sorry.

Whether WB had previous cartoons or not is not the point (there was a lot of racist # back then in popular culture). Did they consider it racist then? Whites probably didn't. But was it? Essentially, yes. I know that is your point, but if you called a black person a monkey—even then—that is racist, just like calling a slave a monkey or a dog was (didn't MLK address as such?). I'm willing to bet that if anyone, in 1970, addressed black people as monkeys, they would find it offensive. But I could be wrong.

As far as n*gger is concerned, that is different. That was common vernacular, even among blacks for themselves, for decades and at least a century before. So, yes, things change.

That is the point: calling black people monkeys is racist, it doesn't really matter how it is viewed at the time. I think a lot of black folk would agree, even those alive at the time.

My post will be controversial...but...here goes:

Why is it considered "racist"?

Most black folks don't even resemble "monkeys".

In fact, when George Bush was criticised for his lack of interest in Hurricane Katrina, some folks called him "a cross between a koala and a chimp" and "a bloody Chimp". President Bush is a white male. If President Bush had been black, suddenly it would have been racist to call him "a chimp". (And let's be honest, Dubya does look a bit like a chimp; in fact, with all due respect to his late father, the other President Bush, Daddy Bush looked more and more like a Great Ape in his later years - and the Bushes are white folk, are they not? Texan natives, no?)

There are several folks across many different races who look "a little" like some animals in the animal kingdom. This isn't limited to a specific "race".

In fact, Indians (who aren't Black African) were labelled by new British imperial arrivals as "dogs" because they openly defecated in public a few centuries ago (some still do today).

In fact, I submit that those who think calling black folks "monkeys" are in fact racist themselves.

originally posted by: Liquesence
a reply to: burdman30ott6

He referred to black Africans as monkeys. Pretty sure it carried the same or similar connotation, because blacks and slaves have been compared to—as seen as, by some—sub-human, and akin to animals, for a very long time.

Chinese folk were once called "monkeys" as well. Indians were referred to as "dogs" by new British imperial arrives a few centuries ago - because of many openly defecating in public. Even some from South East Asian regions were ridiculed for their "funny sounding languages" (most recently, the hilarious sounding language of the Martians in the movie "Mars Attack" is a tongue-in-cheek insult to some folks from that same SEA region)

You got like 5 stars but if you were posting about how "white people can't jump" the audacity, you would have gotten 100 stars and outrage by the non snowflake, non politically correct crowd around here. SMH we all know they don't get offended or outraged LMAO!!!!

Yeah, that's bad.

That being said, you're talking about two men who were roughly 60 years old in 1971. These two had both lived a third of their lives by the time WW2 ended. They're a product of their time.

originally posted by: Lumenari

My grandmother uses language that would get her banned from social media, yet has no ill-will towards any race.

It's just a different time now in the PC world that we live in.

And if you want to see racism in action, sit around a campfire with a bunch of full-blood Cherokee and listen in.

I don't really know a Hispanic (we have more than a few in the family) that doesn't dislike blacks.

The list could go on.... it really isn't "whitey" that has the market cornered on racism at all.

People routinely use animals as slang terms to compare an action, as example, you all live like pigs..this is what moms use to say. We see terms such as sheep, dogs, chicken. cows and even monkeys used in this way too. When I listen to the tape to me it seems that Reagan was not happy that extremely underdeveloped countries have equal voting power.


Today, everyone scream RACIST and I would say in 99% of the time that is not the case at all.

a reply to: AnakinWayneII

I just heard about this and prepared an OP on it but you already have.


Newly released audio recording of Ronald Reagan… Racist bigotry
The National Archives has released a recording between Nixon and Reagan, who was then the GOP governor of California, earlier this month. Nixon, dogged by the Watergate scandal, resigned the presidency in disgrace in 1974. Reagan went on to serve two terms as president in the 1980s.

“To see those, those monkeys from those African countries. Damn them, they’re still uncomfortable wearing shoes,” Reagan told Nixon, reportedly in reference to members of the Tanzanian delegation dancing in the United Nations’ General Assembly following its vote to recognize the People’s Republic of China.

Ronald Reagan, Republican heart throb in the 1970s and 1980s has been, by his own voice recorded in a phone call to then Republican president Richard Nixon, has been outed as a racist.
Long a Conservative icon, Mr. Reagan pushed conservative political and economic theories in his 16 years of political leadership, 8 as governor of California and 8 more as president of the United States.
Mr. Reagan had as one of his closest advisors, his wife, Nancy. Mrs. Reagan consulted a well known astrologer for advice which she then used to advise the president.
www.latimes.com...
Mr. Reagan was a strong proponent of ‘trickle down’’ economics while in his terms of office deregulated restrictions on major corporations which have aided in the development of the major corporate conglomerates we see around us today.
As well, Mr. Reagan, according to some, including his son Ron, suffered from alzhimers desease before he finished his presidency.

Ron Reagan describes his growing sense of alarm over his father's mental condition, beginning as early as three years into his first term. He recalls the presidential debate with Walter Mondale on 7 October 1984.

www.theguardian.com...
Throughout his presidency and for long after, Mr. Reagan had been defended as the greatest Republican president of the twentieth century. Advised by astrologers, suffering from Alzheimer’s and now an outed racist.
Great going America.

And the guy is deceased. I guess I'm not seeing the point of dragging him around after his demise, other than finding an easy way to bash those "mean old Republicans"...

originally posted by: BigOldCaddy
And the guy is deceased. I guess I'm not seeing the point of dragging him around after his demise, other than finding an easy way to bash those "mean old Republicans"...

He's the central figurehead of the modern Republican movement. His poll numbers would consider him the most popular Republican president of the modern era, if not the most popular president from either party in the modern era. They're trying to dismember a legacy and an icon because, hey, that's what these fools do. It's all about tearing it down, statues, flags, borders, legacies, icons, traditional institutions, traditions, values... anything looked back on by the majority with pride and respect must be torn asunder and repainted garishly.

Exactly what I was implying, in a round about fashion. a reply to: burdman30ott6