Do those who believe the Authorized Version 1611 only guilty of Idol worship?

a he the one I use is corrected.

a reply to: Lazarus Short

the Apocrypha is not inspired. Please read it. It lacks the life the rest of the scriptures have. Any honest person see that when they read it. Plus you must remember they also add a whole 6 verses to the end of Esther, so they could add a deity to the book.

a reply to: Lazarus Short

Just so you know, Seede, I do not agree with any of what you say above.

Just so you know, Seede, I do not agree with any of what you say above. First, "Hell" is an English word, not a Greek one. The Greeks had Hades, and it carried a lot of pagan baggage, but then, so does Hell.

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In the New Testament, whenever the word hell was used to describe the underground location where people who have rejected God are tormented forever by fire, the gnashing of teeth of beasts, and the poison of serpents, a different Greek word was used. This word was the word Hades. Hades is the New Testament Greek word for the Old Testament Hebrew word Sheol. We know this because Peter used the word in Acts 2:27 when quoting from Psalms 16:10 which uses Sheol when referring to Hell: “Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell (Hades), neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.” (See also Matthew 12:40; Ephesians 4:9-10, and Philippians 2:9-10 with references to Christ being in hell located in the center of the earth)
Unquote source --

www.whatchristianswanttoknow.com...

We were dealing with translation from the Greek MSS to English literature and not from the Greek to Hebrew to English.

The Greek hades is translated “hell” ten times in the KJV. Most recent versions transliterate the term, bringing it directly into English as Hades. The Greek MSS is translated to hell and transliterated as hades. Hades is not a translation but a transliteration. I stand by the KJV.

Second, I see death as a separation of body and Spirit. The body returns to dust and the Spirit returns to God Who gave It. Inventing Hell and Hades adds nothing but confusion.

I do not understand you saying that the NT word hell is invented. If it was invented that implies that it is a figment of some ones imagination. That would mean to me that all versions of the NT were not true regardless of the hundreds of translators that have translated the same MSS. May I ask what version of the bible do you embrace?

The spirit does indeed return to God but probably not as you imagine. The spirits of all people are still conscious entities even in death. The spirit /mind is conscious and still suffers and enjoys existence through the four senses of which it had in the body. Only the justified spirits will resurrect and receive a new celestial body.
1Corinthians 15:44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

Third, if God vaporizes the Cosmos and all that is in it, including the wicked dead, they are still dead. If so, how does God ever become All in all? I have been waiting for years now for a decent answer.

There are two trains of theology in the NT. As Jesus came upon the scene the average Jew had been born and raised in total ignorance as a Hellenist and his/her only religious knowledge came from the Sadducee’s. Torah was both spoken in Greek and written in Greek and very few Jews spoke in Hebrew/Aramaic. The average Jew was taught the doctrine of one general resurrection of the dead where both body and spirit are once again united, judged and continue a terrestrial life.

The doctrines of Jesus had never been introduced to the Jews till Jesus began His ministry. The Apostles and disciples of Jesus are included. They had never been taught this doctrine of two resurrections and the gathering of spirits from Sheol into the celestial realm of God to live in a new heaven and new earth. They had never been taught that the dead could ever be given a new celestial body and live forever in a celestial New Jerusalem.

The average Jew knew nothing of a destruction of this universe. The NT is filled with these two doctrines and when read with understanding must be divided as to which doctrines you are reading. The Apostles of Jesus were constantly taught and corrected in their understanding both while Jesus was alive and after His death.

You are not considering that as the universe is vaporized and all that is in the universe is vaporized there is nothing left of the human race to be vaporized. All people are now dead, judged, and resurrected or in the lake of fire. The terrestrial creation is now gone forever. From this point onward the saved souls of the human race are in their new body and living in the celestial city of New Jerusalem. This is when Jesus has completed His purpose as the man Jesus. The unsaved are not in Sheol. They also have been removed from Sheol/Hell and are cast into a land of desolation. Where that is we are not told but it is not this universe.

1Corinthians 15:24 -27
(24) Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. ---- [Note - Kingdom here means the Kingdom Of Heaven]
(25) For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
(26) The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.


(27) For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him.
(28) And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

I believe all that I have said can be verified in the KJV bible and by reading Isaiah 65:17-25---- Isaiah 66:22-24 ---- Revelation 22:1-21 – this will show the doctrine of Jesus.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Lazarus Short

the Apocrypha is not inspired. Please read it. It lacks the life the rest of the scriptures have. Any honest person see that when they read it. Plus you must remember they also add a whole 6 verses to the end of Esther, so they could add a deity to the book.

Once again, thank you for dealing with only the first and easy-to-answer point. You are surely a genius.

The 1611 KJV bible did have the Apocrypha and it was placed in the bible between Malachi and Matthew. It was removed from the future KJV bibles by the printers and not by any committee decree. The reason for its removal was more money for the printers and less usage from those who purchased bibles. The Jewish patrons of the OT rejected the Apocrypha altogether and the protestant patron had lost interest in using the Apocrypha. This led the printers in removing it altogether in most of their printings. It was not because of the KJV bible committee.

a reply to: Lazarus Short
The OT Apocrypha was never accepted by the Jews and the NT Apocrypha as well as the OT Apocrypha was not accepted by, and I will use your cliche, "the majority of Christian Scholars", you can't say you trust the scholars in one place and deny them in another.


The Apocrypha can by some be said to be extra biblical but not be included in the biblical Canon

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Lazarus Short
The OT Apocrypha was never accepted by the Jews and the NT Apocrypha as well as the OT Apocrypha was not accepted by, and I will use your cliche, "the majority of Christian Scholars", you can't say you trust the scholars in one place and deny them in another.


The Apocrypha can by some be said to be extra biblical but not be included in the biblical Canon

Actually, I can say that the scholars can be trusted in one place and not another - it depends on the issue and what they say about that issue. I will say this: you really can't expect them to deviate from orthodoxy when that orthodoxy provides them with their paycheck.

FYI, I have cooled considerably on non-Biblical texts (like the Book of Jasher) after reading them. They really are a few notches down...